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Thread: Welcome To Pakistan

  1. #196
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    Behavior? Mihais Reply

    "...such behaviour must not be tolerated."

    We'll tolerate sanctuary provided by the GoP to our enemies, why wouldn't we tolerate a few words of mock indignance?
    "This aggression will not stand, man!"
    Jeff Lebowski

  2. #197
    Contributor 1980s's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by S-2 View Post
    "...such behaviour must not be tolerated."

    We'll tolerate sanctuary provided by the GoP to our enemies, why wouldn't we tolerate a few words of mock indignance?
    Dunno how credible this report is. I've been following the reports by the journalist in question for a couple of years now and he seems to be very well 'connected' to 'militant sources'. Altho in some previous reports of his i have noticed some very basic errors and just plain incorrect narratives. Altho this article makes an interesting read, for what its worth:

    US spies walked into al-Qaeda's trap
    By Syed Saleem Shahzad

    ISLAMABAD -
    The suicide attack on the United States Central Intelligence Agency's (CIA's) forward operating base of Chapman in the Afghan province of Khost last week was planned in the Pakistani tribal area of North Waziristan.

    The attacker - a handpicked plant in the Afghan National Army (ANA) - detonated his explosive vest in a gym at the base, killing seven agents, including the station chief, and wounding six. The base was officially for civilians involved in reconstruction.

    The plan was executed following several weeks of preparation by al-Qaeda's Lashkar al-Zil (Shadow Army), Asia Times Online has learned. This was after Lashkar al-Zil's intelligence outfit informed its chief commander, Ilyas Kashmiri, that the CIA planned to broaden the monitoring of the possible movement of al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden and his deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri.

    Well-connected sources in militant camps say that Lashkar al-Zil had become aware of the CIA's escalation of intelligence activities to gather information on high-value targets for US drone attacks. It emerged that tribesmen from Shawal and Datta Khel, in Pakistan's North Waziristan tribal area, had been invited by US operatives, through middlemen, to Khost, where the operatives tried to acquire information on al-Qaeda leaders. Such activities have been undertaken in the past, but this time they were somewhat different.

    "This time there was clearly an obsession to hunt down something big in North Waziristan. But in this obsession, they [operatives] blundered and exposed the undercover CIA facility," a senior leader in al-Qaeda's 313 Brigade said. The brigade, led by Ilyas Kashmiri, comprises jihadis with extensive experience in Pakistan's Kashmir struggle with India.

    Once it became clear that efforts to track down al-Qaeda were being stepped up and that the base in Khost was being extensively used by the CIA, the Lashkar al-Zil (Brigade 055) moved into top gear. It is the soul of al-Qaeda, having being involved in several events since the September 11, 2001, attacks on the US. Under the command of Ilyas Kashmiri, its intelligence network's coordination with its special guerrilla action force has changed the dynamics of the Afghan war theater. Instead of traditional guerrilla warfare in which the Taliban have taken most of the casualties, the brigade has resorted to special operations, the one on the CIA base being the latest and one of the most successful.

    Lashkar al-Zil comprises the Pakistani Taliban, 313 Brigade, the Afghan Taliban, Hezb-e-Islami Afghanistan and former Iraqi Republican Guards. It has taken on special significance since the US announcement of a 30,000 troop surge in Afghanistan, due to kick into action this week.

    Leaders of the Lashkar al-Zil now knew that CIA operatives were trying to recruit reliable tribal people from Afghanistan so that the latter could develop an effective intelligence network along the border with North Waziristan's Shawal and Datta Khel regions, where high-profile al-Qaeda leaders often move around.

    Laskhar al-Zil then laid its trap.

    Over the past months, using connections in tribal structures and ties with former commanders of the Taliban and the Hezb-e-Islami Afghanistan, the militants have planted a large number of men in the ANA.

    One of these plants, an officer, was now called into action. He contacted US personnel in Khost and told them he was linked to a network in the tribal areas and that he had information on where al-Qaeda would hold its shura (council) in North Waziristan and on the movement of al-Qaeda leaders.

    The ANA officer was immediately invited to the CIA base in Khost to finalize a joint operation of Predator drones and ground personnel against these targets.

    Once inside, he set off his bomb, with deadly results.

    "It's a devastating blow," Times Online quoted Michael Scheuer as saying. "[Among others] we lost an agent with 14 years' experience in Afghanistan." Scheuer is a former head of Alec Station, the unit created to monitor bin Laden five years before the attacks of September 11.

