Couple of Sad stories

**ArtyEngineer** · 12 Jan 12,, 06:39

First we have the recent graduate of BUDS who pick up a girl, takes her home and trying to impress shoots himsefl in the head!!!!!

Navy SEAL, 22, accidentally shoots himself in the head - New York Daily News

Next we have two NCO's playing some game called "Fast Draw" and one manages to kill the other!!!

U.S. News - Questions linger in US soldier's death: Was it a game?

Now our modern age of facebook and twitter and instant mass communication makes stories like these spread like wildfire. My question to our more senoir veterans is "Did things like this happen back in teh 80" and 90's, or is this type of jack assery a modern phenomenon?"

My gut says it happened just as often in years gone by.

Regards

Arty

**bigross86** · 12 Jan 12,, 08:20

Of course it happened also before. Human beings are morons. Give some morons weapons, and you'll see people get hurt.

Hell, we've got a story in the IDF from maybe 25-30 years ago when some soldiers were playing with a LAW, even though they had no idea what they were doing. The one soldier opened the tube (arming and prepping the weapon), and when he tried to close it, it wouldn't close. So what does he do? He pushes it against his belly and tries to force it to shut, in the process pulling the trigger and suddenly he doesn't realize why there's a LAW missile sticking through his belly.

The medevac crew started treatment and got him to the hospital with a live LAW rocket sticking through his belly. Hairy, to say the least

**USSWisconsin** · 12 Jan 12,, 08:25

The guy who shot his roomate needs to be punished, IMO. A Sgt. who doesn't know his gun is loaded? BS. He doesn't belong in the military either.

**Doktor** · 12 Jan 12,, 08:51

Originally Posted by bigross86

Of course it happened also before. Human beings are morons. Give some morons weapons, and you'll see people get hurt.

Hell, we've got a story in the IDF from maybe 25-30 years ago when some soldiers were playing with a LAW, even though they had no idea what they were doing. The one soldier opened the tube (arming and prepping the weapon), and when he tried to close it, it wouldn't close. So what does he do? He pushes it against his belly and tries to force it to shut, in the process pulling the trigger and suddenly he doesn't realize why there's a LAW missile sticking through his belly.

The medevac crew started treatment and got him to the hospital with a live LAW rocket sticking through his belly. Hairy, to say the least

They should have sent him to the bomb squad first

**dave lukins** · 12 Jan 12,, 09:54

Originally Posted by ArtyEngineer

First we have the recent graduate of BUDS who pick up a girl, takes her home and trying to impress shoots himsefl in the head!!!!!

Navy SEAL, 22, accidentally shoots himself in the head - New York Daily News

Next we have two NCO's playing some game called "Fast Draw" and one manages to kill the other!!!

U.S. News - Questions linger in US soldier's death: Was it a game?

Now our modern age of facebook and twitter and instant mass communication makes stories like these spread like wildfire. My question to our more senoir veterans is "Did things like this happen back in teh 80" and 90's, or is this type of jack assery a modern phenomenon?"

My gut says it happened just as often in years gone by.

Regards

Arty

It happened in NI in 1972 where one of our dog handlers thought he was Wyatt Earp and decided to show how fast he could draw his pistol. It painfully went wrong and he may have a limp to this day. So we had idiots even in the 'old' days

**zraver** · 12 Jan 12,, 15:17

92-93ish.... an LT used his (then) brandnew GPS instead of a map at NTC and ran a scout platoon off the top of Colorado Wadi.

91 1/41 infantry in Iraq was using an M88 to scrap up dud fragmentation clusters from cluster bombs, a guy picked one up the 88 had missed walked over tossed it on the pile and blew himself apart.

**Blue** · 12 Jan 12,, 15:45

Originally Posted by ArtyEngineer

My question to our more senoir veterans is "Did things like this happen back in teh 80" and 90's, or is this type of jack assery a modern phenomenon?"

My gut says it happened just as often in years gone by.

