Simple Questions for Chinese Posters - Page 12

Ray · 04-21-2008, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Officer of Engineers

I dare ANYONE call old Genghis a Chinese.

Aside from that,the Khanates would disagree with you strongly. The Golden Horde and the Mughals are not Chinese by any stretch of the imagination. And let's not forget that the Ming did everything to drive the Mongols out and then maintained hostile relations with the rest of the Khanates.

Well, Mao learnt a lot from good old Genghiz!

And so should Mao be taken to be a Mongol and not a Han?

Jay · 04-21-2008, 01:08 AM

If the Old man Genghis is Chinese, then China should also occupy/invade India/Pakistan/Afghanistan as Mughals ruled these areas for almost 3-400 years. Wait, they should also invade/occupy most of the CAR republics, Russia as well. Heck, China should occupy 90% of Asia.

Ray · 04-21-2008, 01:11 AM

Xunil,

You are forcing a point.

I could post bandwidth on the issue to prove that Mongols etc are not Chinese, but I would not like to get into another debate.

What the Colonel is saying, in a very basic terms, is adequate a proof that you are not correct.

Therefore, chill pill!

xunil · 04-21-2008, 12:08 PM

I have to admit that some of my statements are not convincing. You can find Chinese have a different interpretation of history comparing to westerners. This interpratation of history is important for Chinese. It help holding the Chinese together.

xunil · 04-21-2008, 12:19 PM

I'm interested to find meanings of many words changed after translation. Take the word "civilization" for example. The Chinese conterpart of "civilization" is "文明". "文" means characters, articles in Chinese, and "明" means bright. So the English word "civilization" is translated into "characters and bright". If you don't know the history and culture of China, you may not understand why Chinese tanslated like that.

**Officer of Engineers** · 04-21-2008, 12:30 PM

Then a simple question, do you consider the Chagatai Chinese because they certainly were not Yuan.

xunil · 04-21-2008, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Officer of Engineers

Then a simple question, do you consider the Chagatai Chinese because they certainly were not Yuan.

There is no simple question here. Again what do you mean "Chinese" ?

**Officer of Engineers** · 04-21-2008, 12:48 PM

Do you consider modern China to inherit Chagatai history? Timur Leung? The Ottoman Turks? The Huns?

xunil · 04-21-2008, 12:52 PM

We believe Chinese is made up of 56 defferent nationalities. All the history of those nationalities is part of Chinese history.

**Officer of Engineers** · 04-21-2008, 12:53 PM

But the Chagatai Mongols are not part of your minority. Neither is the Golden Horde who makes the modern nation of Mongolia today.

xunil · 04-21-2008, 13:03 PM

At least they were Mongols. So this should be part of Mongols' history.

**Officer of Engineers** · 04-21-2008, 13:08 PM

Sorry, that is like saying that they're Asians and therefore, they're part of Chinese history. They've fought wars to preserve their independence from each other. If you recognize Mongol history, then you should acknowledge the fact that the Chagatai, the Golden Horde were not part of the Yuan, have no desire to part of the Yuan, and outlasted the Yuan. In fact, before old Timur died, they were preparing to reconquer China and re-establish the MONGOL, NOT Chinese, Empire.

If both the Chagatai and the Golden Horde had fought wars to stay outside of rule from the Yuan, then, what makes you think you can claim their inheritance?

**Officer of Engineers** · 04-21-2008, 13:12 PM

Oh, btw, using your logic, then Modern day Turkey is a Chinese country.

xunil · 04-21-2008, 13:25 PM

Sorry, I don't kown the history detail of Chagatai and the Golden Horde. Base on what you said, I guess Chagatai and the Golden Horde were not part of Yuan.

**Officer of Engineers** · 04-21-2008, 13:31 PM

So the statement that Tibet was always part of China since the Yuan is wrong, isn't it? The Chagatai took Tibet after Yuan.

04-21-2008, 01:08 AM	#167 (permalink)
Jay Tamizhanban *Senior Contributor* Join Date: 08-06-03 Location: Edison, NJ Posts: 6,488 Country:	If the Old man Genghis is Chinese, then China should also occupy/invade India/Pakistan/Afghanistan as Mughals ruled these areas for almost 3-400 years. Wait, they should also invade/occupy most of the CAR republics, Russia as well. Heck, China should occupy 90% of Asia. __________________ A grain of wheat eclipsed the sun of Adam !! Last edited by Jay : 04-21-2008 at 01:14 AM.