    Unlike the Taliban's mostly rag-tag army, Laskhar al-Zil is a sophisticated unit, with modern equipment such as night-vision technology, the latest light weapons and finely honed guerrilla tactics. It has a well-funded intelligence department, much like the Hezb-e-Islami Afghanistan had during the resistance against the Soviets in the 1980s when it had access to advance information on the movement of the Red Army.

    However, Laskhar al-Zil is one step ahead of the Hezb's former intelligence outfit in that it has been able to plant men in the ANA, and these "soldiers" are now at the forefront of al-Qaeda-led sabotage activities in Afghanistan.


    In addition, a large number of senior government officials both in the capital, Kabul, and in the provinces are sympathetic to the Hezb-e-Islami Afghanistan, and, by extension, to the Taliban. Similarly, several former top Taliban commanders have been given responsibilities by the central government in district areas, and as the insurgency has grown, these former militants have been increasingly useful to the Taliban-led insurgency.

    In sum, the US troop surge, coupled with increased US efforts to track down al-Qaeda, has resulted in a shift in southeastern Afghanistan. There has been hardly any uprising against foreign troops in which the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) could hit the Taliban hard. The insurgents now select specific targets for the most effective outcome, such as the spy base in Khost - it took just one insurgent's life for the "devastating" result.

    Consequently, for the first time in the many years that Afghanistan has been at war, the winter season is hot. Last October, the US withdrew its troops from its four key bases in Nuristan, on the border with Pakistan, leaving the northeastern province as a safe haven for the Taliban, under the command of Qari Ziaur Rahman. Kurangal Valley in Kunar province is heavily under siege and Taliban attacks on US bases there could see US forces pulling back from Kunar as well.

    And in the meantime, Lashkar al-Zil can be expected to be planning more strikes of its own.
    In terms of acquiring things like night-vision goggles and more sophisticated arms, is it possible (or probable) that these are American equipment supplied to the Pakistani army that has in turn been supplied to this "Laskhar al-Zil" ?

  3. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1980s View Post
    In terms of acquiring things like night-vision goggles and more sophisticated arms, is it possible (or probable) that these are American equipment supplied to the Pakistani army that has in turn been supplied to this "Laskhar al-Zil" ?
    Or goto ebay

    night vision goggles, great deals on Sporting Goods, Electronics on eBay!
    Chimo

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    Why don't US spend some billions on SEZ in Afganistan. That way people will earn and also the Gov. will earn som taxes. Even 4 SEZ of 15 km radius with better facility for living and study will make sure law & order remains and the economy grows thus help even more people to realize the benifits of ISAF.

  5. #200
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    Looks like the "good Taliban" "bad Taliban" farce was just that all along, a farce. Not that many people needed to be told that but i think attack on the CIA in Afghanistan will finally put an end to the debate over whether Al-Qaeda and the Taliban should be viewed separately.

    BBC News - 'CIA bomber' video indicates Taliban's reach
    By M Ilyas Khan
    BBC News, Islamabad

    The Jordanian "double agent" who killed himself and seven American Central Intelligence Agency officials in Afghanistan's Khost province last month must have been very sure of the success of his mission.

    "This… attack will be the first of revenge operations against the Americans and their drone teams outside the Pakistani border, after they killed the Amir [chief] of Tehrik Taliban Pakistan (TTP), Baitullah Mehsud, may God's beneficence be upon him," he apparently said in a video broadcast released on Saturday.

    The video shows the purported Jordanian suicide bomber sitting next to Baitullah Mehsud's successor and the new Pakistani Taliban, or TTP, chief, Hakimullah Mehsud, and reading from written text.

    "We [the Jordanian himself and the Taliban, whom he describes as Mujahideen or the holy warriors] arranged together this attack to let the Americans understand that our belief in Allah… cannot be exchanged for all the wealth in the world," he says.

    It would appear that he had already set the trap for the CIA agents at the time he made the video.

    But is this really the man who carried out the 30 December bombing of Forward Operating Base Chapman in Khost, which is believed to be the nerve-centre of suspected US drone strikes into Pakistani territory?

    The authenticity of the video is not yet established, neither is the identity of the man in the video - although the father of the accused Jordanian has said that the man who appears on the video is definitely his son.