Regards

Arty

Jack-Assery is as timeless as the human race. We have been perfecting it for years now and it has taken a leap, IMO, along with technology the last few decades. And yes. While serving I saw one guy shoot himself in the head playing RR, and plenty of stupidity. Matter of fact, I think statistics reflect more peacetime casualties since VN in all branches. I posted them once and found that the Army lost more in 1986 than they did during any recent year of conflict.

**Tanker** · 12 Jan 12,, 16:53

Originally Posted by ArtyEngineer

First we have the recent graduate of BUDS who pick up a girl, takes her home and trying to impress shoots himsefl in the head!!!!!

Navy SEAL, 22, accidentally shoots himself in the head - New York Daily News

Next we have two NCO's playing some game called "Fast Draw" and one manages to kill the other!!!

U.S. News - Questions linger in US soldier's death: Was it a game?

Now our modern age of facebook and twitter and instant mass communication makes stories like these spread like wildfire. My question to our more senoir veterans is "Did things like this happen back in teh 80" and 90's, or is this type of jack assery a modern phenomenon?"

My gut says it happened just as often in years gone by.

Regards

Arty

Oh yeah. Had a guy shoot his finger off with a blank. Had a guy destroy 1/2 his hand with a training grenade. Had a guy injure another when he walked up and jokingly pulled the string on his grenade simulator while it was in a grenade pouch. One guy injured another with a LAW Miles simulator round by attaching it to a battery and tossing it in the back of an M113....and so on.

**Doktor** · 12 Jan 12,, 18:12

Originally Posted by 7thsfsniper

Jack-Assery is as timeless as the human race. We have been perfecting it for years now and it has taken a leap, IMO, along with technology the last few decades. And yes. While serving I saw one guy shoot himself in the head playing RR, and plenty of stupidity. Matter of fact, I think statistics reflect more peacetime casualties since VN in all branches. I posted them once and found that the Army lost more in 1986 than they did during any recent year of conflict.

[rant]
So by excursions here and there US military actually saves soldiers lives

[/rant]

**zraver** · 12 Jan 12,, 18:56

Originally Posted by Doktor

[rant]
So by excursions here and there US military actually saves soldiers lives

[/rant]

The National Training Center (NTC) in the 80's through the mid 90's when I got out killed multiple people almost every rotation. You fight the way you train so the army decided to train the way they wanted to fight. The result was Operation Desert Storm which was really a giant graduation exercise for the ALB Concept.

**Blue** · 12 Jan 12,, 21:52

Originally Posted by Doktor

[rant]
So by excursions here and there US military actually saves soldiers lives

[/rant]

Interesting......

**lemontree** · 13 Jan 12,, 04:36

We can blame officers/soldiers for being careless or negligent, but when equipment fails, it is even more tragic. We have had 81 mm mortars, 84 mm Carl Gustav's and 106 mm RCLs blowing up, wiping out the entire training crews.

**dave lukins** · 13 Jan 12,, 11:44

Originally Posted by lemontree

We can blame officers/soldiers for being careless or negligent, but when equipment fails, it is even more tragic. We have had 81 mm mortars, 84 mm Carl Gustav's and 106 mm RCLs blowing up, wiping out the entire training crews.

Indeed that is tragic. Was it down to metal fatigue or bad/old ammunition?

**lemontree** · 17 Jan 12,, 04:11

Originally Posted by dave lukins

Indeed that is tragic. Was it down to metal fatigue or bad/old ammunition?

Mostly bad ammo...there was one case where an 81 mm mor overheated during the summer and killed 3 student officers in infantry school.

**Officer of Engineers** · 17 Jan 12,, 05:16

Originally Posted by lemontree

Mostly bad ammo...there was one case where an 81 mm mor overheated during the summer and killed 3 student officers in infantry school.

Captain,

I do not mean to add insult to injury ... but should not the Quarter Master have known that? Yes, I know, our British heritage means we blame everything on the QM but come on, lifespan is the QM's responsibility.