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View Full Version : JSF vs Rafale vs EF-2000



indianguy4u
18 Jul 05,, 17:30
Guys what do u think which of these AC will prevail against the other.

Rafale:


RAFALE MULTI-ROLE COMBAT FIGHTER, FRANCE
Rafale is a twin-jet combat aircraft capable of carrying out a wide range of short- and long-range missions, including ground and sea attack, air defence and air superiority, reconnaissance, and high-accuracy strike or nuclear strike deterrence.

The aircraft has been developed for the French Air Force and Navy. 61 aircraft were ordered (36 for the Air Force and 25 for the Navy) and in September 2004, a further 59 aircraft (11 two-seater and 36 single-seat for the Air Force and 12 Rafale M for the Navy, delivery 2008 to 2012) out of a total requirement of around 300 (234 for the Air Force and 60 for the Navy). The Rafale is produced in three variants - M, B and C. The Rafale M variant is a single-seater carrier-based version for the navy, while B and C are two-seat and single-seat versions respectively for the Air Force. The Rafale M entered service in 2001 and ten have been delivered. Seven aircraft are operational on the Charles de Gaulle aircraft carrier. Four Rafale B aircraft and one Rafale C have been delivered to the Air Force. Rafale B and C will enter service with the RAF by the end of 2005.

Rafale fighters delivered to the Navy so far are F1 standard with air-to-air capability. F2 standard with air-to-ground missiles will begin an initial testing phase at Mont-de-Marsan military flight test center from September 2004. A contract to develop the fully capable F3 standard aircraft with Thales terrain-following RBE2 3D radar, Thales RECO NG optronics pod and the capability to launch ASMP-A nuclear missiles and AM39 Exocet anti-ship missiles was signed in February 2004. An order for 59 F3 aircraft, 47 for the Air Force (11 two-seat and 36 single-seat) and 12 (single-seat) for the Navy, was placed in December 2004. The Rafale F3 will be delivered from 2007 and the first squadron of 20 aircraft will be in service in 2008.

COCKPIT
The cockpit has hands-on throttle and stick control (HOTAS). The cockpit is equipped with a head-up, wide-angle holographic display from Thales Avionique, which provides aircraft control data, mission data and firing cues. A collimated, multi-image head-level display presents tactical situation and sensor data, and two touch-screen lateral displays show the aircraft system parameters and mission data. The pilot also has a helmet-mounted sight and display. A CCD camera and on-board recorder records the image of the head-up display throughout the mission.

WEAPONS
The Rafale can carry payloads of over nine tons on 14 hardpoints for the Air Force version, and 13 for the naval version. The range of weapons includes: Mica, Magic, Sidewinder, ASRAAM and AMRAAM air-to-air missiles; Apache, AS30L, ALARM, HARM, Maverick and PGM100 air-to-ground missiles; and Exocet/AM39, Penguin 3 and Harpoon anti-ship missiles. For a strategic mission the Rafale can deliver the MBDA (formerly Aerospatiale) ASMP standoff nuclear missile. In December 2004, the MBDA Storm Shadow / Scalp EG stand-off cruise missile was qualified on the Rafale.

From 2006, the Rafale will also be armed with the Sagem AASM precision-guided bomb, which has both GPS / inertial guidance and, optionally, imaging infrared terminal guidance.

The Rafale has a twin-gun pod and a GIAT 30mm DEFA 791B cannon which can fire 2,500 rounds per minute.

The Rafale is equipped with laser designation pods for laser guidance of air-to-ground missiles.

COUNTERMEASURES
The Rafale's electronic warfare system is the Spectra from Thales. Spectra incorporates solid state transmitter technology, radar warner, DAL laser warning receiver, missile warning, detection systems and jammers.

SENSORS
The Rafale is equipped with an RBE2 radar, developed by Thales, which has look-down and shoot-down capability. The radar can track up to eight targets simultaneously and provides threat identification and prioritisation.

The optronic systems include the Thales/SAGEM OSF infrared search and track system, installed in the nose of the aircraft. The optronic suite carries out search, target identification, telemetry and automatic target discrimination and tracking.