    The Americans say the Jordanian who killed the CIA officials in Khost was named Humam Khalil Abu-Mulal al-Balawi.

    But the man in the video introduces himself as Dr Abu Dujana al-Khorasani.

    He also does not specify as to where "outside the Pakistani borders" he is going to carry out his revenge attack.

    Some observers even suspect the video may have been doctored by the Pakistani Taliban - who are believed to have released it - to show their leader at the side of the bomber who greatly embarrassed both the American and Jordanian intelligence services.

    Training camps

    The Pakistani Taliban has claimed responsibility for the Khost attack, alongside similar claims by the Afghan Taliban and al-Qaeda.

    All of them said that the attack was planned to avenge the 6 August 2009 killing of Baitullah Mehsud in a drone strike.

    A Pakistani Taliban leader, Qari Hussain, who is known to run training camps for suicide bombers in Pakistan's Waziristan tribal region, near the border with Afghanistan, had in an audio message last week promised that they would soon release a video of the Khost bomber.

    If the video is found to be authentic, then it apparently shows the level and the extent of collaboration between the al-Qaeda core, the Afghan Taliban and their Pakistani counterparts.

    This is not to say that there has ever been any real divergence of views over ideology, tactics or strategy among these three entities.

    Analysts say that the Taliban movement in Pakistan is essentially an offshoot of the so-called Haqqani network, which is an Afghanistan-focused organisation with close links to the al-Qaeda core and sanctuaries in Pakistan.

    The network has deep reach inside Afghanistan and is believed to be behind several high-profile attacks in eastern and south-central Afghanistan, including Kabul, the capital of Afghanistan.

    'Holy warriors'

    An Afghan war veteran from the days of Soviet invasion, Jalaluddin Haqqani, is said to have carved out the Taliban sanctuaries in Waziristan through his close links with the Pakistani intelligence service, the ISI.

    Haqqani is now believed to be an ailing man, and the leadership of the network has passed into the hands of his son, Sirajuddin Haqqani.

    The Haqqanis hail from Khost region, and have been based in the nearby Pakistani tribal region of North Waziristan since the Soviet invasion in 1979.

    In the post-9/11 period, the Haqqanis have organised Afghan resistance from three distinct bases in Pakistan's North and South Waziristan region.

    The fighters in North Waziristan are led by Hafiz Gul Bahadur, those in the western region of South Waziristan are led by Maulvi Nazir, while those in eastern parts of South Waziristan are led by Hakimullah Mehsud.

    Over the years, the groups in North Waziristan and in the west of South Waziristan have struck peace deals with the Pakistani forces and have focused on Afghanistan.

    The group led by Hakimullah Mehsud has, meanwhile, trained its guns on Pakistan.

    The strategy is in keeping with al-Qaeda's view that both Pakistani and Afghan governments are siding with the "infidels" and deserve the wrath of the holy warriors.

    If found authentic, the video released on Saturday would show that any distinction between the militants of Afghanistan and Pakistan has no value beyond academic interest.
    The last paragraph says it all.

  6. #201
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    1980s Reply

    "The last paragraph says it all."

    Only the most obtuse and dense soul would assert such a difference. There certainly was no functional difference on display in SWAT. It was that manifest fact which finally aroused the ire of the Pakistani people. The reality of human-interpreted sharia paled against the rhetoric preceeding it.

    Funny that Pakistanis have such a callous regard for their afghan muslim brothers and sisters that they'd wish upon the afghans that which they can't tolerate for themselves.
    "This aggression will not stand, man!"
    Jeff Lebowski

  7. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by S-2 View Post
    "The last paragraph says it all."

    Only the most obtuse and dense soul would assert such a difference. There certainly was no functional difference on display in SWAT. It was that manifest fact which finally aroused the ire of the Pakistani people. The reality of human-interpreted sharia paled against the rhetoric preceeding it.

    Funny that Pakistanis have such a callous regard for their afghan muslim brothers and sisters that they'd wish upon the afghans that which they can't tolerate for themselves.
    From the beginning pakistani interest in afghanistan was never to have diplomatic ties but to hold it in its clout..to make it its puppet state and to recruit there jihad base from there to use it against its 'hostile' countries(read India).
    As for the callous behaviour i think its more beacuse of some difference in their cultures..and its not just limited to afghan but also recently to their own balochistan.

