Bring Back The Iowa Class Discussion And Debate

[Dreadnought]

Great pictures Jay.

[Dreadnought]

Last time I was aboard her while in Norfolk at the yard.

[Ytlas]

Yes indeed. There were two when I arrived, I'll try to scan more pictures. The outer one left first, CG 60- USS Normany, it was quite a sight! she powered up her turbines and backed up fast - with her turbines screaming, bow almost out of the water, then turned on a dime, bow high, the big rooster tail sprayed the Wiskie's fantail pretty good - I am pretty sure it was done this way to impress the onlookers - it certainly did. Those Tico CG's were/are hotrods.

The gas turbine ships were always coming into the yard with twisted shafts and to get the "Rubber Window" on the sonar dome fixed.

[RustyBattleship]

The gas turbine ships were always coming into the yard with twisted shafts and to get the "Rubber Window" on the sonar dome fixed.

The problem with the shafts was that they can turn only one direction. A gas turbine does not have a reverse gear. It's the variable pitch propeller blades that play hell on them, especially going from fast forward to "crash-back" fast astern.

Though the rubber SONAR bow domes have a steel mesh reinforcement in them and are about an inch thick (but still remaining the same density of sea water) they are still vulnerable to strange floating objects with sharp edges or nails sticking out. And then there's a "Sea Monster" that likes to nibble off the surfaces of the rubber and leaves cuts and gashes all over it.

[Dreadnought]

*Please do note in the pictures above the date is a bit screwey due to camera malfunction.

[blidgepump]

The problem with the shafts was that they can turn only one direction. A gas turbine does not have a reverse gear. It's the variable pitch propeller blades that play hell on them, especially going from fast forward to "crash-back" fast astern.

Though the rubber SONAR bow domes have a steel mesh reinforcement in them and are about an inch thick (but still remaining the same density of sea water) they are still vulnerable to strange floating objects with sharp edges or nails sticking out. And then there's a "Sea Monster" that likes to nibble off the surfaces of the rubber and leaves cuts and gashes all over it.

I remember the recital in your book Mr. L. Do teeth marks interfer with the sonars resolution? Or just a point for water to enter?

[USSWisconsin]

window biter

[RustyBattleship]

I remember the recital in your book Mr. L. Do teeth marks interfer with the sonars resolution? Or just a point for water to enter?

Actually, the SONAR domes are filled with water. The rubber dome is molded with a steel wired reinforcing mesh within it. The rubber is designed to be the same density as water, thus much more effective than the old steel domes that dampened or interfered with a clean ping.

Gashes and nibble cuts upset the hydrodynamic surface of the dome causing turbulence of the water passing over it. Thus the SONAR pings start losing signal strength and accurate interpretation.

Reminds me of a stunt pulled on new officers reporting aboard their first ships. Even the old keel mounted steel domes were flooded and when the ship pulled away from the pier to go on patrol the dome was flooded and a check valve above was cracked open enough to let the air out until some water squirted in.

The new shave tail (recently commissioned Ensign) would be in the command center with the Captain when the SONAR officer would enter and seriously inform the Captain, "Sir. The SONAR dome is flooded."

The skipper would swing around with frown and ask. "Are your SURE?"

The officer would answer, "Yes Sir. I opened the air valve and water squirted out into the bilges."

The skipper would snap a look at the new Ensign indicating that he should go check it out. Usually, as he was heading out the door he would hear the grunts and snickers that he had been officially "initiated" into Navy humor.

[blidgepump]

Telephone from the USS Missouri ( BB-63) on display at the WNY.

Like Western Electric, another industry-leading telephone equipment manufacturer located in the Chicago area, Automatic Electric spent most of its history as a subsidiary of another company. In 1889, a Kansas City resident named Almon B. Strowger invented an automatic telephone switch. In 1901, the company changed its name to Automatic Electric and opened a six-story plant on Chicago's West Side. Most of this equipment was sold to independent telephone companies around the country; some was also purchased by the Bell system of AT&T. In 1919, Automatic Electric was purchased by Theodore Gary & Co., a Kansas City–based enterprise that already owned several small telephone companies around the country. Automatic Electric made roughly 80 percent of the world's dial-operated automatic telephone equipment.

Pictured below is the Type "D" telphone used on the IOWA Class BB's.

[Dreadnought]

Ahh yes, The New Jersey has a similar model on display on certain open days dubbed the Halsey telephone. Since it came from his original quarters.

[NavyDoc]

Dread, are you going to have to move?

‘Big J’ coming to JC?
Campaign building to bring famed Battleship New Jersey to Liberty State Park
by E. Assata Wright
Reporter staff writer Hudson Reporter
01.22.12 - 12:05 am

A behind-the-scenes campaign to relocate the U.S. Navy’s most decorated war ship from Camden to Jersey City is now underway, a campaign that threatens to revive an old tug of war between north and south Jersey.

A decade has passed since the Battleship USS New Jersey sailed around the U.S. and landed in Camden, after Jersey City, Bayonne, and Camden waged a bitter battle over where the ship would be docked. At the time, many were surprised that Camden won out over Jersey City and Bayonne. But it was assumed the ship, which was turned into a museum, would help vitalize Camden’s waterfront and feed off of tourism in Philadelphia.

