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sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 08:21
Hi bikers of WAB,

Been discussing this with biker friends for some time now, as well as on biker forums I post on.

This is what I currently ride ..... a pretty crazy 200 cc single. Tops out at 140 kmph.

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This is what I eventually want to ride ...... a cult super sport beating 690 cc single, only its a minimum 2 years away for us here. Tops out at 195+ kmph, but gets there crazy quick, and is a wheelie monster. :)

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But while what I ride is a great little hooligan bike, and fantastic to dice in the twisties, it shows its limitations on the straights. Especially as I ride in groups where there are a lot of bigger much faster bikes, and keeping up till we hit the twisty bits is a pain. Once there, of course, it more balls than bike!

Basically I'm a little bored and want a change. But I dont want to wait 2 years either. I want it now! So I want a stop gap bike till bike No. 1 gets launched here. Don't want to break the bank either, as I would anyways lose money when I sell my current bike as well as when I sell my stop gap bike 2 years from now.

So will be buying a used clean low miles bike.

Now these are the two contenders. Both of the above are singles. Both of the below are twins. Both of the above are nakeds. Both of the below are faired sports bikes/sports tourers.

A 250 cc twin ...... the undefeated best in segment entry level sport bike.

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And its 650 cc bigger brother ...... the perfect all-rounder sports tourer.

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The 250 I can get putting hardly any money over and above what I get for my present bike. But its been discontinued, replaced by a 300. parts are hence more difficult to get. There are new competitors about to be launched in the market (a 390 cc single from KTM and a 250cc twin from Yamaha), which will drive the Kawasaki's resale down even further. Tops out at 165 kmph, but dead below 6000 rpm.

The 650 on the other hand will require me to put in at least twice as much extra over what I get for my current bike. But its a bigger bike, lot more power, does an indicated 210 kmph stock, and has decent low end torque and a wicked mid range. Plus there are no other competitors in this bracket there currently nor expected in the next two years, not at least in the same price band. So the resale should not crash as bad as for the 250. This 650 has been replaced by a newer version, but a lot of the parts are common as well.

But if I buy the 650 now, sinking in a lot of extra cash, I will feel pretty miserable when the 690 comes out. Because most foreign comparos and tests say the 690, even though its a tad slower at the top end, is a lot more exciting than the slightly "boring" 650. Plus the 690 would be nearly 40-50 kilos lighter than the 650 (which I did find a bit heavy and bulky the couple of times I got to ride one).

What do you guys suggest? Any experiences on either of these machines? Or the one I'm looking forward to? All inputs and advice would be greatly welcome and appreciated please!

P.S. My riding is mainly rides on the weekends (max 300-400 km round trips), once a year proper multi day (8-10 days) tour into the mountains (winters), with a few smaller 2-5 day rides also thrown in (mainly during the monsoons and winters). Typically around 10-odd thousand kilometers a year.

lemontree
11 Jun 14,, 10:30
Nice bike for open roads, but it tends to heat up in city rides (in Mumbai atleast).
I am not very happy with the sound. It looks good, but this is not for me.

I still own my old 100cc Splendor, that I bought when I was in the army. I dont think I can ever sell it.

I have been thinking of going in for a new bike and contemplating between the - Royal Enfield Classic (in Desert colour) vs The Continental GT vs the Harley Davidson Super Low.

Doktor
11 Jun 14,, 10:37
What?! No KTM?

For the Captain I can see what catches his eye, but you SB?

In general, as with everything else with tech in it, go with something that is topseller on your market. That way you will avoid headaches with spares and mechanics later.

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 10:52
Nice bike for open roads, but it tends to heat up in city rides (in Mumbai atleast).
I am not very happy with the sound. It looks good, but this is not for me.

Which one are you talking about here? All of the above are high strung motors which will heat in the city traffic. And I agree on the sound. The 650 actually sounds best from what I've heard (I did hear and see a 690 in the flesh once in Europe and once in the US - its basicaly a big 200).


I still own my old 100cc Splendor, that I bought when I was in the army. I dont think I can ever sell it.

Unfortunately I sold my KB100 RTZ when I got married. Worst thing I did. I miss her.