  8. #203
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    Bombs & Beatings: Life Among The Taliban-BBC Feb. 5, 2010

    This is a heartbreaking story as told by a thirteen year old girl belonging to a committed family of taliban, replete with a brother who recruited suicide-bombers, beat students and teachers, and told her that a woman's place was in a home or grave.

    He threatened to cut off his sister's head and put it on her chest if she left the house. It gets much worse and includes video.

    Slowly, I think that the Pakistanis are getting it. Sadly, there are too many indications that their strategic thinkers STILL see the taliban as a viable option that must be held close. It makes talk of "stretched and overcommitted forces" ring hollow and only confirms whenever I read such as in this report-

    Pakistan's Military Examines Its Options In N. Waziristan-Lt. Gen. Talaat Masood Jamestown Foundation February 4, 2010

    Be forewarned that this apologia/rationale offered is despicably heinous and points to the continuing climate of double-talk and dissemblance we've been spoon-fed since day one.

    Ol' S-2's anger-management blew apart and my diplomatic skills utterly failed with my Pakistani friends upon reading it.
    Last edited by S2; 06 Feb 10, at 03:38.
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  9. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by S-2 View Post
    Ol' S-2's anger-management blew apart and my diplomatic skills utterly failed with my Pakistani friends upon reading it.
    Anger Management System Malfuntioning since day one.
    Last edited by Deltacamelately; 06 Feb 10, at 07:51.
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  10. #205
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    Another excellent piece by Farhat Taj
    ............

    ANALYSIS: Drone attacks and US reputation —Farhat Taj

    In terms of the drone attacks, the US must not make any distinction between al Qaeda and the Taliban. They both have internalised a global ideology that is anti-civilisation and anti-human

    There is news coming up in the media that al Qaeda in Waziristan may run away to Yemen in the face of growing drone attacks. The people of Waziristan have expressed deep concern at this news. They do not want al Qaeda to run away from Waziristan. They want al Qaeda along with the Taliban burnt to ashes on the soil of Waziristan through relentless drone attacks. The drone attacks, they believe, are the one and only ‘cure’ for these anti-civilisation creatures and the US must robustly administer them the ‘cure’ until their existence is annihilated from the world. The people of Waziristan, including tribal leaders, women and religious people, asked me to convey in categorical terms to the US the following in my column.

    One, your new drone attack strategy is brilliant, i.e. one attack closely followed by another. After the first attack the terrorists cordon off the area and none but the terrorists are allowed on the spot. Another attack at that point kills so many of them. Excellent! Keep it up!

    Your drone technology has the full capacity to encircle and eliminate al Qaeda and the Taliban in Waziristan. If you fail to do so and al Qaeda manages to run away to Yemen or any other place, it could only happen in two cases: either you are highly incompetent people or you have ulterior motives.

    The people who have established one of the world’s most vibrant democracies and have taken science and technology to a new zenith cannot be highly incompetent. Now the only possibility is that you have ulterior motives, which could facilitate al Qaeda’s escape from Waziristan.

    In a sense the ISI of Pakistan and the CIA of the US share a sinister reputation: both use fanatic Islamists to promote strategic goals. The Taliban are the strategic assets of the ISI and al Qaeda of the CIA. Terrorised people in FATA believe that the ISI would never eliminate the Taliban for the sake of strategic depth in Afghanistan and countless people across the Muslim world believe that al Qaeda is a CIA invention to trigger chaos in Muslim lands and hence create excuses for the US to control natural resources such as oil and gas in those lands. There is also a perception in FATA and the rest of Pakistan that the US is especially going soft on Islamists from the restive Muslim areas of China. Those Islamists would be used to destabilise China, the emerging rival to the US in world politics.

    Here in Waziristan the US has a good opportunity to prove to the Muslim world that it is indeed serious in eliminating al Qaeda. The escape of al Qaeda from Waziristan to Yemen or any other Muslim country would communicate the message that the US is an imperial power that just ‘relocates’ its strategic assets from one Muslim society to another only to destabilise them and hence paves the way for US military intervention in those areas.

    In terms of the drone attacks, the US must not make any distinction between al Qaeda and the Taliban. They both have internalised a global ideology that is anti-civilisation and anti-human. They will keep coming back to strike at civilisations — Islamic, Western, Confucian or Indian. The sooner the world gets rid of them the better.