NAVIGATION AND COMMUNICATIONS
The communications suite on the Rafale uses the Saturn onboard V/UHF radio, which is a second-generation, anti-jam tactical UHF radio for NATO. Saturn provides voice encryption in fast-frequency hopping mode. The aircraft is also equipped with fixed-frequency VHF/UHF radio for communications with civil air traffic control. A multifunction information distribution system (MIDS) terminal provides secure, high-data-rate tactical data exchange with NATO C2 stations, AWACS aircraft or naval ships.

Rafale is equipped with a Thales TLS 2000 navigation receiver, which is used for the approach phase of flight. The TLS 2000 integrates the instrument landing system (ILS), microwave landing system (MLS) and VHF Omni-directional Radio-ranger (VOR) and marker functions.

The radar altimeter is the AHV 17 altimeter from Thales, which is suitable for very low flight. The Rafale has a TACAN tactical air navigation receiver for en route navigation and as a landing aid.

The Rafale has an SB25A combined interrogator-transponder developed by Thales. The SB25A is the first IFF using electronic scanning technology.

ENGINE
The Rafale is powered by two M88-2 engines from SNECMA, each providing a thrust of 75kN. The aircraft is equipped for buddy-buddy refuelling with a flight refuelling hose reel and drogue pack.

Messier-Dowty provides the "jumper" landing gear, designed to spring out when the aircraft is catapulted by the nose gear strut.


JSF:


JSF (F35) JOINT STRIKE FIGHTER, INTERNATIONAL
The Joint Strike Fighter, the JSF, is being developed by Lockheed Martin Aeronautics Company for the US Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps and the UK Royal Navy. The stealthy, supersonic multi-role fighter is to be designated the F-35. The JSF is being built in three variants: a conventional take-off and landing aircraft (CTOL) for the US Air Force; a carrier based variant (CV) for the US Navy; and a short take-off and vertical landing (STOVL) aircraft for the US Marine Corps and the Royal Navy. A 70 – 90% commonality is required for all variants.

The requirement is for: USAF F-35A –air-to-ground strike aircraft, replacing F-16 and A-10, complementing F-22 (1763); USMC F-35B – STOVL strike fighter to replace F/A-18B/C and AV-8B (480); UK RN F-35C – STOVL strike fighter to replace Sea Harriers (60); US Navy F-35C – first-day-of-war strike fighter to replace F/A-18B/C and A-6, complementing the F/A-18E/F (480 aircraft). In January 2001, the UK MOD signed a memorandum of understanding to co-operate in the SDD (System Development and Demonstration) phase of JSF and, in September 2002, selected the STOVL variant to fulfil the Future Joint Combat Aircraft (FJCA) requirement. Following the contract award, other nations signed up to the SDD phase are: Australia, Canada, Denmark, Italy, Netherlands, Norway, Singapore and Turkey.

The Concept Demonstration Phase of the programme began in November 1996 with the award of contracts to two consortia, led by Boeing Aerospace and Lockheed Martin. The contracts involved the building of demonstrator aircraft for three different configurations of JSF, with one of the two consortia to be selected for the development and manufacture of all three variants.

In October 2001, an international team led by Lockheed Martin was awarded the contract to build JSF. An initial 22 aircraft (14 flying test aircraft and eight ground-test aircraft) will be built in the programs System Development and Demonstration (SDD) phase. Flight testing will be carried out at Edwards Air Force Base, California, and Naval Air Station, Patuxent River, Maryland. In April 2003, JSF completed a successful Preliminary Design Review (PDR). The Critical Design Review has been postponed from April 2004 to February 2006. The first CTOL F-35A began final assembly in May 2005 and is scheduled for its first flight in August 2006. The STOVL F-35B first flight is set for 2007. The F-35A fighter is expected to enter service in 2008, the F-35B in 2012.

In September 2004, Lockheed Martin announced that, following concerns over the weight of the STOVL F-35B, design changes had reduced the aircraft weight by 1,225kg while increasing propulsion efficiency and reducing drag. The weight requirements will also call for a smaller internal weapons bay than on the other variants.

The Lockheed Martin JSF team includes Northrop Grumman, BAE Systems, Pratt and Whitney and Rolls-Royce. Final assembly of the aircraft will take place at Lockheed Martin's Fort Worth plant in Texas. Major subassemblies will be produced by Northrop Grumman Integrated Systems at El Segundo, California and BAE Systems at Samlesbury, Lancashire, England. BAE Systems is responsible for the design and integration of the aft fuselage, horizontal and vertical tails and the wing-fold mechanism for the CV variant, using experience from the Harrier STOVL programme.