I have been thinking of going in for a new bike and contemplating between the - Royal Enfield Classic (in Desert colour) vs The Continental GT vs the Harley Davidson Super Low.

A fauji must have a Bullet! Have you thought about the Thunderbird 500? Really nice and refined bike. Munches miles beautifully. Good lights too (projectors). Of the ones you like, the Continental is a cafe racer. Not very practical, unles your back is still strong and you dont mind riding all over with your ass in the air! LOL But its a neat bike (the yellow one I love). The Desert Storm is ok. I used to have a maroon Classic 500. Did not like it much frankly. Give me an old iron Bullet any day.

I'm not a Harley guy. But yes the Super Low is good. Better that the Sportster. I would also suggest the Street, but its small (and I don't know how tall you are) and it does not sound like a Harley. But its got a good peppy (by Harley standards) motor.

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 10:56
What?! No KTM?

For the Captain I can see what catches his eye, but you SB?

In general, as with everything else with tech in it, go with something that is topseller on your market. That way you will avoid headaches with spares and mechanics later.

The first two are both KTMs. The next two are Kawasakis. Both sold and serviced and supported by the same company. Bajaj. Which actually owns KTM.

None of these 4 will ever be topsellers. The motorcycle market in India is not a mature one, though its getting there. The majority are still commuter bikes which give very good mileage and are used by people to ride to office and back.

Recreational biking and performanc bikes are a very very small minority. The numbers are nowhere close. Thousands versus hundreds of thousands (even millions for some models/manufacturers).

Doktor
11 Jun 14,, 11:01
The first two are both KTMs. The next two are Kawasakis. Both sold and serviced and supported by the same company. Bajaj. Which actually owns KTM.

None of these 4 will ever be topsellers. The motorcycle market in India is not a mature one, though its getting there. The majority are still commuter bikes which give very god mileage and are used by people to ride to office and back.

Recreational biking and performanc bikes are a very very small minority. The numbers are nowhere close. Thousands versus hundreds of thousands (even millions for some models/manufacturers).

I was having Enduro line in mind.

Gues the roads got better ;)

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 11:09
I was having Enduro line in mind.

Gues the roads got better ;)

No they are as miserable as they have always been.

This is what they did to my front rim just a couple of weeks ago, when I hit a pothole on a ride late at night with some friends .....

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lemontree
11 Jun 14,, 13:33
Which one are you talking about here?
I was mentioning the KTMs.

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 14:00
I was mentioning the KTMs.

I have a 200, and the heat is very manageable. Enough to ride in shorts and floaters to go get milk and eggs if you want to. I was part of a team of riders that did the pre-launch field testing of the 390. Now that bike generates some serious heat.

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 14:22
Btw, LT, if you're looking at Harley-esque price point, then I would very seriously recommend this bike to you ...... WAYYYYY better.

And its British too. ;)

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Your's for 7.5 lacs only (less than or near about the same as the Super Low, and will run rings around the Super Low).

Doktor
11 Jun 14,, 14:35
Triumph vs Harley.

This SB's way of revenge.

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 14:39
Triumph vs Harley.

This SB's way of revenge.

This is again into unchartered political territory. I have both American as well as British friends. But I'm solidly mainland Europe in my taste for cars and bikes. Nothing against the Japanese of course.

Doktor
11 Jun 14,, 15:23
You got it all wrong.

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 15:26
You got it all wrong.

You are way too cryptic for me as usual then. :)

Revenge, Triumph, Harley, LT, me (SB)?????

A game of clues maybe ..... ? Damn, you retook the No. 1 spot again!

Doktor
11 Jun 14,, 15:43
You are way too cryptic for me as usual then. :)

Revenge, Triumph, Harley, LT, me (SB)?????

A game of clues maybe ..... ? Damn, you retook the No. 1 spot again!

It's not fair to put a biker into a dilemma to pick between a Triumph and a Harley. Not because one is British and the other is American, but because it's like showing a kid 2 of her favorite chocs and ask her to pick only 1.

