USS Missouri (BB-63)FAQ

[Dreadnought]

Hey cRustyBattleship, you seem to know a lot about the battleships. Have you ever thought about writing a book?

He already has I believe

[Ytlas]

Really? So where do I get a copy?

[RustyBattleship]

He already has I believe

That is correct, I already have written the book but haven't found a benevolent publisher yet. Actually the book is the history of the Long Beach Naval Shipyard, the adjoining Long Beach Naval Station (aka Roosevelt Base) and the final adjoing Naval Air Station Terminal Island (aka Reeves Field).

Two or three chapters are devoted to the Battleships with mentions of them in other appropriate chapters. Most of the book is devoted to the people (and equipment in some cases) that made LBNSY the most cost effective publicly owned shipyard in the country, the only one to make a profit and ALLOWED to keep it and the only one to receive the Meritorious Unit Citation.

I have applied for a grant to a special group in Long Beach that SUPPOSEDLY is dedicated to preserving the memory of the imapact of the Navy in Long Beach. Two years in a row I was flatly turned down (even though I would be using a local publisher keeping grant money withing the city). This year I haven't even received a rejection letter.

I find that insulting. On our last flag day, we had ceremonies at American Legion Post 560 commemorating their new flagpole (actually a fiberglass 35 foot whip antenna off the Bon Homme Richard). As a community interest for those activities I took up 6 tables of display boards showing historical plaques and models of the shipyard. Included were some of the appendices of my book. These appendices have brought tears to the eyes of some ex-yardbirds at reunions and other functions. Some of the dignitaries at that commemoration were city officials who said I should apply for that grant. I told them I have applied two years in a row and have been turned down. As they are going through the appendices, they said, "Apply again". I have but it's two months past rejection letter time and invitation to provide more details.

Appendix A is a chronological list of every ship, barge or whatever dry docked in dry docks 1, 2, 3 or any of the floating dry docks we had. Over, 3,500 dockings.

Appendix B is a list breaking down special dry dockings of ships by class such as which Battleships were docked, which gun cruisers, which carriers, which submarines, etc.

Appendix E is a list of all 2,903 graduate apprentices (of which I am one of them who graduated as a shipfitter in 1958 before going into the design division as a lowly draftsman).

Appendix F is a list of all commanding officers of BOTH the shipyard and Naval Base/Station.

Appendix G is a list of all officers and CPO's stationed at Reeves Field during WW II who flew the patrol planes (one catching sight of a *** sub just west of Catalina Island) and new planes ferried to other posts.

Many of my chapters are devoted to some of the special equipment we had such as the Morreel Dock that could even dry dock the Eisenhower class carrier, the "German Floating Crane" that could lift up to 400 tons and transport it across the bay. I also include all of the special projects the shipyard worked on from Operation Crossroads (a cousin of mine was the pilot of the B-29 in test Able) in the 1940's to a Stealth program in the 1990's. I was involved either in a small way (Operation Wigwam in 1954) or a big way (Polaris/Poseidon/Trident test equipment, Sealab II, DSRV, BB reactivation, etc.) so I can authoritively write about them with NO bull ****.

I made myself "The Horse's Mouth". Now all I need is 50K dollars to print 5,000 copies.

Any partners out there? My email address is LBNSYretiree@aol.com.

[Ytlas]

Hmm. I thought the Stealth program was in 1988 (CNO 886-5)

[Dreadnought]

That is correct, I already have written the book but haven't found a benevolent publisher yet. Actually the book is the history of the Long Beach Naval Shipyard, the adjoining Long Beach Naval Station (aka Roosevelt Base) and the final adjoing Naval Air Station Terminal Island (aka Reeves Field).

Two or three chapters are devoted to the Battleships with mentions of them in other appropriate chapters. Most of the book is devoted to the people (and equipment in some cases) that made LBNSY the most cost effective publicly owned shipyard in the country, the only one to make a profit and ALLOWED to keep it and the only one to receive the Meritorious Unit Citation.

I have applied for a grant to a special group in Long Beach that SUPPOSEDLY is dedicated to preserving the memory of the imapact of the Navy in Long Beach. Two years in a row I was flatly turned down (even though I would be using a local publisher keeping grant money withing the city). This year I haven't even received a rejection letter.