DESIGN
In order to minimise the structural weight and complexity of assembly, the wingbox section integrates the wing and fuselage section into one piece. To minimise radar signature, sweep angles are identical for the leading and trailing edges of the wing and tail (planform alignment). The fuselage and canopy have sloping sides. The seam of the canopy and the weapon bay doors are sawtoothed and the vertical tails are canted at an angle.

The Marine variant of JSF is very similar to the Air Force variant, but with a slightly shorter range because some of the space used for fuel is used for the lift fan of the STOVL propulsion system. The main differences between the naval variant and the other versions of JSF are associated with the carrier operations. The internal structure of the naval version is very strong to withstand the high loading of catapult assisted launches and tailhook arrested landings. The aircraft has larger wing and tail control surfaces for low speed approaches for carrier landing. Larger leading edge flaps and foldable wingtip sections provide a larger wing area, which provides an increased range and payload capacity.

The canopy, radar and most of the avionics are common to the three variants.

WEAPONS
Weapons are carried in two parallel bays located in front of the landing gear. Each weapons bay is fitted with two hardpoints for carrying a range of bombs and missiles. Weapons to be cleared for internal carriage include: JDAM (Joint Direct Attack Munition), CBU-105 WCMD (Wind-Corrected Munitions Dispenser) for the Sensor-Fuzed Weapon, JSOW (Joint StandOff Weapon), Paveway II guided bombs, AIM-120C AMRAAM air-to-air missile; for external carriage: JASSM (Joint Air-to-Surface Standoff Missile), AIM-9X Sidewinder and Storm Shadow cruise missile.

In September 2002, General Dynamics Armament and Technical Products was selected as the gun system integrator. The air force variant has an internally mounted gun. The Carrier and Marine variants can have an external gun pod fitted.

TARGETING
Lockheed Martin Missile & Fire Control and Northrop Grumman Electronic Sensors and Systems are jointly responsible for the JSF electro-optical system. A Lockheed Martin electro-optical targeting system (EOTS) will provide long-range detection and precision targeting, along with the Northrop Grumman DAS (Distributed Aperture System) thermal imaging system. EOTS will be based on the Sniper XL pod developed for the F-16, which incorporates a mid-wave third generation FLIR, dual mode laser, CCD TV, laser tracker and laser marker. BAE Systems Avionics in Edinburgh, Scotland will provide the laser systems. DAS consists of multiple infrared cameras (supplied by Indigo Systems of Goleta, California) providing 360º coverage using advanced signal conditioning algorithms. As well as situational awareness, DAS provides navigation, missile warning and infrared search and track (IRST). EOTS is embedded under the aircraft’s nose, and DAS sensors are fitted at multiple locations on the aircraft.

RADAR
Northrop Grumman Electronic Systems is developing the advanced electronically scanned array (AESA) AN/APG-81 multi-function radar. The AN/APG-81AESA will combine an integrated radio frequency subsystem with a multifunction array. The radar system will also incorporate the agile beam steering capabilities developed for the APG-77. Northrop Grumman delivered the first radar to Lockheed Martin in March 2005 for flight testing.

COUNTERMEASURES
BAE Systems Information & Electronic Warfare Systems (IEWS) will be responsible for the JSF integrated electronic warfare suite, which will be installed internally and have some subsystems from Northrop Grumman. BAE is developing a new digital radar warning receiver for the F-35.

AVIONICS SYSTEMS
The following will supply the F-35 avionics systems: BAE Systems Avionics - side stick and throttle controls; Vision Systems International (a partnership between Kaiser Electronics and Elbit of Israel) - advanced helmet-mounted display; BAE Systems Platform Solutions - alternate design helmet-mounted display, based on the binocular helmet being developed for the Eurofighter Typhoon; Ball Aerospace - Communications, Navigation and Information (CNI) integrated body antenna suite (one S-band, two UHF, two radar altimeter, three L-band antennas per aircraft); Harris Corporation - advanced avionics systems, infrastructure, image processing, digital map software, fibre optics, high-speed communications links and part of the Communications, Navigation and Information (CNI) system; Honeywell - radar altimeter, inertial navigation / global positioning system (INS/GPS) and air data transducers; Raytheon - 24-channel GPS (Global Positioning System) with digital anti-jam receiver (DAR).