Double Edge
11 Jun 14,, 17:24
Well SB, i can see you certainly don't short change yourself when it comes to bikes :biggrin:

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 17:34
oh yes i do.

or i would be buying a dorsoduro .

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Doktor
11 Jun 14,, 17:38
Well SB, i can see you certainly don't short change yourself when it comes to bikes :biggrin:

He just saved some pocket cash on his daughter phone ;)

Double Edge
11 Jun 14,, 17:42
This is what I currently ride ..... a pretty crazy 200 cc single. Tops out at 140 kmph.

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My nephew has this one, went for a little ride and held on for dear life. It's got an amazing pick up.

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 17:49
see i am young at heart.

most of the guys i ride with are half my age.

probably younger than ur nephew too.

its a heady trip when u kick their ass and u take off ur helmet and some of them see u for the first time. :D

sated buddha
11 Jun 14,, 17:51
can u make out i am typing fro
m my phone?

Stitch
11 Jun 14,, 18:15
I've always been partial to the GSX-R 750 myself, but that's probably more bike than you need:

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Doktor
11 Jun 14,, 18:49
I've always been partial to the GSX-R 750 myself, but that's probably more bike than you need:

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Nice bike. From everything I've read, not one for the Indian roads.

SB,

Have you met a doctor similar age with you on a KTM? If memory serves me well he is from the northern parts of India.

bolo121
11 Jun 14,, 20:03
My pulsar 200 is crossing 7 years.
I think it will be my last bike. Riding used to be fun and a rush of blood to the head.
Nowadays its just wrist hurts, back aches and I feel stiff all over.
Plus back in the day, I could never stand anyone with a lower cc count overtaking. I went to office last week and a punk on a ktm blasted past.
All I felt was meh, its bangalore roads he'll be dead soon enough.

I plan to downgrade to the usual honda activa for short commutes, running errands and so on.

sated buddha
12 Jun 14,, 08:03
I've always been partial to the GSX-R 750 myself, but that's probably more bike than you need:


I love the zukis man. None of the big 4 sound quite as banshee mean!

Its not about being more bike. There are tons of superbike clubs all over the country with thousands of liter class or above bikes. Some of the riders of course are posers and their bikes garage queens taken out only weekend to weekend, if at all. But there are many really good riders, who do push hard regularly, and we do have some roads where you can exploit some of the upper range of these bikes, if only for short sections and momentarily. But that said, the group I ride with, bigger bikes happily cruise at 160-180, and when they find the gaps they are GONE (240+)!!!

But you canot use these bikes everywhere, and since I cannot indulge my self to the extent of having a screamer as well as an all-dual-purpose bike in my garage, I'd have to choose to get one which can hold its own on the straights, give me the giggles on the twisty stuff, and not break to pieces once the roads end.

Any inputs on my original question - the baby Ninjette or the Ninja 650?

sated buddha
12 Jun 14,, 08:30
Nice bike. From everything I've read, not one for the Indian roads.

Not really true. India is a big country. We have both the bikes and the riders, as well as the roads.

The COPS .....

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The ACES .....

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The GODS ......

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SB,

Have you met a doctor similar age with you on a KTM? If memory serves me well he is from the northern parts of India.

I've met and have ridden and raced with quite a few. Do you mean someone in particular?

sated buddha
12 Jun 14,, 08:40
I plan to downgrade to the usual honda activa for short commutes, running errands and so on.

This is purely personal, so please don't take umbrage, but there are few sadder sights in this world than a one time biker riding a scooter.

Hope you rediscover your mojo!

sated buddha
12 Jun 14,, 08:43
It's not fair to put a biker into a dilemma to pick between a Triumph and a Harley. Not because one is British and the other is American, but because it's like showing a kid 2 of her favorite chocs and ask her to pick only 1.

Are you a biker Doktor? Sure do not sound like one.

I have yet to meet a biker who gets equally orgasmic about a Triumph (or any Brit) and a Hog at the same time ......

They are just simply mutually exclusive tastes.

lemontree
12 Jun 14,, 08:45
It's not fair to put a biker into a dilemma to pick between a Triumph and a Harley. Not because one is British and the other is American, but because it's like showing a kid 2 of her favorite chocs and ask her to pick only 1.

