Females in combat units

**Officer of Engineers** · 29 Jan 08,, 17:13

An old debate that has been hashed and rehashed to death here

http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/lan...bat-units.html
http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/wes...es-combat.html
http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/war...at-fact-3.html
http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/wes...ion-earth.html

-{SpoonmaN}- · 29 Jan 08,, 18:53

I agree with OOE, the issue has been done to death. If you're going to revive overdone topics, why not start a new Indo-Pakistani flame-war, or better yet, post some photoshopped pictures of a J-10, with claims it can do warp 5, turn invisible and shoot proton torpedoes onto American Raptors from 3000km away. For maximum effect, claim to be a student who only wants to live in peace.

More to the point, female soldiers, are, as I understand it, finding ample opportunity to get shot at if they so desire.

**Stan187** · 30 Jan 08,, 00:34

Originally Posted by ShawnG

Not saying I believe females want to shower 3 times a day and shave their legs... not at all... but simply for hygenic and medical reasons, it's unsanitary and unsafe for them. Females require different things than males. Is that untrue?

I would not spend a minute in trench with a woman who did not have her legs clean shaven, I'll say that now. Today's stubble is tomorrow's persian rug.

**Officer of Engineers** · 30 Jan 08,, 00:57

Having spent days in a trench, believe me, you won't be any Prince Charming either.

**BadKharma** · 30 Jan 08,, 00:59

Although I do not believe combat arms should be for woman several countries have used woman effectively in combat roles. Israel and Russia come to mind.

**Repatriated Canuck** · 30 Jan 08,, 04:19

Originally Posted by -{SpoonmaN}-

For maximum effect, claim to be a student who only wants to live in peace.

The last sentence is the one that got me busted at work. I could not stop the laugh. :(

**Officer of Engineers** · 30 Jan 08,, 04:59

Need to add one more old thread. Damned, there is a hell of alot of experience talking

http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/wes...es-combat.html

**reasonmclucus** · 30 Jan 08,, 06:36

As I recall the Viet Cong had a lot of success with female sappers. I have doubts about women in combat because I'm not sure that men can view them as just other soldiers. I'm acquainted with some of the local women law enforcement officers who I have a lot of confidence in.

**tankie** · 30 Jan 08,, 12:01

Welcome to equality street ladies ,, now then Pvt Funnyfanny , go burn your Bra on the parade ground in front of the men to prove you are as good as they are .

**~~SnowLeopard~~** · 30 Jan 08,, 12:45

Just remember though, it goes both ways.

Ie, in a fly by wire system, with a pilot who is lighter, smaller, and yet has a better circulation system to handle high G loads, why not eliminate the bigger ones from the selection entirely?

After all, think about it. Smaller cockpit, less need in that area, and more space could be dedicated to fuel and weapons.

After all, in a similar way, it is what the Japanese did with the Type 61 in building a tank for the statue of their people.

In the same way that men like to say women are unsuitable for infantry, they may find that they talk themselves right out of the cockpit.
________________________________________
("Captain, if a Romulan vessel ventured far into Federation territory without good explanation, what would a star base commander do?" And when Kirk chokes on the standard response, "You see ... it works both ways."--Romulian Commander, (wtte), ST:TOS "The Enterprise Incident")

-{SpoonmaN}- · 31 Jan 08,, 18:15

Originally Posted by Expat Canuck

The last sentence is the one that got me busted at work. I could not stop the laugh. :(

Don't blame me, blame the CCP for pumping these guys full of nationalist propaganda so that they don't take their negative energy out on corrupt officials.

**Capt Bluesman** · 04 Feb 08,, 02:52

Originally Posted by ShawnG

I'm no OB/GYN practicing my love with women across america (HAHA.. tribute to good 'ol Mr. President)... I would think there is also the issue of personal hygiene. A female probably wouldn't be able to get away with being an a field environment for weeks/months at a time (especially in the desert) without ready access to a shower facility or hygiene station. Not saying I believe females want to shower 3 times a day and shave their legs... not at all... but simply for hygenic and medical reasons, it's unsanitary and unsafe for them. Females require different things than males. Is that untrue?