SYSTEMS
Other suppliers will include: ATK Composites - upper wing skins; Vought Aircraft Industries - lower wing skins; Smiths Aerospace - electronic control systems and electrical power system (with Hamilton Sundstrand), integrated canopy frame; Honeywell - landing system's wheels and brakes, onboard oxygen-generating system (OBOGS), engine components, power and thermal management system driven by integrated auxiliary power unit (APU); Parker Aerospace - fuel system, hydraulics for lift fan, primary flight control electrohydrostatic actuators (with Moog Inc), engine controls and accessories; EDO Corporation - pneumatic weapon delivery system; Goodrich - lift-fan anti-icing system; Stork Aerospace - electrical wiring.

PROPULSION
Early production lots of all three variants will be powered by the Pratt and Whitney afterburning turbofan F-135 engine, a derivative of the F119 fitted on the F-22. Following production aircraft will be powered by either the F135 or the F-136 turbofan being developed by General Electric and Rolls-Royce. The F136 engine began ground testing in July 2004. Delivery of the first production engine is scheduled for 2011. Hamilton Sundstrand is providing the engine control system and gearbox.

On the F-35B, the engine is coupled with a shaft-driven lift fan system for STOVL propulsion. The lift fan has been developed by Rolls-Royce Defence. Doors installed above and below the vertical fan open as the fin spins up to provide vertical lift. The main engine has a three bearing swivelling exhaust nozzle. The nozzle, which is supplemented by two roll control ducts on the inboard section of the wing, together with the vertical lift fan provide the required STOVL capability.


EF 2000:


EUROFIGHTER TYPHOON MULTI-ROLE COMBAT FIGHTER, EUROPE
The four-nation Eurofighter Typhoon is a foreplane delta-wing, beyond-visual-range, close air fighter aircraft with surface attack capability. Eurofighter has 'supercruise' capability: it can fly at sustained speeds of over Mach 1 without the use of afterburner.

Development of the aircraft has been carried out by Eurofighter GmbH, based in Munich and wholly owned by BAE Systems of the UK, Alenia Aeronautica of Italy and the EADS Deutschland (formerly DaimlerChrysler) and EADS Spain (formerly CASA). In January 2003, Norway signed an agreement for industrial participation in the project, but has not committed to purchase of the fighter. The EJ200 engine has been developed by Eurojet GmbH, in Munich which is owned by Rolls Royce, MTU Aero Engines, Fiat Aviazione and ITP.

An overall production contract for 620 aircraft was signed in January 1998, with 232 for the UK, 180 for Germany, 121 for Italy and 87 for Spain. Initial orders have been placed for 148 aircraft: Germany (44), Italy (29), Spain (20) and the UK (55). Prime customer is the NATO Eurofighter and Tornado Management Agency (NETMA), representing the four governments. Series production of the aircraft is underway at EADS Military Aircraft (Germany), BAE Systems, Alenia Aeronautica and EADS CASA (Spain). The first four series production aircraft for the four participating nations took maiden flights in February 2003 and the Eurofighter received type acceptance, a prerequisite for entry into service, by the four services on 30 June 2003. The first series production twin-seat aircraft were delivered to the German Air Force in August 2003, to the Spanish Air Force in September 2003, to the UK Royal Air Force in December 2003 and to the Italian Air Force in February 2004. The first single-seat Batch 2 aircraft were delivered to the four participating nations in early 2005.

The four participating nations signed the contract for Tranche 2 production in December 2004. Tranche 2 comprises 236 aircraft: Germany 68, Italy 46, Spain 33 and UK 89. Tranche 2 deliveries are scheduled to begin in 2008 with final deliveries scheduled for 2015.

Greece also selected the Eurofighter but a change of government has led to a reconsideration of the procurement of 60 aircraft. Austria signed a contract for 18 Eurofighter aircraft in August 2003, to be delivered from 2007.

In June 2004, two UK RAF Typhoons flew to Singapore for evaluation by the Singapore Air Force.

DESIGN

The aircraft is constructed of carbon fire composites, glass-reinforced plastic, aluminium lithium, titanium and aluminium casting. Stealth technology features includelow frontal radar cross-section, passive sensors and supercruise ability.

The foreplane/delta configuration is intentionally aerodynamically unstable which provides a high level of agility (particularly at supersonic speeds), low drag and enhanced lift. The pilot controls the aircraft through a computerised digital fly-by-wire system which provides artificial stabilisation and gust elevation to give good control characteristics throughout the flight envelope.

