Thread: Band Of Sisters - Army "Lionesses" Hit Streets With marines In Combat

I'm still trying to figure you out sniper. You have never met nor seen me and yet you are trying to argue why I am unable to perform my job because of my gender. You know nothing about how I performed in my entrance test's and you have no idea on how I perform compared to my male counterparts. You say that I can only perform my job because I have a badge and yet you leave out the fact that half the people I arrest are either desperate and fighting for their lives to get away or on some sort of drug and cannot feel pain and are in an almost animal state. Then you go on to say "go meet some macho man in a dark alley when your off duty and see what happens". This just shows your ignorance because what do you think happens when an officer is in plain clothes.

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici

I'm still trying to figure you out sniper.

He's just jealous because he knows he's the one who'd be wearing the cuffs in the relationship.



On that note, I still feel it's inappropriate to have women in integrated units and anywhere near potential combat. The complexities of male/female social interaction are demonstrated by the problems at US military academies and in the active service itself. Granted, they may be the exception and not the rule, but there's too much of turning a blind eye and non-enforcement of the regulations service personel are required to follow. Breach of conduct needs to result in serious and humiliating punishment and removal to deter future misbehavior. As to women in combat, we as a society, both military and civilian, need to be honest and open about the issues of women being captured, raped, and subject to other abuses. I feel we are instead searching for excuses and panaceas rather than accepting, confronting, and dealing with the real issues behind the emergent problems.

Originally Posted by Horrido

He's just jealous because he knows he's the one who'd be wearing the cuffs in the relationship.



On that note, I still feel it's inappropriate to have women in integrated units and anywhere near potential combat. The complexities of male/female social interaction are demonstrated by the problems at US military academies and in the active service itself. Granted, they may be the exception and not the rule, but there's too much of turning a blind eye and non-enforcement of the regulations service personel are required to follow. Breach of conduct needs to result in serious and humiliating punishment and removal to deter future misbehavior. As to women in combat, we as a society, both military and civilian, need to be honest and open about the issues of women being captured, raped, and subject to other abuses. I feel we are instead searching for excuses and panaceas rather than accepting, confronting, and dealing with the real issues behind the emergent problems.

Well on this I suppose we shall have to simply agree to disagree.

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici

I'm still trying to figure you out sniper. You have never met nor seen me and yet you are trying to argue why I am unable to perform my job because of my gender. You know nothing about how I performed in my entrance test's and you have no idea on how I perform compared to my male counterparts. You say that I can only perform my job because I have a badge and yet you leave out the fact that half the people I arrest are either desperate and fighting for their lives to get away or on some sort of drug and cannot feel pain and are in an almost animal state. Then you go on to say "go meet some macho man in a dark alley when your off duty and see what happens". This just shows your ignorance because what do you think happens when an officer is in plain clothes.

It is very hard to become a cop in today's world (in the Suffolk County Law Enforcememt Academy, 66% fail the physical fitness part), so the odds are she passed the academy ok. Out of every 10 people that apply for Deputy Sheriff I with the SCSO or Police Officer with the SCPD something like 9 out of 10 for some reason fail or drop out. The standards cant be that much different down in Florida. Veni, out of curiosity and an intrest in law enforcement, what force do you work for? You may PM me if you wish for privacy reasons.

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici

Well on this I suppose we shall have to simply agree to disagree.

It's not an issue of agreement or disagreement, I've simply stated my opinion and the practical reasons behind that opinion. It's an issue of a stated problem, and to what extent society is willing to solve, mitigate, or accept that problem. I'm not and have never been in the military. Since being in the military is voluntary, I view it as their problem to deal with, both individually and as an organization, and over time my sympathy has become much reduced.

"It is very hard to become a cop in today's world (in the Suffolk County Law Enforcememt Academy, 66% fail the physical fitness part), so the odds are she passed the academy ok. Out of every 10 people that apply for Deputy Sheriff I with the SCSO or Police Officer with the SCPD something like 9 out of 10 for some reason fail or drop out. The standards cant be that much different down in Florida. Veni, out of curiosity and an intrest in law enforcement, what force do you work for? You may PM me if you wish for privacy reasons."

Not in Philly it's not. It's a joke. That goes for all the surrounding suburban dept's as well.

