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  • Pak Terror Camps Scatter, Persist - US

    # Recent arrests in Lodi, Calif., illustrate what authorities say is the failure of Pakistan to halt elusive militant training groups.

    By Josh Meyer, Times Staff Writer


    WASHINGTON — U.S. counter-terrorism authorities say that the detention of a Lodi, Calif.-based group of Pakistani men this month underscores a serious problem: the Islamabad government's failure to dismantle hundreds of jihadist training camps.

    Long before the FBI arrested Hamid Hayat and his father, Umer Hayat, and accused the son of attending one of the camps, law enforcement and intelligence officials were watching the Pakistan-based training sites with increasing anxiety.


    Technically, they say, the Pakistani government was probably right when it declared this month that the younger Hayat could not have received training at a "jihadist" camp near Rawalpindi since that is the home to Pakistan's military and its feared intelligence agency, Inter-Services Intelligence, or ISI.

    But that's because the Pakistani officials were referring to the "old" kind of Al Qaeda camp shown endlessly on TV, in which masked jihadists run around in broad daylight, detonating explosives, firing automatic weapons and practicing kidnappings, these officials say.

    Since the post-Sept. 11 military strikes on Al Qaeda strongholds in Pakistan's tribal territories, the jihadist training effort has scattered and gone underground, where it is much harder to detect and destroy, U.S. and Pakistani officials said in interviews.

    Instead of large and visible camps, would-be terrorists are being recruited, radicalized and trained in a vast system of smaller, under-the-radar jihadist sites.

    And the effort is no longer overseen by senior Al Qaeda operatives as it was in Afghanistan, but by at least three of Pakistan's largest militant groups, which are fueled by a shared radical fundamentalist Islamic ideology. The militant groups have long maintained close ties to Osama bin Laden and his global terrorist network, according to those officials and several unpublicized U.S. government reports.

    The groups themselves — Harkat-ul-Mujahedin, or HuM; Jaish-e-Mohammed; and Lashkar-e-Taiba — have officially been banned in Pakistan since 2002 and have been formally designated as terrorist organizations by the U.S. government. That has prompted occasional crackdowns by Islamabad, but the groups merely change their names and occasionally their leadership and resume operations, authorities say.

    The groups wield tremendous political influence, are well-funded and are said to have tens of thousands of fanatical followers, including a small but unknown number of Americans who have entered the system after first enrolling at Pakistan-based Islamic schools, or madrasas. U.S. officials also accuse them of complicity in many of the terrorist attacks against American and allied interests in Pakistan and other assaults in the disputed Kashmir region.

    Many U.S. officials say it's not surprising that Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf hasn't cracked down harder on the militant groups and what they describe as their increasingly extensive training activities.

    For years, the ISI itself has worked closely with the groups in training Pakistan's own network of militants to fight ongoing conflicts in Kashmir and elsewhere, and to protect the country's interests in neighboring Afghanistan. The militant groups also derive tremendous influence from their affiliations with increasingly powerful fundamentalist political parties in Pakistan.

    Until recently, the United States did not press the issue with its ally, believing that those trained in the Pakistani camps would be sent only to fight in Kashmir and other regional conflicts.

    But that's not the case anymore, according to U.S. and South Asian intelligence agencies.


    The U.S. military presence in Iraq and Afghanistan and Bin Laden's campaign to forge a global jihad have caused many of the Pakistan-based terrorists to redirect their rage toward U.S. targets, both abroad and perhaps even on American soil, according to the intelligence cited by numerous U.S. officials and counter-terrorism experts.

    One of the men believed most responsible for this shift is Maulana Fazlur Rehman Khalil, a former leader of HuM, who has been connected to some of the detained men in the Lodi case.

    The group previously known as HuM is now called Jamiat-ul-Ansar, and Khalil continues to play an important but less public role in it, U.S. officials said. They also believe Khalil remains closely aligned with Pakistani intelligence services and senior Al Qaeda leaders.

    Khalil was one of the original signers of Bin Laden's 1998 fatwa, or holy decree, in which he told Muslims that it was their religious duty to kill Americans whenever and wherever they could. That same year, Khalil also vowed to attack America in retaliation for the U.S. bombing of two of HuM's Al Qaeda-affiliated training camps in Afghanistan, which killed dozens of his followers and some Pakistani intelligence officers.

    U.S. intelligence officials believe that over the last two years in particular, the three militant groups and some smaller ones have taken in thousands of Al Qaeda soldiers and senior operatives as well as Taliban officials who fled Afghanistan and Pakistan's border areas to escape the U.S.-Pakistani dragnet.

    During that time, the camps have also become magnets for would-be terrorists aspiring to commit attacks against U.S. interests, the American officials and other experts say. The result, they say, is that it has become nearly impossible to get a handle on what they fear is a serious and growing terrorism problem in Pakistan.

    "We once knew who the enemy was and what groups were the enemy. And it's become much more difficult to discern that now," said Bruce Hoffman, a chairman of the Rand Corp. and a counter-terrorism consultant to the U.S. government.
    Last edited by hammer; 21 Jun 05,, 06:50.
    Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie!'...till you can find a rock. ;)

  • #2
    "There is tremendous overlap, and that is the problem, between Bin Laden and Al Qaeda, the Pakistani authorities and the Kashmiri groups," said Hoffman, who has observed the Pakistani militant groups for decades. "The overt connections may have been broken but there are wheels within wheels, and who the group actually is affiliated with is hard to tell."

    Hoffman and several U.S. officials said the groups frequently splinter and re-form, but that increasingly, "it doesn't matter which group they join because they are all feeders to each other [and many have] bought in completely to Bin Laden's ideology" of waging war against the United States and its allies.

