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Thread: US admirals criticize China over Hong Kong port calls

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    Senior Contributor xrough's Avatar
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    US admirals criticize China over Hong Kong port calls

    US admirals criticize China over Hong Kong port calls


    Agence France-Presse

    WASHINGTON - Two top US military leaders criticized China Tuesday for blocking port visits to Hong Kong last week by a US aircraft carrier as well as two minesweepers seeking refuge from a storm.

    Admiral Timothy Keating, the commander of US forces in the Pacific, said the Chinese actions were "perplexing, troublesome" and raised questions about Beijing's intentions.

    "It is not, in our view, conduct that is indicative of a country who understands its obligations as a responsible nation," he told reporters in a video conference from his headquarters in Hawaii.

    It came about two weeks after a visit to Beijing by US Defense Secretary Robert Gates who spoke to Chinese leaders about increasing military-to-military contacts to prevent misunderstandings and miscalculation.

    Military relations between the two countries have been strained by US suspicions over a Chinese military buildup and Beijing's objections to US arms sales to Taiwan.

    Hundreds of families of US sailors had flown to Hong Kong last week for the Thanksgiving weekend to meet the USS Kitty Hawk, when China abruptly and without explanation denied the aircraft carrier and its escorts permission to make a port call, officials said.

    The Chinese government agreed a day later to allow the Kitty Hawk enter the port "out of humanitarian consideration," but Keating said that by then the carrier had reversed course and was headed back to Japan.

    Admiral Gary Roughead, the chief of US naval operations, said he was even more bothered by China's refusal to allow two small US minesweepers to enter Hong Kong last week to avoid a tropical storm and refuel.

    "As someone who has been going to sea all my life, if there is one tenet we observe it's when somebody's in need, we provide, and we sort it out later. That to me was more bothersome," Roughead told reporters here.

    He said the navy sent a tanker ship to refuel the minesweepers, the USS Patriot and the USS Guardian, which then proceeded to their homeport in Sasebo, Japan.

    He called China's actions "surprising and unhelpful."

    Roughead said the Chinese have given no reason for the action. He said denying US navy ships port calls at Hong Kong was unusual although not unprecedented.

    Keating said the incident with the minesweepers was "very unusual."

    "Those two minesweepers were engaged in an operation, not against China, but out in international water, and a storm blew up and they needed to get into a place of refuge. And you know, Hong Kong's nearby and it's a great place to go," he said.

    "So, for the Chinese to have denied those two ships in particular, small though they may be, that is a different kettle of fish for us, and is in ways more disturbing, more perplexing than the denial for the Kitty Hawk's port visit request," he said.

    He said he intended to raise the issue during a visit he has requested to make to Beijing in mid January.

    "That is behavior that we do not consider consonant with a nation who advocates a peaceful rise and harmonious relations," he said. "It gives us concern."

    Keating said he also intended to raise China's development of certain weapons that have been used in exercises, as well as its acquisition of a blue water navy -- capable of operating across open oceans, certain air-to-air systems, and its views on weaponization of space.

    "The sum of the weapons we see them developing indicate to us a little more aggressive strategic goal, perhaps, than would be easily understood on our part if it is only to protect those things that are theirs," he said.

    Roughead and Keating both said the incident with the Kitty Hawk and the minesweepers demonstrated the need for greater contact between the two navies.

    "That is one of the reasons why I think we need to continue down the path of the mil-to-mil engagements so that we can get some sense, some intent, what motivations are in things like this," Roughead said.

    Keating said the United States has invited the Chinese military to take part in some basic exercises, such as search and rescue, but have been rebuffed so far.

    "This is going to be a long process, in our view. We are cautiously optimistic that we'll be able to work our way around some of these aggravations, if you will," he said.

    They said the US Navy had given no thought to bypassing Hong Kong in the future.

    "Hong Kong remains a very welcoming place for our sailors to be when they get there," Roughead said. "And it remains one of the world's great cities where sailors for centuries have gone."

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    Official Thread Jacker Senior Contributor gunnut's Avatar
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    Heh, US should announce the carrier group will visit Taiwan instead. Two can play this game.
    "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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    if you do that. you will see USD becoming toilet paper. china > 1 Trillion USD now... both countries can hurt eac hother a great deal if they start playing the game(tm).

    anyway, some newpapers claim it is a response for dalai lama meeting. maybe, since we see japanese port call happening because no official dalai lama meeting in japan. having read only a little the history of tibet, i dunno if dalai is trustworthy leader. the religious order that govern tibet in the past feel a little feudalish.

    imo, they should he him like the pope, have his own administrative space but no land like rome. it make a great tourist attraction too! i really find the tibetan palace much more interesting that the forbidden palace. it remind me of LotR, a citadel build top to a mountain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by akinkhoo View Post
    if you do that. you will see USD becoming toilet paper. china > 1 Trillion USD now... both countries can hurt eac hother a great deal if they start playing the game(tm).