Stateys have a more difficult program, and ironically enough, there are very few female Pa state troopers.

Go figure...

Originally Posted by M21Sniper

"It is very hard to become a cop in today's world (in the Suffolk County Law Enforcememt Academy, 66% fail the physical fitness part), so the odds are she passed the academy ok. Out of every 10 people that apply for Deputy Sheriff I with the SCSO or Police Officer with the SCPD something like 9 out of 10 for some reason fail or drop out. The standards cant be that much different down in Florida. Veni, out of curiosity and an intrest in law enforcement, what force do you work for? You may PM me if you wish for privacy reasons."

Not in Philly it's not. It's a joke. That goes for all the surrounding suburban dept's as well.

Stateys have a more difficult program, and ironically enough, there are very few female Pa state troopers.

Go figure...

Major city police (and in rare cases where they do exist; city sheriff's) forces tend to be less well trained and have lower training levels because of the need for increased manpower. NYPD requirements are pretty lax as well. I dont know about in PA but here on Long Island, state troopers only do highway patrol work on the state parkways, upstate they do regular police work along with the sheriff's and police depts, so posisibly its not a very well known force, I know people who dident even know theres a New York State Police ...

"I'm still trying to figure you out sniper."

So am i.

"You have never met nor seen me and yet you are trying to argue why I am unable to perform my job because of my gender."

I am 'arguing' against your gender as a whole, not you. If you were to go back and re-read my posts i clearly- and on several occasions- stated that there are woman that are exceptions, but that they're few and far between.

"You know nothing about how I performed in my entrance test's and you have no idea on how I perform compared to my male counterparts."

Since it's a well established fact that departments nationwide(as well as all the military branches) dropped their physical requirements to admit women, this is not very relevant.

For instance, prior to the admission of women a PPD officer had to be 5'10" and 180lbs.

Would you qualify for that? Probably not(and neither would i for that matter).

"You say that I can only perform my job because I have a badge and yet you leave out the fact that half the people I arrest are either desperate and fighting for their lives to get away or on some sort of drug and cannot feel pain and are in an almost animal state."

Simply put, i don't believe 99% of women could handle a man that wanted to hurt her, period. That includes you having a night stick and the perp being unarmed.

Further, if you are stating that you are capable of single-handedly subduing and arresting a drugged out felon with violent criminal intent on his mind by yourself, i flat out DO NOT believe you. I've seen perps in that mental state take on 10 cops at once before. I've helped cops in Philly to subdue those sorts of perps on a few occasions when my partner and i happened upon them by chance.
These are the same people that can take up to a dozen hits from rifle fire and keep coming....but you want me to believe you can take them on alone?

Please....sell that somewhere else.


"Then you go on to say "go meet some macho man in a dark alley when your off duty and see what happens". This just shows your ignorance because what do you think happens when an officer is in plain clothes."

I think you produce your badge, scream "Police", and 95% of all people just surrender or run. My father was a plain clothes PPD narcotics officer for 11 years, and my former repo partner is now a PPD officer. I have some frame of reference here miss...not the least of which is growing up in a ghetto and working in them every night.

When i was a kid i saw a 13yo black kid beat the living snot out of a PPD cop woman with her own nightstick(which he snatched right out of her hand) after she ran her mouth at him like a 'tough girl' without backup present.

I'm 5'8", 150lbs, and i can say with absolute confidence that if 99% of the women in the world tried to get in my way when i was serious about doing something it would be very bad for them.

There's a reason they don't have the ladies do HTH training with the men in the military. It's because the military doesn't want the woman's confidence shattered by having their ass wiped all over the Pugil pit.

On the few occasions that i saw a girl and a guy face off in the pit it was over very quickly, usually one the first move, never later than the third.

Cops have a gun, pepper spray and a stick- and most importantly- a badge of authority, hence i have very few problems with the concept of female cops(though for my part i'd rather have a man taking my back any day).

Soldiers are another issue entirely, as are the myriad discipline and social issues that go along with mixing a bunch of 18yo kids o f both sexes together in situaitons of intense stress interspersed with extended periods of abject boredom and loneliness.