That hasn’t happened. Disappointing tourism along Camden’s Delaware River waterfront, according to some sources, has made the USS New Jersey a forgotten relic tucked behind the city’s underutilized aquarium.

“This is a national treasure. It’s been given its best shot in Camden,” said one source. “But it simply isn’t viable [as a tourist attraction] where it is now.”

Thus, there’s now a move afoot to build political pressure to bring the ship north to Jersey City, where tourism traffic is greater. But Camden, south Jersey, and Philadelphia are sure to mount their own campaign to keep the battleship docked where it is.

Old idea resurfaces

The move to relocate this historic war ship is being spearheaded by the USS New Jersey Battleship Foundation, various veterans groups, and groups of volunteers who believe the ship – which is now operating as a museum in Camden – is not sustainable in its current location.

They argue the battleship, which could be a major tourist attraction, is not getting the foot traffic it should, largely because the Delaware River waterfront and Camden are not attractive destinations for visitors.

“After 10 years and $42 million in state and other aid, that location has failed to sustain the New Jersey,” the foundation’s executive director, vice president, and secretary write in a letter addressed to USS New Jersey supporters. “The battleship should be moved to Liberty State Park where
attendance revenue will forever support its self-sufficient operation and create hundreds of new jobs.”

In their new vision for the battleship, they see it as part of a “freedom trilogy” in the New York Harbor that will eventually include the USS New Jersey, the Statue of Liberty, and 1 World Trade Center, formerly known as the Freedom Tower, in lower Manhattan.

[Dreadnought]

Nah, just more sour grapes. New Jersey is not going anywhere for a few good reasons.

These are strickly MY opinion and no one elses that I can speak for. I cannot speak for the ship, Foundation or any other formal body affiliated with her but I can say I have seen this several times before in the past. Rusty can verify this.

1) The USN says so, and until they say different this bunch can print whatever they want. Its a free country.

2) Fresh water instead of Salt water. Less deterioration of the hull = less expense of maintaining the hull and fixtures. Especially in these economic times.

3) If you consider the fact the Intrepid is near by and other attractions, their calculations of foot traffic would not work. Both would more then likely suffer reductions in foot traffic if anything.

We wont get into any more specifics here (above).

If they really wanted to be a part of her and her success, instead of being drama queens and sour grapes on the vine via media, then maybe they should know we have both men and women that come from farther away then themselves to Camden NJ to give their time and efforts for upkeep and successfull programs. And I might add they do a very good job at doing just that.

Whats keeping them from contributing to her success?

The ride? Or the fact they would have to put forward the effort instead of the bluster?

I'm glad many dont feel that way and I dont either. As you can see I am not from New Jersey either but yet I make the effort.

They just use Camden as an excuse for their soapboxing efforts.

They know little about what it takes to take care of a battleship until they have done it. They haven't. We do and have to this day.

Funny thing though, her encampment programs (which was chosen as #1 in the country 2010 for 17,000 people staying aboard overnight) bring in people from all over the world and all over this country. Including Northern Jersey and New York.

I guess these people dont mind the travel either, so why should this bunch which constantly employs the media with these allegations that the ship is being hidden or they could do a better job with promises of great numbers of tourists mind putting forth the effort of coming to Camden NJ and volunteering their time as we all do if they are indeed genuinely concerned with her success?

They have zero facts of their own, only baseless comparrisons. They cannot decide for anyone how many will visit or tour these places so their numbers are not legitimate. Only theory based upon the numbers of people they recieve at present at these locations.

In most cases that I have seen for myself, many people do not want to tour one thing after another. For many their schedule does not permit it, and for others, many have had a good long walking, learning and climbing experience after touring this ship.

If they wanted an Iowa class for the New York area then maybe they should have grabbed the Iowa (no offense Rusty) or the Missouri since they were built there in Brooklyns Navy yard. Philly built the New Jersey and Wisconsin. Both have homes and are well cared for. Its easy to say someone else can take better care of them once all of the hard work is done.

Until the USN (which is aboard on and for numerous occassions) states other, this group will continue to blow as much hot air as they want with these stories and accusations. As I mentioned before, its a free country.

As previously mentioned above, these are strickly MY opinions and not to be construed or associated with anyone elses opinions or any formal relations to the ship itself, professional staff, the USN or the Foundation that has at present the responsibility of maintaining her.

If they want to bitch or discuss facts of my opinions stated above that I myself posted, the line forms HERE!

Amen.

[bigross86]

I took a subway and a bus to get to the USS New Jersey, and then 2 buses and a subway to get back to my dad's place in Queens. Worth every bloody second.

[Dreadnought]

I took a subway and a bus to get to the USS New Jersey, and then 2 buses and a subway to get back to my dad's place in Queens. Worth every bloody second.

Imagine that. An Israeli (no offense BR ) who travels all the way to New York from Israel to visit with family and yet finds the time and makes the effort via public transportation to visit the ship in Camden while on vacation. I hope you enjoyed your visit. Sorry, I wasnt able to be there during your visit BR. Hopefully, next time we can get together.

And Thank You for being an accessory to the fact.

[bigross86]

My pleasure. I had a great time on the ship. The 16/50's definitely put being the gunner on a 120mm tank gun into perspective...

Oh well, at least my gun is still bigger than the ones the infantry carry...