04-21-2008, 12:30 PM	#171 (permalink)
Officer of Engineers *Military Professional* Moderator Scotch taster Join Date: 08-06-03 Posts: 17,059 Country:	Then a simple question, do you consider the Chagatai Chinese because they certainly were not Yuan. __________________ Chimo

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04-21-2008, 01:11 AM	#168 (permalink)
Ray Postmaster General *Military Professional* Join Date: 08-20-03 Posts: 28,236 Country:	Xunil, You are forcing a point. I could post bandwidth on the issue to prove that Mongols etc are not Chinese, but I would not like to get into another debate. What the Colonel is saying, in a very basic terms, is adequate a proof that you are not correct. Therefore, chill pill!

04-21-2008, 12:08 PM	#169 (permalink)
xunil Patron Join Date: 03-27-08 Posts: 297	I have to admit that some of my statements are not convincing. You can find Chinese have a different interpretation of history comparing to westerners. This interpratation of history is important for Chinese. It help holding the Chinese together.

04-21-2008, 12:19 PM	#170 (permalink)
xunil Patron Join Date: 03-27-08 Posts: 297	I'm interested to find meanings of many words changed after translation. Take the word "civilization" for example. The Chinese conterpart of "civilization" is "文明". "文" means characters, articles in Chinese, and "明" means bright. So the English word "civilization" is translated into "characters and bright". If you don't know the history and culture of China, you may not understand why Chinese tanslated like that.

04-21-2008, 12:48 PM	#173 (permalink)
Officer of Engineers *Military Professional* Moderator Scotch taster Join Date: 08-06-03 Posts: 17,059 Country:	Do you consider modern China to inherit Chagatai history? Timur Leung? The Ottoman Turks? The Huns?

04-21-2008, 12:52 PM	#174 (permalink)
xunil Patron Join Date: 03-27-08 Posts: 297	We believe Chinese is made up of 56 defferent nationalities. All the history of those nationalities is part of Chinese history.

04-21-2008, 12:53 PM	#175 (permalink)
Officer of Engineers *Military Professional* Moderator Scotch taster Join Date: 08-06-03 Posts: 17,059 Country:	But the Chagatai Mongols are not part of your minority. Neither is the Golden Horde who makes the modern nation of Mongolia today.

04-21-2008, 13:03 PM	#176 (permalink)
xunil Patron Join Date: 03-27-08 Posts: 297	At least they were Mongols. So this should be part of Mongols' history.

04-21-2008, 13:08 PM	#177 (permalink)
Officer of Engineers *Military Professional* Moderator Scotch taster Join Date: 08-06-03 Posts: 17,059 Country:	Sorry, that is like saying that they're Asians and therefore, they're part of Chinese history. They've fought wars to preserve their independence from each other. If you recognize Mongol history, then you should acknowledge the fact that the Chagatai, the Golden Horde were not part of the Yuan, have no desire to part of the Yuan, and outlasted the Yuan. In fact, before old Timur died, they were preparing to reconquer China and re-establish the MONGOL, NOT Chinese, Empire. If both the Chagatai and the Golden Horde had fought wars to stay outside of rule from the Yuan, then, what makes you think you can claim their inheritance?

04-21-2008, 13:12 PM	#178 (permalink)
Officer of Engineers *Military Professional* Moderator Scotch taster Join Date: 08-06-03 Posts: 17,059 Country:	Oh, btw, using your logic, then Modern day Turkey is a Chinese country.

04-21-2008, 13:25 PM	#179 (permalink)
xunil Patron Join Date: 03-27-08 Posts: 297	Sorry, I don't kown the history detail of Chagatai and the Golden Horde. Base on what you said, I guess Chagatai and the Golden Horde were not part of Yuan.

04-21-2008, 13:31 PM	#180 (permalink)
Officer of Engineers *Military Professional* Moderator Scotch taster Join Date: 08-06-03 Posts: 17,059 Country:	So the statement that Tibet was always part of China since the Yuan is wrong, isn't it? The Chagatai took Tibet after Yuan.

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