    anyway, some newpapers claim it is a response for dalai lama meeting. maybe, since we see japanese port call happening because no official dalai lama meeting in japan. having read only a little the history of tibet, i dunno if dalai is trustworthy leader. the religious order that govern tibet in the past feel a little feudalish.

    imo, they should he him like the pope, have his own administrative space but no land like rome. it make a great tourist attraction too! i really find the tibetan palace much more interesting that the forbidden palace. it remind me of LotR, a citadel build top to a mountain.
    China is nothing without the U.S. Most of China's consumers are from the U.S. If need be, the U.S. would move to India for manufacturing.

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    Official Thread Jacker Senior Contributor gunnut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akinkhoo View Post
    if you do that. you will see USD becoming toilet paper. china > 1 Trillion USD now... both countries can hurt eac hother a great deal if they start playing the game(tm).
    And have you thought about what will happen to the Chinese economy if they liquidate the dollar? The yuan increases in value against all other international currencies and that will kill China's export based economic expansion.

    We will experience a recession. China's economy will be destroyed.
    "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnut View Post
    And have you thought about what will happen to the Chinese economy if they liquidate the dollar? The yuan increases in value against all other international currencies and that will kill China's export based economic expansion.

    We will experience a recession. China's economy will be destroyed.
    You nailed it!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by akinkhoo View Post
    if you do that. you will see USD becoming toilet paper. china > 1 Trillion USD now... both countries can hurt eac hother a great deal if they start playing the game(tm).

    anyway, some newpapers claim it is a response for dalai lama meeting. maybe, since we see japanese port call happening because no official dalai lama meeting in japan. having read only a little the history of tibet, i dunno if dalai is trustworthy leader. the religious order that govern tibet in the past feel a little feudalish.

    imo, they should he him like the pope, have his own administrative space but no land like rome. it make a great tourist attraction too! i really find the tibetan palace much more interesting that the forbidden palace. it remind me of LotR, a citadel build top to a mountain.
    I am only going to say this once, since stupidity is not something i enjoy in other people

    There is only ONE 13 trillion dollar economy in the world, while Cheap labour economy, well what can i say, the world is poor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnut View Post
    Heh, US should announce the carrier group will visit Taiwan instead. Two can play this game.
    According to the Nelson Report, Kitty Hawk Battle group did sail though the Taiwan Strait on their way back to Japan. The Navy official claimed that Taiwan Strait is just a shortcut. Has nothing to do with the port call incciendt.(yeah! right! ).

    There are some reports suggesting that the reason behind the refusing the port call is due to the fact that there were a major naval exersice was being conducted by the Chinese navy at that time. I guess that PLA again has "forgotten" to tell the foreign Minister about this until the last minutes.

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    DOD has issued a formal complain to China

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Chinese Foreign Minister Yang Jiechi told President George W. Bush on Wednesday that Beijing's refusal to let a U.S. Navy aircraft carrier into Hong Kong was a "misunderstanding," the White House said.

    more stories like thisThe Defense Department said it had issued a formal complaint to China and that Beijing still had not provided sufficient explanation for blocking the USS Kitty Hawk aircraft carrier, and eight ships traveling with it, entry to Hong Kong for a long-planned Thanksgiving holiday visit.

    Bush brought up the issue with China's foreign minister in a meeting at the White House.

    "The president raised the issue about the recent aborted port call by the USS Kitty Hawk. Foreign Minister Yang assured the president that it was a misunderstanding," White House spokeswoman Dana Perino said.

    China also denied access last week to two smaller U.S. Navy ships, the minesweepers USS Guardian and USS Patriot, seeking refuge from an approaching storm. Top U.S. Navy officers said that decision was more troublesome than the move to block the Kitty Hawk because the sailors needed safe harbor.

    Pentagon spokesman Geoff Morrell said the complaint to China was related to both incidents.

    "It is baffling," he said. "It's regrettable and we have not to date received sufficient explanation as to why it took place."

    A Pentagon official outlined the military's concerns in a "tough message" to Chinese Maj. Gen. Zhao Ning, who promised to pass it on to Beijing, Morrell said.

    Beijing's action came as a surprise just weeks after a visit to China by U.S. Defense Secretary Robert Gates that has been described by U.S. officials as positive.

    Relations between China and the United States have improved since 2001, when the countries' militaries broke contact following a collision between a Chinese fighter jet and U.S. spy plane.

    But many differences remain between Beijing and Washington over issues such as China's military build-up and U.S. weapon sales to Taiwan.