I find that insulting. On our last flag day, we had ceremonies at American Legion Post 560 commemorating their new flagpole (actually a fiberglass 35 foot whip antenna off the Bon Homme Richard). As a community interest for those activities I took up 6 tables of display boards showing historical plaques and models of the shipyard. Included were some of the appendices of my book. These appendices have brought tears to the eyes of some ex-yardbirds at reunions and other functions. Some of the dignitaries at that commemoration were city officials who said I should apply for that grant. I told them I have applied two years in a row and have been turned down. As they are going through the appendices, they said, "Apply again". I have but it's two months past rejection letter time and invitation to provide more details.

Appendix A is a chronological list of every ship, barge or whatever dry docked in dry docks 1, 2, 3 or any of the floating dry docks we had. Over, 3,500 dockings.

Appendix B is a list breaking down special dry dockings of ships by class such as which Battleships were docked, which gun cruisers, which carriers, which submarines, etc.

Appendix E is a list of all 2,903 graduate apprentices (of which I am one of them who graduated as a shipfitter in 1958 before going into the design division as a lowly draftsman).

Appendix F is a list of all commanding officers of BOTH the shipyard and Naval Base/Station.

Appendix G is a list of all officers and CPO's stationed at Reeves Field during WW II who flew the patrol planes (one catching sight of a *** sub just west of Catalina Island) and new planes ferried to other posts.

Many of my chapters are devoted to some of the special equipment we had such as the Morreel Dock that could even dry dock the Eisenhower class carrier, the "German Floating Crane" that could lift up to 400 tons and transport it across the bay. I also include all of the special projects the shipyard worked on from Operation Crossroads (a cousin of mine was the pilot of the B-29 in test Able) in the 1940's to a Stealth program in the 1990's. I was involved either in a small way (Operation Wigwam in 1954) or a big way (Polaris/Poseidon/Trident test equipment, Sealab II, DSRV, BB reactivation, etc.) so I can authoritively write about them with NO bull ****.

I made myself "The Horse's Mouth". Now all I need is 50K dollars to print 5,000 copies.

Any partners out there? My email address is LBNSYretiree@aol.com.

Sir, If you would we would be pleased to see any Battleship/Naval images you may post. Especially the BB's during refit and trials

[sparten]

Sir, how would an Iowa hold up to a Cole type attack? I really don't expect you to tell me anything thats still classified, but what with the USNFSA, saying that Iowa would be unharmed, and remembering the fact that Queen Elizabeth and Valient were sunk in Alexandria harbor back in 1941, by Italian frogmen, it would certainly be illuminating to have ypur take on it.

[Dreadnought]

Why do I get the idea of all of us battleship crazies sitting around having drinks and cigars while we question this mans (RustBattleships) ears off.

Would probably be like a bunch of grandsons asking their granfather all kinds of questions.

[Ytlas]

Apparently cRustyBattleship has gone on hiatus again.... Perhaps someone should call "Curleys." (insider joke).

[RustyBattleship]

Sir, how would an Iowa hold up to a Cole type attack? I really don't expect you to tell me anything thats still classified, but what with the USNFSA, saying that Iowa would be unharmed, and remembering the fact that Queen Elizabeth and Valient were sunk in Alexandria harbor back in 1941, by Italian frogmen, it would certainly be illuminating to have ypur take on it.

Believe it or not, though I'm retired, I was contacted by several emails from friends of mine still working for the Navy on that very question.

Their first questions were asking my opinion on the seaworthiness of the Cole after the attack. They sent me photos I have not seen in any public media for my interpretation.

Naturally, questions later followed as to an Iowa class ship's resistance or possible damage to the exact same attack. Well, the Cole's shell plating is probably only 3/8 inch thick but possibly up to 1/2 inch thick at the shear strake (upper strake of shell plating where it meets the stringer strake of the main deck).

I was not directly involved in the design of the Burke class ships but it followed general design and construction methods except in two areas. One; Vertical surfaces were avoided as much as possible to deflect RADAR beams thus adding some stealth capability. Two; The entire ship's hull AND most of its superstructure (at least up to 01 or 02 level) was built of HSLA (High Strength Low Alloy) steel. Therefore it's a pretty tough ship.

On an Iowa, the shell plating at waterline, where the suicide boat would have hit, is 1.5 inches thick of STS (Special Treated Steel) with a yield strength of 110,000 pounds per square inch (110 KPSI). That amount of "trigger plate" armor covers strakes M and N for much of the length of the ship (with shell strakes starting at A strake next to the keel and running outboard and up). Strakes O and up above are 5/8 inch thick HTS (High Tensile Steel) with a yield strength of about 70 KPSI.