COCKPIT
The pilot's control system is a voice-throttle-and-stick system (VTAS). The stick and throttle tops house 24 fingertip controls for sensor and weapon control, defence aids management, and inflight handling. The direct voice input allows the pilot to carry out mode selection and data entry procedures using voice command.

The quadruplex fly-by-wire flight control system has an Automatic Low Speed Recovery System (ALSR) which provides the pilot with visual and audio low speed warning and will, if necessary, automatically take control of the aircraft and return to safe flight.

The BAE Systems Striker Helmet Mounted Symbology System (HMS) and Head Up Display show the flight reference data, weapon aiming and cueing, and the FLIR imagery. BAE Systems TERPROM ground proximity warning system is being fitted. The cockpit has three multifunction, colour, head-down displays (MHDDs), which show the tactical situation, systems status and map displays. An international consortium EuroMIDS, which includes Data Link Solutions of the US, supplies the MIDS Low Volume Terminal provides Link 16 capability for secure transfer of data.

WEAPONS
The internally-mounted Mauser BK27mm gun is a revolver gun system with a linkless-closed ammunition feed system. The EurofighterTyphoon has 13 hard points for weapon carriage, four under each wing and five under the fuselage. An Armament Control System (ACS) manages weapons selection and firing and monitors weapon status.

Depending on role, the fighter can carry the following mix of missiles: air-superiority - six BVRAAM (Beyond Visual Range)/AMRAAM air-to-air missiles on semi-recessed fuselage stations and two ASRAAM short-range air-to-air missiles on the outer pylons; air interdiction - four AMRAAM, two ASRAAM, two cruise missiles and two anti-radar missiles (ARM); SEAD (Suppression of Enemy Air Defences) - four AMRAAM, two ASRAAM, six anti-radar missiles; multi-role - three AMRAAM, two ASRAAM, two ARM and two GBU-24 Paveway III/IV; close air support - four AMRAAM, two ASRAAM, 18 Brimstone anti-armour missiles; maritime attack - four AMRAAM, two ASRAAM, six anti-ship missiles.

The UK RAF has selected MBDA (formerly Matra BAe Dynamics) Meteor for the BVRAAM requirement and Raytheon AMRAAM until Meteor enters service. Meteor uses a new air-breathing ramjet motor for increased range and manoeuvrability. AMRAAM will be fitted from 2002 and Meteor around 2010. German, Italian and Spanish Eurofighters will carry the imaging infrared IRIS-T air-to-air missile being developed by BGT of Germany, expected to enter service in 2005. German and Spanish aircraft will also be armed with the Taurus KEPD 350 standoff missile from EADS/LFK and Saab Bofors. UK RAF Eurofighters will carry the MBDA Storm Shadow / Scalp EG stand-off cruise missile, which entered operational service on Tornado aircraft in March 2003, and also the MBDA Brimstone anti-armour missile which is to enter service in 2005. Italian aircraft will also be armed with Storm Shadow.

COUNTERMEASURES
The aircraft's defensive aids sub-system (DASS) is accommodated within the aircraft structure and integrated with the avionics system. DASS has been developed by the EuroDASS consortium - BAE Systems Avionics of the UK (prime contractor), Elettronica of Italy and Indra of Spain. The consortium was rejoined in October 2001 by EADS, after the German Federal Ministry of Defence contracted to re-enter the programmme. DASS provides an all-round prioritised assessment of threats with fully automatic response to single or multiple threats. DASS includes an electronic countermeasures/support measures system (ECM/ESM), front and rear missile approach warners, supersonically capable towed decoy systems, laser warning receivers and SaabTech Electronics BOL chaff and flare dispensing system. The avionics system is based on a NATO standard databus with fibre optic highways.

SENSORS
The aircraft is equipped with a CAPTOR (ECR 90) multi-mode X-band pulse Doppler radar, developed by the Euroradar consortium. The multi-mode radar has three processing channels. The third channel is used for jammer classification, interference blanking and sidelobe nulling. Euroradar is led by BAE Systems, with Indra of Spain, FIAR of Italy and EADS Defence Electronics of Germany.