    This was the view of the people of Waziristan. I would now draw the attention of the US to the Peshawar Declaration, a joint statement of political parties, civil society organisations, businessmen, doctors, lawyers, teachers, students, labourers and intellectuals, following a conference on December 12-13, 2009, in Peshawar. The declaration notes that if the people of the war-affected areas are satisfied with any counter-militancy strategy; it is drone attacks that they support the most. Some people in Waziristan compare drones with the Quran’s Ababeels — the holy sparrows sent by God to avenge Abraham, the intended conqueror of the Khana Kaaba. Which other Muslim society has likened anything from the US military with a Quranic symbol? Only the Pakhtuns did that so publicly in this time of rising anti-Americanism across the Muslim world! What more does the US want from a Muslim society? Now please go ahead and do the needful as indicated by the people of Waziristan.

    The overpowered people of Waziristan are angry. They believe no one in their entire history has inflicted so much insult on them as al Qaeda. In our native land, they say, al Qaeda has killed so many of us. Anyone in the world who has gone mad in the name of religion has come to occupy our land. They are Arabs, Central Asians, Caucasians and Africans. They are people with black, brown, blue and green eyes. They are brown, black and white. They all have chosen our land for their sinister designs against all civilisations. No self-respecting people, they argue, can accept this situation.

    The ball is now in the US’s court. Their action or inaction against the terrorists in Waziristan would either confirm their image in the Muslim world as an imperial power destabilising Muslim societies in the name of the war on terror or would challenge that image, at least in FATA and the NWFP, the Muslim society on the frontline of the war on terror. The people of Waziristan hope the US challenges that image through the elimination of all terrorists — al Qaeda or the Taliban — in Waziristan.

    The writer is a research fellow at the Centre for Interdisciplinary Gender Research, University of Oslo, and a member of Aryana Institute for Regional Research and Advocacy. She can be reached at bergen34@yahoo.com



    Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

  11. #206
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    IHM Reply

    "Another excellent piece by Farhat Taj"

    Absolutely writing some of the most important pieces to the Pakistani narrative out there and bravely so. Thanks. She's had my attention for about one year now and her commentary ring solid with each reading.

    Anybody that's not reading these two columns offered since January and her original research on behalf of AIRRA is really missing out.

    EDIT: There are issues WRT the latest column. It would appear Ms. Taj is putting her credibility on the line when stating that there hasn't been ANY civilian collateral casualties. I'd dispute that. At a minimum, we must accept that there are incidents where the unfortunate wives and children of those harboring these beasts are killed. Like it or not, they'd be innocent of the crimes of their husbands/fathers. Without knowing for certain, I think that this is a fair assumption on my part.

    Secondly, the notion that we've perfect omnipotence such that ALL A.Q. can be eliminated and thus kept from possibly emigrating elsewhere is an interesting exercise in dissemblance that suggests Ms. Taj is not immune from the conspiracy theories which abound in Pakistan. To suggest our perfect competency to target our enemies is ridiculous otherwise they'd have long since been killed. To suggest that their escape elsewhere could only be by our desire to use such as an entree into other muslim countries such as Yemen plays her cards way too far.

    Still, she's marching to a different drummer. That much is for certain. So too the others alluded inside this article who've generated an interesting document known as the Peshawar Declaration at a conference last December 12-13. It is a decidedly anti-army, anti-taliban, anti-government declaration that will be certain to make the friends of nobody of consequence in Pakistan while likely adding a few names to those dissidents targeted for killing by either right-wing neo-fascists or islamo-fascists.
    Last edited by S2; 06 Feb 10, at 16:19.
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  12. #207
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    Griffith 23 Reply

    I noticed that you've failed to provide us with a brief bio in the member intro thread. Would you please do so?

    Thanks and may you live in interesting times.

    EDIT: Gee whiz, Colonel, I was planning on being extra-nice. Really. See? Even a happy smile...
    "This aggression will not stand, man!"
    Jeff Lebowski

  13. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by S-2 View Post
    EDIT: Gee whiz, Colonel, I was planning on being extra-nice. Really. See? Even a happy smile...
    It wasn't a very nice chew toy.
    Chimo

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    OoE Reply

    "It wasn't a very nice chew toy."

    Colonel,

    No, he wasn't. However, I'd intended to chew that gristle slowly and digest it over an EXTREMELY long period of savory delight. I suspect Bluesman would have especially loved the flavor of that morsel.)
    "This aggression will not stand, man!"
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    What did we miss?
    To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway

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