    There has been speculation that China's move to block the ships was related to irritation over U.S. plans to sell Taiwan an upgrade to its missile system and a meeting between Bush and exiled Tibetan spiritual leader the Dalai Lama.

    Bush and Yang also discussed North Korea, Iran and other bilateral issues in their meeting, Perino said.

    (Reporting by Tabassum Zakaria, Kristin Roberts and Andy Sullivan; editing by Todd Eastham)

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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnut View Post
    Heh, US should announce the carrier group will visit Taiwan instead. Two can play this game.
    Apparently that you are a better strategical thinker and more patriotic. I think that you should be the US admiral or at least you should give this suggestion to that US admiral.

    He definitely should accept your suggestion. If he doesn’t, please do Hunger Strike until he accepts.
    Last edited by Zeng; 30 Nov 07, at 01:44.
    I am here for exchanging opinions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bella View Post
    China is nothing without the U.S. Most of China's consumers are from the U.S. If need be, the U.S. would move to India for manufacturing.
    These kinds of comments show that the poster knows very little about international economy.

    First, please think about what is the reason why American went to buy more products from China than from India in the first place.

    Then, please think if those reasons have disappeared already.

    A recent research found that India will take more than 10 years and almost a trillion dollar to create an infrastructure like China today. They don’t have the infrastructure to support the scale of manufacturing base in China.

    Although their low tech labor cost is already lower than that of China but most of their other costs are much higher than in China.

    Eventually, manufacturing base will move to India when they get a better infrastructure but not now. That is the economic principle.

    Many parts or components of American products come from China today. If you change to India, the products using those parts are immediately become uncompetitive.

    Please check some comments in another thread:

    http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/cur...ecstasy-3.html


    America is only one big customer of China. China also has Europe and Japan, ME and rest of the Asia as customers.


    Living without China is not impossible but quite uncomfortable.

    U.S. family tries living without China | U.S. | Reuters

    A research showed that through buying Chinese products an average American family saved more money than they got from President Bush’s tax cut plan.


    On the other hand China is already a big market.

    http://www.ustr.gov/Document_Library/Fact_Sheets/2004/America's_Trade_with_China.html

    Quote from the above weblink:
    Between 2000 and 2003, U.S. exports to China grew 76 percent, while sales to the rest of the world declined by 9 percent.
    China has become the second or third largest auto market in the world. Big three sales are down 10~20% a year in US but up 20~30% a year in China. Motorola’s largest single country market is in China not in America.

    China is soon becoming the second large air transportation market. IIRC, in next 20 or 30 years, China may spend half trillion dollar buying air planes.

    Last year, China signed contracts with Air bus and Boeing to buy 150 air planes from each. China just signed another contract with Air bus for another 150 air planes during the visit of French president.

    Today, we are under a global capitalism economic interdependence. If American economic gets into recession, it will hurt Chinese economy and same is also true If Chinese economic gets into recession, it will hurt American economy.

    We should wish for the win-win situation instead of loss-loss one.
    Last edited by Zeng; 30 Nov 07, at 03:59.
    I am here for exchanging opinions.

  12. #12
    Official Thread Jacker Senior Contributor gunnut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tigeranger View Post
    According to the Nelson Report, Kitty Hawk Battle group did sail though the Taiwan Strait on their way back to Japan. The Navy official claimed that Taiwan Strait is just a shortcut. Has nothing to do with the port call incciendt.(yeah! right! ).

    There are some reports suggesting that the reason behind the refusing the port call is due to the fact that there were a major naval exersice was being conducted by the Chinese navy at that time. I guess that PLA again has "forgotten" to tell the foreign Minister about this until the last minutes.
    I saw in the news today that stated China said the refusal was due to Dalai Lama's visit to White House. So there's a misunderstanding of the message of misunderstanding...
    "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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    Official Thread Jacker Senior Contributor gunnut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeng_xinren View Post
    Apparently that you are a better strategical thinker and more patriotic. I think that you should be the US admiral or at least you should give this suggestion to that US admiral.

    He definitely should accept your suggestion. If he doesn’t, please do Hunger Strike until he accepts.
    I wouldn't say I'm a better strategic thinker or more patriotic. More irritating, maybe. )
    "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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    What difference does it make?


    "Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."

    I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.

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    Ray
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    These kinds of comments show that the poster knows very little about international economy.

    First, please think about what is the reason why American went to buy more products from China than from India in the first place.

    Then, please think if those reasons have disappeared already.

    A recent research found that India will take more than 10 years and almost a trillion dollar to create an infrastructure like China today. They don’t have the infrastructure to support the scale of manufacturing base in China.

    Although their low tech labor cost is already lower than that of China but most of their other costs are much higher than in China.
    The money can come from western nations to build the infrastructure.

    No big deal, really!

    And we know English!


    "Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."

    I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.

    HAKUNA MATATA

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