Exactly, ...lol..evil SB, for making me even more confused now.

These are all iconic bikes. I will choose a bike that will permit ease of maintenance. The problem with the Harley and Triumph is about few after sales service centers in Mumbai. I would have to check that out before I consider either one of them. I would'nt like to travel half the city for servicing the bike.

SB, you are right about the Continental GT being a pain in the back, but otherwise it is a smooth and fast bike. So this one is out for me.

I will check out the service back up of Harley with my coursemate, he owns a Harley and will look into the Triumph also.

sated buddha
12 Jun 14,, 09:04
Exactly, ...lol..evil SB, for making me even more confused now.

These are all iconic bikes. I will choose a bike that will permit ease of maintenance. The problem with the Harley and Triumph is about few after sales service centers in Mumbai. I would have to check that out before I consider either one of them. I would'nt like to travel half the city for servicing the bike.

SB, you are right about the Continental GT being a pain in the back, but otherwise it is a smooth and fast bike. So this one is out for me.

I will check out the service back up of Harley with my coursemate, he owns a Harley and will look into the Triumph also.

Actually post last night I have changed my mind bro. A langotiya yaar (childhood friend) of mine just picked up one yesterday. In my favorite color too.

The fit and finish of the bike, the equipment levels, the engine punch and refinement, and the overally sexiness factor is a serious jump over the rest of the Bullet stable. And if you are around 6 feet tall, the riding position is not too bad at all. In fact its much better than the Hinda CBR 250R which is considered to be a relaxed sports tourer.

Check out the photos. My friend is 6 feet tall so that should give you some idea. Do not write this bike off. Surefire chick magnet too ..... ;)

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On the Triumphs and Harleys, you need not worry about service etc. You live in India's largest megapolis. If you don't get service and support there, where else would you?!!! These bikes are built well and don't need much attention (can't say the same for the Bullet though - even the Continental GT). Just regular service and oil changes. And they have really long service intervals too compared to other Indian bikes.

Doktor
12 Jun 14,, 09:06
Are you a biker Doktor? Sure do not sound like one.

I have yet to meet a biker who gets equally orgasmic about a Triumph (or any Brit) and a Hog at the same time ......

They are just simply mutually exclusive tastes.

I promised myself I wont ski or bike ever again. Let's say I got all the warning signs. Flashing.

sated buddha
12 Jun 14,, 11:32
I promised myself I wont ski or bike ever again. Let's say I got all the warning signs. Flashing.

You got hurt?

Or did someone close to you?

Doktor
12 Jun 14,, 11:36
You got hurt?

Or did someone close to you?

On a bike I had a fall for not being careful to see the driver from the side street can't see a billboard size STOP sign. Had to brake and evade the car, but there was sand on the road and the back tire slipped. I went unscratched. The other day on the same place another biker didn't have my luck.

sated buddha
12 Jun 14,, 12:03
On a bike I had a fall for not being careful to see the driver from the side street can't see a billboard size STOP sign. Had to brake and evade the car, but there was sand on the road and the back tire slipped. I went unscratched. The other day on the same place another biker didn't have my luck.

I agree with you. A crash saps your confidence. The time to normalisation differs from rider to rider, crash to crash. Deaths in the community shake up everyone. Deaths close to you (in your club, your group, your buddies) infinitely more.

Its a very risky sport. No two ways about that.

I have had my share. My body is battered and bruised. Bones broken. Ligaments and menisci torn. Corneal injury. I am currently nursing a painful range of movement in my right shoulder.

sated buddha
12 Jun 14,, 14:21
Bump!

No bikers around here besides Stitch? :confused:

Doktor
12 Jun 14,, 15:09
Bump!

No bikers around here besides Stitch? :confused:

Aryajet and Herr Lukins will stop for a drink soon. I hope.

tankie
12 Jun 14,, 15:12
Btw, LT, if you're looking at Harley-esque price point, then I would very seriously recommend this bike to you ...... WAYYYYY better.