The PIRATE (Passive Infra-Red Airborne Track Equipment) is mounted on the port side of the fuselage, forward of the windscreen. PIRATE has been developed by the EUROFIRST consortium which comprises Galileo Avionica (FIAR) of Italy (lead contractor), Thales Optronics of the UK (system technical authority) and Tecnobit of Spain. PIRATE operates in both 3-5 and 8-11 micron spectral bands. When used with the radar in an air-to-air role, it functions as an Infrared Search and Track system (IRST), providing passive target detection and tracking. In an air-to-surface role, it performs multiple target acquisition and identification, as well as providing a navigation and landing aid. PIRATE provides a steerable image to the pilot's helmet-mounted display.

ENGINE

The Eurofighter is equipped with two Eurojet EJ200 engines, each delivering thrust of 90kN in full reheat and 60kN in dry power mode. Single-stage turbines drive the three-stage fan and five-stage HP compressor. The engine features: digital control; wide chord aerofoils and single crystal turbine blades; a convergent /divergent exhaust nozzle; and integrated health monitoring.

http://www.airforce-technology.com/

hello
19 Jul 05,, 12:33
Its obviously the stealthy, 5th gen JSF. :biggrin:

indianguy4u
19 Jul 05,, 13:26
JSF is nothing but cheaper version for those countries who cannot afford F22. While Rafale & Eurofighter is the best of french & the british, spanish, german.

What one can generalise is JSF is modern day F 16s.

avon1944
02 Aug 05,, 23:58
> indianguy4u
> JSF is nothing but cheaper version for those countries who cannot afford F22. While Rafale
> & Eurofighter is the best of french & the british, spanish, german.
You have the wrong idea of the F-35. The Rafale and Typhoon are strike fighters. In essence advanced attack aircraft with with the latest ability for air to air combat. The F-35 is an attack aircraft with the ability in aerial combat of the F-16C Block #60 (which is substantial) in air to air combat. It is being designed to be a very good air to ground attack aircraft. It uses stealth to add to its ability in the air to ground and air to air roles. Stealth bring back the element of surprise to aerial combat.

Adrian

indianguy4u
09 Aug 05,, 09:34
But eurofighter & rafale is made with the intention of multi-role & not just for A2A missions & that too to be best this side of F22.

Northax
11 Aug 05,, 19:21
In BVR, I'll take the F-35 over the other two. In WVR, the other two have an advantage over the F-35, since they both have better maneuverability with canards and a more unstable airframe; however, this will most likely be left up to which has the better short-range AAM. From what I saw in a video, the AIM-9X is very nice, making U-turns on a dime, pulling 30-40 g turns.

WVR gunfight (no AAM's), the F-35 (in my opinion) loses hands down if all pilots are of equal skill and set up at equal range, in equally level postitions. The F-35 was never intended to be 'super-maneuverable', but more stealthy for BVR engagements. The F-35 has no canards, since those higher a jets' RCS; thus the F-35 has it's weak spot: WVR, in a gunfight. The Rafale and EF2k both have canards to help in maneuverability, and more unstable airframes. WVR gunfight is extremely unlikely to happen in present day time; it's not 1945, where they relied soley upon maneuverability to gain the advantage over their enemy and shoot him out of the sky with their guns. Yet, should be included, since it IS possible to happen.

BVR: The F-35 is more stealthy than both EF2k and Rafale, so this is it's strongpoint. Now one'd have to compare the long range air-to-air missiles, radar, jamming systems, etc. used by these aircraft, to see which has a certain advantage over the others.

avon1944
15 Aug 05,, 23:32
> indianguy4u
> eurofighter & rafale is made with the intention of multi-role & not just for A2A missions
It was a French test pilot who phrased it this way, the Rafale is an "omni-role" aircraft while the Typhoon is a strike fighter! The Rafale gives up a little in the air to air role in order to boost the overall performance in several other roles. The Typhoon is an air superiority first, then a multi-role fighter. From what Rafale and other test pilots have said or implied, the

The F-35 is a fighter of which the USAF in the air to air role will be just a little bit better than the current fighters -F-16C, F/A-18C/D. What it will bring is this performance is a stealthier airframe plus carry its weapons internally. All of this with a range which is far greater than any of the attack aircraft by a significant amount.

Adrian

JASOOS VIJAY
29 Aug 05,, 09:33
avon,
How can f35 be jack of all trades. Their has to be trade offs there too isnt it?