My problem with YOU specifically is that you talk a lot of cocky smack. People that talk tough are the ones that feel in their heart they've the most to prove....most of all to themselves.

I've worked with female soldiers in the military, instructed them on the range, and i have come to the conclusion that the Army would instantly become a superior force if 95% of them were immediately booted out on their kiesters.

You'll get no hand-holding PC feel good nonsense from this ex NCO, aint ever going to happen.

Snipes rules for women in the military:

All recruits will perform to the same PT and physical standards(and the previous mens standards will NOT be lowered).

All recruits will wear their hair the same- above the eyebrow, off the ears, and not below the collar in the rear.

No makeup shall be permitted.

All fingernails will be kept short and well groomed. No nail polish shall be worn by any soldier.

Any soldier caught fraternizing with a soldier of the opposite sex in their unit shall immediately be discharged.

Any female soldier that becomes pregnant shall immediately be discharged.

All gender specific uniform garments shall immediately be replaced with unisex uniforms.

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You want to serve ladies? Serve with equality then. These rules are 100% fair, and will weed out ALL non-hackers over night.

Just for the record, Horrido informs me that i'm not even 5'8", lol.

He claims 5'6", but i think he's nuts. LOL

Originally Posted by Lunatock

Cyber-stalking OOE might lead to more kills. What with his accidental troll baiting.

Horrido's kill, though I (and maybe Snipe) will kick him now that's he's down.

Sorry guys, didn't he know he was that sensitive about being in the wrong.

Wow. I missed all the drama, I guess.

Good riddance to bad news. Won't miss him a bit.

Anyway...back to the topic at hand.

Got to disagree witcha, Sniper. Women are an invaluable part of the modern force, and we can't do without 'em. Problems? You bet. But the same can be said of the age group we recruit from, as well. But the inherent advantages of those nearly-indestructable late-teens/early-twenties bodies outweigh the really stupid things they can get up to sometimes. (MOST of the time, actually. ) I see having females in the forces the same way: they come with challenges, but it's a better-than-even trade to get their talents.

Lt. Bluesman is rock-hard and very good at her job. She could soldier with you, Sniper, and at the end of it, if she didn't have your respect, your respect wouldn't be worth havin'. Before she was commissioned, she was a hot Arabic linguist. She got out of the Air Force, went to school, maintained a perfect 4.0 GPA while raising three kids mostly alone (I was TDY about half the time), got accepted to the best nursing school in the country, and graduated as Johns Hopkins Nursing's top student last year, ahead of all the twenty-somethings that only had to worry about school. She was top of her class at Commissioned Officer Training. She constantly scores 90+ on the 100-scale AF PT Test. (What would she score on the men's test, I don't know, but I do know this: if she deployed with me, I wouldn't have to carry her mobility bag for her. )

In Sniper's world, the USAF would have been deprived of what is arguably the country's finest new nurse of 2003. Now, that wouldn't be a Good Thing, I'm sure you'd agree.

Ones with a weak link can't handle non-agreement. I have to say though, you guys gave him a good run....he just didn't make it.

I laid out very clear rules for women serving in the military.

They are also very fair.

In case you missed them all above, i'll repost them here:

Snipes rules for women in the military:

All recruits will perform to the same PT and physical standards(and the previous mens standards will NOT be lowered).

All recruits will wear their hair the same- above the eyebrow, off the ears, and not below the collar in the rear.

No makeup shall be permitted.

All fingernails will be kept short and well groomed. No nail polish shall be worn by any soldier.

Any soldier caught fraternizing with a soldier of the opposite sex in their unit shall immediately be discharged.

Any female soldier that becomes pregnant shall immediately be discharged.* modified below.

All gender specific uniform garments shall immediately be replaced with unisex uniforms.

-----------------------------------------------------

You want to serve ladies? Serve with equality then. These rules are 100% fair, and will weed out ALL non-hackers over night.

If you can hack it by the same rules the men do, i welcome you with open arms(especially if you're hot.)

I am also going to modify the pregnancy rule- in retrospect- it is unfair.

The new rule will now be "All women that become pregnant while on hardship deployment" will be immediately discharged.

I have great respect for women, i just don't think that most of them make particularly good killers, and highly motivated well disciplined killers is what the military needs most of all.