Speaking of Yamato...

[Michigan_Guy]

I know she had 18" guns, but what caliber were they and what kind of range did they have? Also, how many shell could the fire a minute? Oddly enough I can't find these answers anywhere online!

[TopHatter]

I know she had 18" guns, but what caliber were they and what kind of range did they have? Also, how many shell could the fire a minute? Oddly enough I can't find these answers anywhere online!

The best website for questions like that is here NavWeaps - Naval Weapons, Naval Technology and Naval Reunions - Navy Weapons

The answer to your question from NavWeaps:

Designation Official Designation - 40 cm/45 (15.9") Type 94 (Model 1934)
Actual Size - 46 cm/45 (18.1") Type 94 (Model 1934)
Ship Class Used On Yamato Class
Date Of Design 1934
Date In Service 1941
Gun Weight 363,000 lbs. (164,654 kg) with breech
Gun Length oa 831.9 in (21.130 m)
Bore Length 815 in (20.700 m)
Rifling Length about 806 in (20.480 m)
Grooves (72) 0.181 in deep x about 0.478 in (4.6 mm x 12.14 mm)
Lands about 0.312 in (7.93 mm)
Twist Uniform RH 1 in 28
Chamber Volume about 41,496 in3 (680 dm3)
Rate Of Fire 1.5 - 2 rounds per minute
Note: At the loading angle of +3 degrees, a firing cycle of about 30 seconds could be achieved. However, this would equate to a range of no more than 6,560 yards (6,000 m). The additional elevation and depression times required to reach an elevation of 41 degrees increased the firing cycle by about 11 seconds. As can be seen in the Range Table below, most ship-to-ship actions would rarely exceed an elevation of 20 degrees, so an intermediate time of 35 seconds would seem to be reasonable for most battle-range engagements.

[Michigan_Guy]

Thanks for the link and info! I'm actually kind suprised at how fast they could reload those guns, very impressive!

[Dreadnought]

Wow thats some good info TH.

Surprisingly the Iowa's have 96 grooves to the barrel approx .250 thick in depth. Enough to give the shell exactly two complete rotations over some 66 feet of barrel (without breech) before releasing it like a quaterback throwing a perfect spiral.

I may be slighty off in numbers but I can check. I have both the 16"/50 rifle details and the turret/turret mounting details both together on the shelf.

[dundonrl]

The shells of the Yamato are HUGE.. they make the 16" shells of the Iowa's look like toys. Somewhere I have pictures of myself standing by 2 of them that are at COMPACFLT HQ in Pearl Harbor (the 2 shells are practice rounds that were brought to the US in the 70's I think, there are 2 more of them in Japan)

[Dreadnought]

The shells of the Yamato are HUGE.. they make the 16" shells of the Iowa's look like toys. Somewhere I have pictures of myself standing by 2 of them that are at COMPACFLT HQ in Pearl Harbor (the 2 shells are practice rounds that were brought to the US in the 70's I think, there are 2 more of them in Japan)

Huge? As in comparrison? I wouldnt say that. Look like toys? LMAO I wouldnt say that either.

[Shipwreck]

The shells of the Yamato are HUGE.. they make the 16" shells of the Iowa's look like toys.

Type 91 (right) is the 3,219-lb APC for the Japanese 18.1"/45.

Mark-8 (left) is the 2,700-lb AP for the USN 16"/50.

[dundonrl]

Type 91 (right) is the 3,219-lb APC for the Japanese 18.1"/45.

Mark-8 (left) is the 2,700-lb AP for the USN 16"/50.

need to find the photos that I have of the Japanese shells, they are atleast 7 ft long.. and tower over me.. the shells that I saw for the Missouri, when I was at Pearl Harbor coming home from westpac in September looked no where near as large (didn't take any of them with me standing by them) but they were defintely shorter than I am.. maybe they were a different type of shell, and not the AP shells for the Iowas..

[Shipwreck]

need to find the photos that I have of the Japanese shells, they are atleast 7 ft long.. and tower over me..

None of the Japanese 18.1" projectiles exceeded 81 inches in length.

The 18.1" bullets at CINPAC HQ are Type 91 APC modified for target practice. They were brought to Hawaii in April of 1971.

[Dreadnought]

As far as I can recall the Iowa's AP round comes in about 5 foot in height give or take a few inches.

[DaveMori]

Gun Max Range Yds Reload Time Rel penetration
Yamato 18.1 inch C45 Guns: 45960 31 sec 34 inches armr
USS Iowa 16 inch C45 Guns: 36900 30 29 inches armr

Source: Fighting Steel Manual - SSI, Inc -(c) 1999

SSI's manual was extremely well researched. I knew some of the people who worked on that computer simulation.