And its British too. ;)

37121

Your's for 7.5 lacs only (less than or near about the same as the Super Low, and will run rings around the Super Low).

And now built in USA

Doktor
12 Jun 14,, 15:22
And now built in USA

Just like RR engines during WW2. Crisis mate ;)

sated buddha
12 Jun 14,, 15:44
And now built in USA

Actually after the first CKD lots the future plans (the factory is almost ready per the grapevine) are for these bikes to be built in India. Just like the Harley Streets. And use India as a base for the rest of the developing world.

So Triumph, Royal Enfield, Land Rover, and Jaguar.

Maybe the Colonel is right after all .....

bolo121
12 Jun 14,, 19:55
This is purely personal, so please don't take umbrage, but there are few sadder sights in this world than a one time biker riding a scooter.

Hope you rediscover your mojo!

Mojo isnt the thing.
Like dok I see the writing on the wall.
Slower reflexes, times when i lose situational awareness and so on.

Stitch
12 Jun 14,, 22:44
Just like RR engines during WW2. Crisis mate ;)

You talking about the Packard Merlin?

Doktor
12 Jun 14,, 23:15
You talking about the Packard Merlin?

Yes.

Dreadnought
22 Jun 14,, 18:17
btw, lt, if you're looking at harley-esque price point, then i would very seriously recommend this bike to you ...... Wayyyyy better.

And its british too. ;)

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your's for 7.5 lacs only (less than or near about the same as the super low, and will run rings around the super low).

trumpet!;)

sated buddha
22 Jun 14,, 21:55
So guys, missing bikers, et al

An update.

Finally got some time to show off my bike to 3 customers I had been putting off for some time now thanks to work and travel. Two were racer puppies. More interested in price than the bike. Did not waste my time with them after the customary test ride.

The third guy was a guy my age. Came with his kids in tow. I wanted him to have the bike, so excited he was (as well as his younger son). We shook on a reasonable price and he gave me the advance token and my cheque for the remainder. So my baby is sold. I'm holding her and the papers for the cheque to be cashed, and will tank her up and ride her to his place the next weekend.

Now the search for my next bike begins in earnest and I have been scouring OLX for hours and sms'ing sellers. So WhatsApp photos too. Need to start checking bikes out. I can wait for the 45 bhp KTM RC390 single and the 36 bhp Yamaha R250 twin to be launched (a couple of months max) and the prices of the Ninjettes will tumble.

But I don't want to wait, and would rather just try to drive a fair bargain now.

The 650s do seem to be thin on the road around this time.

sated buddha
22 Jun 14,, 22:00
trumpet!;)

A really nice bike. Fully modern under its "vintage" clothes. Handles beautifully, brakes sharp, so neutral and precise. And man does it move! Was shocked to see her pushing 200, kind of expecting it to be more in the Harley Sportster/Super Low 160 ish ballpark.

Reminds me a lot of the Yamaha RD350 from my college days.

Very yummy bike. But too pricey sadly. Under or around 5 lacs (even 6) I would have seriously given it a thought.

lemontree
23 Jun 14,, 10:11
Now the search for my next bike begins in earnest....

If you happen to be in the Pune region, then that use to be a haven for super bikes. All owned by the Iranis/ Parsis.
Try and get your hands on one for those classiscs. If you fancy old rides.

sated buddha
23 Jun 14,, 10:34
If you happen to be in the Pune region, then that use to be a haven for super bikes. All owned by the Iranis/ Parsis.
Try and get your hands on one for those classiscs. If you fancy old rides.

In fact from OLX almost all the good leads are from Mumbai. Some Nashik, Kolhapur and Nagpur / Hyderabad too. Pune market like Bangalore for some reason is always more expensive than the median prices in other major cities. Maybe because these two have traditionally been biker cities.

But you cannot buy a bike online. You have to see and hear and feel and ride it. So I'm probably going to be screening via WhatsApp (photos, basic info, etc.) and then line them all up for a weekend and come over to Mumbai for that. With cash and RTO papers ready.

Dreadnought
24 Jun 14,, 04:35
Harley is the only one that retains its value if you choose to go older. And besides the styling is far better then the rest.

sated buddha
24 Jun 14,, 09:31
Harley is the only one that retains its value if you choose to go older. And besides the styling is far better then the rest.