Inboard of the shell plating is a narrow fuel tank below 3rd deck and a void space above up to the Main Deck. Oh yeah, the 2nd deck shelf begins near the top of N strake supporting the 6 inch thick 2nd deck of laminated STS and Class B armor plating. Inboard of that fuel tank is another fuel tank. Inboard of that second fuel tank is a void space. Inboard of that void space is Class A armor 12.1 inches thick bolted to STS plating 1.5 inches thick. Inboard of that is another void space before you get into the main machinery rooms and 5 inch magazines. All outboard fuel tanks and void spaces are built of 5/8 inch thick HTS.

Though an Iowa hull uses lots of rivets, they can be of advantage as crack arrestors such as likely in the HTS plating. The rivet plates (called butt straps) are 5/8 inch to 3/4 inch thick STS plating. Thickness varied between the first two ships of the class and the last two that used thicker plating in fragment protection and even in the Class A transverse bulkhead at frame 50.

Though the Cole is a tough ship, towing her back to the states would have been risky and it was wise to use the heavy lift ship. But an Iowa is a lot tougher and would have survived possibly with fewer or NO human casualties.

An example is when the North Carolina was hit by a Japanese Long Lance torpedo. The machinery configuration manager in our Battleship office in the 80s was a Marine aboard at the time (at his 40mm gun back aft). There were some casualties down below (as a torpedo warhead is designed for penetration and not just a big boom). The torpedo did punch through the armor belt into the propellent storeroom for the 16 inchers. Survivors said they saw the powder start to flash but the water rushed in so fast it actually drowned the fire. The ship continued at 25 knots until the flotilla felt it was safe then slowed to 15 just to be on the safe side.

So, in summary as to how big of a hole that boat would have made into an Iowa is that it would have been more of a dent than a hole and the ship could have made it back to an American shipyard on its own.

The QE and Valiant sinkings are totally different as the frogmen were able to place their charges in very specific locations UNDER the ship to prevent flooding control. For example, charges placed up inside the main seawater scoops for the boilers would blow out the scoops below the main valves and perhaps the valves themselves (those scoops are about a meter in diameter at the least). Charges could also be set at the keel at where main transverse watertight bulkheads are located. Blasting through then floods compartments on both sides of the bulkheads making flooding control impossible.

And, no, I'm not going to Curley's tonight. We're having our reunion committee meeting at my house but it will be a brown bag affair as there are too many special diets required by various members (salt free, sugar free, fat free and taste free).

[Sea Toby]

How many know who christened the Mighty Mo? A hint: she also christened the SS United States, still the pride of the American merchant marine, and recently helped christened the aircraft carrier Harry S. Truman....

You only get one guess.....

[TopHatter]

The QE and Valiant sinkings are totally different as the frogmen were able to place their charges in very specific locations UNDER the ship to prevent flooding control.

Yeah, one shining reason to have good subsuface port security like dolphins.

And, no, I'm not going to Curley's tonight.

Some interloper seems to have inside knowledge of RustyBattleship....

[Ytlas]

So.....cRustyBattleship, how was the meeting? When's the picnic scheduled for?

[RustyBattleship]

So.....cRustyBattleship, how was the meeting? When's the picnic scheduled for?

Well now, if you didn't take so long in Bakersfield you could have made it to the meeting.

The Shipyard Reunion picnic is scheduled for September 20. We plan to use the same caterer.

Now - for an earlier question about posting pics of the ship reactivations. I have lots of them around - somewhere. I have lots of them on disk (I hope). But it would take me some time to zero in on them, convert them to a format acceptable by this board and some still even require scanning.

Actually there really isn't much to see in them but one of my favorites are the way we installed the 1.5 inch thick HY-80 armor plates on CEC. That appears in my chapter on Armor Plating of ships (including the Spruance Class Destroyers).

Even then, I need to do some censoring. I don't want to wind up as an associate of mine sent to prison for publishing a picture of a Russian ship. The picture was highly detailed. Unfortunately the picture was taken by one of our satellites and that's what got him put behind bars. Now believe it or not, President Clinton did only one good thing (in my mind) and that was to pardon him.

So I'm going to have to be careful of what I post on websites and what I put into print.

Hmmm. Gotta be careful now what we say on some of these forums too. You never know who ELSE may be reading them such as George Orwell's - well - you know who I mean.

[sparten]

Yeah, one shining reason to have good subsuface port security like dolphins.

Yes, makes one wonder, what were the Brits thinking?

[Dreadnought]

How many know who christened the Mighty Mo? A hint: she also christened the SS United States, still the pride of the American merchant marine, and recently helped christened the aircraft carrier Harry S. Truman....

You only get one guess.....

Ms. Margret Truman in Brooklyn Navy yard Jan 1944.