I hate hate HATE this argument. Okay, this is what women need, relative to men re: hygiene needs. A supply of something absorbable once a month. That's it. And maybe not even that, there are medications a woman can take that will suspend her menstruation for as long as she wishes, that many women do take when they are going to the AOR.

Oh, and by the way, the biggest reason troops are rendered unfit for combat? Sports injuries. Who gets those more? Men. Troops are far more likely to be sent home because they were playing football behind the tent than because they got some sort of "female problem".

**ShawnG** · 04 Feb 08,, 13:40

I hate hate HATE this argument. Okay, this is what women need, relative to men re: hygiene needs. A supply of something absorbable once a month. That's it. And maybe not even that, there are medications a woman can take that will suspend her menstruation for as long as she wishes, that many women do take when they are going to the AOR.

I wasn't refering to the "female problem" at all. I know there are medications that can be taken to suspend it. I'm just saying that perhaps a week or more in the field kicking in doors as an Infantrywoman, without shower or access to hygene stations, it's possible for dangerous infections to develop. But it was more of a question, and I apologize if I didn't phrase it as such and offended you or anyone. I'd accept the argument of females being allowed in combat arms if and only if the Physical Fitness standards were the same across the board for males and females (for those MOS's only.) Just for obvious reasons.

Oh, and by the way, the biggest reason troops are rendered unfit for combat? Sports injuries. Who gets those more? Men. Troops are far more likely to be sent home because they were playing football behind the tent than because they got some sort of "female problem".

I spent a couple years working the MOS Medical Retention Boards and actually more people were sent home for being shot or blown up by IED's than sports injuries in my experience of 24 months in a combat zone (there were some minor of course.) Maybe in the rear, unless you're stationed in Kuwait; were stationed in the defunct Karshi-Khanabad, Uzbekistan; or in Kosovo/Bosnia. But then again, it's okay if you're unfit for combat in those places because you aren't in it. & point taken about the "female problem." I was just refering to females being more vulnerable to UTI's than a male, and yeast infections, etc. because of non-availability of decent hygiene stations.

**Capt Bluesman** · 04 Feb 08,, 18:11

Originally Posted by ShawnG

I wasn't refering to the "female problem" at all. I know there are medications that can be taken to suspend it. I'm just saying that perhaps a week or more in the field kicking in doors as an Infantrywoman, without shower or access to hygene stations, it's possible for dangerous infections to develop.

I spent a couple years working the MOS Medical Retention Boards and actually more people were sent home for being shot or blown up by IED's than sports injuries in my experience of 24 months in a combat zone (there were some minor of course.) Maybe in the rear, unless you're stationed in Kuwait; were stationed in the defunct Karshi-Khanabad, Uzbekistan; or in Kosovo/Bosnia. But then again, it's okay if you're unfit for combat in those places because you aren't in it. & point taken about the "female problem." I was just refering to females being more vulnerable to UTI's than a male, and yeast infections, etc. because of non-availability of decent hygiene stations.

Any competent adult female is capable of performing the basic hygiene that will help prevent "dangerous infections". Really, one daily swipe with a wet wipe, or moistened toilet paper and you're there. It's not substantially different from the hygiene that males require now and again.

And you're right, I was referring to the "non-combat injuries" category. I should have specified. I, also, spent two years working with people who needed, or were in the midst of having, medical boards.

**Stan187** · 04 Feb 08,, 22:33

You know, people weren't always as clean as we have been in the 20th and 21st century. People often did not bathe for weeks before. I'd be surprised if the majority of women a coupla hundred years ago were all developing dangerous, life threatening yeast infections, even living in squalor. I'm welcome to being proved wrong, it just intuitively doesn't add up.