Dread I am not (yet) a Harley sort of guy. Prefer my bikes lighter, more mimble, quicker, faster - basically a lot racier. I see the allure of the Harley, like other modern classics, as I also have a ton of Bullet riding buddies here. But they are not for me. Not yet at least. I was only giving the Trumpet as an alternative option to Lemontree who was having the Harley in his consideration set. Harleys are doing very well in India incidentally. Within two odd years the community has really grown with new HOG clubs springing up all over the country every day. India Bike Week is sponsored by them in Goa early each year. Bikini clad babes (Russians, Ukranians), sponges, soap suds, and spray nozzles at the for-pay bikini bike wash is one of the legendary attractions there. Beer while not free, is subsidized. And good rock music and some live jazz all day with invited groups (both Indian and overseas) and two big stages, a stunt show with various Indian stunters and some invited foreign legends like Chris Pfiefer, and a live fightclub with underground fighters in a raw bone crunching blood spurting display are the other attractions.

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sated buddha
17 Sep 14,, 11:58
Necroing my own thread. May the kitties rest in peace.

The search kind of went off the boil. Rains meaning I could not really test any bike properly to see what it could do (as well as playing hell with the logistics of out of town bikes). Also was in Germany for a stretch recently (was in Hanover when I saw them become Weltmeisters) and only just returned.

And so resumed my search.

Only this time the focus has re-shifted from the faired Ninjas back to the street fighter nakeds from KTM.

Kind of narrowed down for the moment on these two so was hoping to get some fresh perspectives from the veteran bikers here, or just anyone with an eye for vehicles/machinery and a knack for picking out good bargains.

This one is a April 2014 bike with 2500 kms on the clock. Asking for 1.45 lacs last, not willing to go lower (that's about 2400 dollars). Bike has only had its first service at 1000 kms and two free services are due. Bike only needs a rear view mirror on the left which is broken.

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This one is a November 2013 bike with 4300 kms on the clock. Asking for 1.35 lacs but could come to 1.3 (that's about 2100-2200 dollars). Bike again has only had its first service, its 2nd as well as 3rd services (at 5000 and 10000 kms or 5 and 8 months respectively) are due and have lapsed - so I would have to pay out of pocket for these. Also has lost his Owner's Manual / Original Invoice (with the free service coupons). Bike is missing its company provided tool kit and hand guards (bark-busters). Otherwise certified clean by the workshop service guys I took it to for a thorough check up.

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As said before, I am only looking at keeping this bike for a year max two as a stop gap till the bigger 690 comes around. So don't want to lose (too much) money when I sell it soon. Basically its in all likelihood not going to be a keeper.

These retail for around 2.1 lacs brand new (around 3500 dollars). There is a new faired version which has just been launched, which costs about 2.4 lacs (about 3900 dollars), which is the new toy in town and should drive down the prices of the older version. But don't want to wait anymore.

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Batista
17 Sep 14,, 12:09
KTM is slowly catching up in India just like other luxury bikes.

I guess it's launching couple of models in India soon.

sated buddha
17 Sep 14,, 12:12
KTM is slowly catching up in India just like other luxury bikes.

I guess it's launching couple of models in India soon.

Ya, but unlike the luxury marques and the imports/exotics, these are at prices we common people can afford.

Batista
17 Sep 14,, 12:19
Ya, but unlike the luxury marques and the imports/exotics, these are at prices we common people can afford.

I think I have seen many Bullet riders going towards KTM nowdays.

sated buddha
17 Sep 14,, 12:22
I think I have seen many Bullet riders going towards KTM nowdays.

Agree. Something about the innate persona of the riders of both bikes perhaps? :)

sated buddha
18 Sep 14,, 12:14
Very very depressed and low today. And cranky.

Lost both the bikes. :mad:

One because of a slimeball opportunistic (unethical) POS dealer acting true to form and type. :puck:

The other because of a 23 year old momma's kid who won't wipe his nose till momma says he can. :bang:

Disgusted.