There was another game from 1992 called Task Force 1942, done by MicroProse, which included a manual that had very well researched gun ranges and rates.

Some of the sources for their research came from these books:

The Imperial Japanese Navy by AJ Watts & B.G. Gordon - (c) 1971 disagrees slightly on max range and significantly on recycle time: (Page 70)

18.1 inch Shell Weight: 3320 Lbs
Max Range: 45,275 Yards at an elevation of 45 degrees
Rate of Fire: one round per gun every 90 seconds

My guess is that Watts and Gordon are factoring in the sighting and aiming and elevation procedures into the rate of fire, while the SSI manual simply factors in gun and weapons reload time.

Warships of the Imperial Japanese Navy 1869-1945 Naval Institute Press (c) 1970 adds in some other information: (Page 10)

TYPE 94 Gun 1939
Bore: 18.11 inches (46 cm true) Breech loader (BL)
AP load: 3220 Lbs Muzzle Velocity: 2556 fps
HE Load: 3000 lbs Muzzle Velocity: 2640 fps

The extreme accuracy of the guns was quoted in the book Battleship Mushashi by Akira Yoshimura(c) 1991. Pages 1267-7 discuss the initial live fire tests at a range of 38,000 meters - (38 km - horizon range):

"The precision of the main guns was beyond everyone's expectations"

[BB62squid]

Gun Max Range Yds Reload Time Rel penetration
Yamato 18.1 inch C45 Guns: 45960 31 sec 34 inches armr
USS Iowa 16 inch C45 Guns: 36900 30 29 inches armr

Source: Fighting Steel Manual - SSI, Inc -(c) 1999

SSI's manual was extremely well researched. I knew some of the people who worked on that computer simulation.

There was another game from 1992 called Task Force 1942, done by MicroProse, which included a manual that had very well researched gun ranges and rates.

Some of the sources for their research came from these books:

The Imperial Japanese Navy by AJ Watts & B.G. Gordon - (c) 1971 disagrees slightly on max range and significantly on recycle time: (Page 70)

18.1 inch Shell Weight: 3320 Lbs
Max Range: 45,275 Yards at an elevation of 45 degrees
Rate of Fire: one round per gun every 90 seconds

My guess is that Watts and Gordon are factoring in the sighting and aiming and elevation procedures into the rate of fire, while the SSI manual simply factors in gun and weapons reload time.

Warships of the Imperial Japanese Navy 1869-1945 Naval Institute Press (c) 1970 adds in some other information: (Page 10)

TYPE 94 Gun 1939
Bore: 18.11 inches (46 cm true) Breech loader (BL)
AP load: 3220 Lbs Muzzle Velocity: 2556 fps
HE Load: 3000 lbs Muzzle Velocity: 2640 fps

The extreme accuracy of the guns was quoted in the book Battleship Mushashi by Akira Yoshimura(c) 1991. Pages 1267-7 discuss the initial live fire tests at a range of 38,000 meters - (38 km - horizon range):

"The precision of the main guns was beyond everyone's expectations"

ummm...the Iowa's didnt carry the 16"/45; we were the only battleships fitted with the Mk 7 16"/50 cal--the Montana's would have shipped the same gun had they been built.
The SoDak and NC classes carried the 16"/45 cal gun.

Fighting Steel was a great game, s**t graphics, but a game nonetheless. There are too many artificial aspects to consider it reliable. Moreover, SSI's game only covered the time period of 1939-1943; the Iowa class was not included in the original game, nor were their guns.
The great efforts of the team at navalwarfare.org and the FS project have done a phenomenal job correcting some of the defeciencies in the original.
That having been said, I would'nt trust any results short of that produced by the NPG.

Aloha

[Tiornu]

Gun Max Range Yds Reload Time Rel penetration
Yamato 18.1 inch C45 Guns: 45960 31 sec 34 inches armr
USS Iowa 16 inch C45 Guns: 36900 30 29 inches armr

It's common, though I don't know why, to compare belt penetration while kind of skipping over deck penetration. The Americans went whole-hog for deck penetration with their super-heavies that came out c1936-37.

[Dreadnought]

It's common, though I don't know why, to compare belt penetration while kind of skipping over deck penetration. The Americans went whole-hog for deck penetration with their super-heavies that came out c1936-37.

Much agreed, The USN's doctrine was stand off distance and penetrate at will with an option to open the range if necessary. Where as we know the closest encounter the Iowa's would have had with Yamato didnt materialize at Leyte. However, If the two classes had met at that time it may have ended with Yamato facing both New Jersey and the Iowa.

[gunnut]

This is a pretty cool site for all you battleship fans:

Nihon Kaigun


The page with stats on guns:

Best Battleship: Guns