    In the Lodi case, the Hayats have been indicted on charges of lying to federal agents and are being held without bail in Sacramento County Jail. Their lawyers and relatives have said the two, who are U.S. citizens, had nothing to do with terrorism.

    Three other local men have been detained on immigration charges, including Muhammad Adil Khan, who some U.S. officials said was the original subject of the long-standing investigation because of his suspected ties to Pakistan-based militant groups.

    While authorities have said little about the case publicly, a detailed affidavit accidentally released by the Justice Department goes into great detail about the younger Hayat's time spent training at a camp described only as Tamal on the outskirts of Rawalpindi, which itself is just a few miles from the Pakistani capital, Islamabad.

    In an affidavit, FBI Special Agent Pedro Tenoch Aguilar said that after the younger Hayat arrived in San Francisco on May 29 after two years in Pakistan, he was interviewed at length and eventually admitted attending "a jihadist training camp in Pakistan."

    Hayat, who was born in San Joaquin County in 1982, described to agents how he trained for six months in 2003 and 2004 in a camp run by Al Qaeda, and how he was taught paramilitary training, "ideological rhetoric" and "how to kill Americans."

    Hayat's father, Umer, who drives an ice cream truck in Lodi, told agents that on a visit to Pakistan, a relative who is connected to the camps arranged for him to tour several of the training facilities. Authorities also contend the father provided funding for his son's attendance at the camps.

    The federal complaint identified the head of the camp as Maulana Fazlur Rehman, which is the name of a Pakistan government opposition party member. But several U.S. officials said that most likely, the leader of the camp is the similarly named Maulana Fazlur Rehman Khalil, the longtime Bin Laden associate and former leader of HuM, who Pakistani authorities said has gone into hiding after news of the Lodi case broke.

    Despite the affidavit, the indictments returned last week against the two men do not actually charge them with attending the camp or with any terrorism-related charges, prompting speculation in the Lodi community that the FBI was backing away from allegations contained in the draft affidavit.

    The U.S. counter-terrorism officials said there were many unanswered questions in the Lodi case, including who — if anyone — intended to commit a terrorist attack on U.S. soil.

    A senior FBI official said he could not comment on the specifics of the case but did say, in an interview, that the constantly shifting nature of jihadist training networks at various locations overseas had made the FBI's job exponentially harder than it was even just a few years ago.

    "The lines are blurred, there is a lot of crossover" between Al Qaeda and the other [militant] groups, he told The Times. "There is a lot of like-mindedness, a lot of like-minded individuals who see this as a means to an end and [this commonality of purpose] is what makes it less blurry. We have to look across group lines."

    The existence of the camps and their ties to Pakistan's militant organizations pose delicate diplomatic problems for the Bush administration.

    Publicly, the administration has praised Musharraf for his help in the U.S.-led fight against terrorism, particularly for helping to apprehend more than 700 suspected Al Qaeda members, including some of the group's most senior leaders.

    But privately, some U.S. officials and counter-terrorism experts say Musharraf has not done enough to clamp down on militant organizations and that his government's reliance on those groups for support has allowed the camps to flourish as never before.

    "The Pakistan military and intelligence [agency] are well-aligned with the radical fundamentalists," said a senior U.S. counter-terrorism official. "Musharraf, he's in [a] pickle … he's trying to play it at both ends."

    The officials spoke only on the condition of anonymity, given the sensitivity of U.S.-Pakistani counter-terrorism efforts.

    One Washington-based senior Pakistani official complained about such criticism.

    "We've lost more people in the war on terrorism than anybody. We've suffered badly in taking these people on and continue to do so," the official said. "So why would we play a double game?"


    The Pakistani government official conceded, however, that the militants are so much a part of society that it is hard to combat them, both logistically and politically. "If you go in guns blazing or bomb them from 30,000 feet, we can't do that," said the official. "It is so difficult to get these people."

    Special correspondent Mubashir Zaidi in Islamabad contributed to this report.

    LATimes
    Last edited by hammer; 21 Jun 05,, 06:47.
    Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie!'...till you can find a rock. ;)

    Comment


    • #3
      The Pakistan military and intelligence [agency] are well-aligned with the radical fundamentalists," said a senior U.S. counter-terrorism official. "Musharraf, he's in [a] pickle … he's trying to play it at both ends."
      Somebody is going to give him the Nobel for that !

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by SamudraGupta
        Somebody is going to give him the Nobel for that !
        See his "charm"
        What's the difference between people who pray in church and those who pray in casinos?
        The ones in the casinos are serious.

        Comment


        • #5
          The Pakistani government official conceded, however, that the militants are so much a part of society that it is hard to combat them, both logistically and politically.

          That sums up this thread.

          So the monster has grown beyond all control. Why dont they come forward and tell the world that they cannot rein in the terrorists ?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Karthik
            That sums up this thread.

            So the monster has grown beyond all control. Why dont they come forward and tell the world that they cannot rein in the terrorists ?
            Oh i missed that line while reading it.Probably bcoz it was highlighted..
            What's the difference between people who pray in church and those who pray in casinos?
            The ones in the casinos are serious.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by bull
              Oh i missed that line while reading it.Probably bcoz it was highlighted..
              :)

              Comment


              • #8
                Now Afghans blame Pak for terrorism!

                Pak blamed for Afghan violence

                Paul Haven in Kabul | June 22, 2005 15:43 IST

                The bombings are more frequent. The battlefield clashes have intensified. Three months of unprecedented bloodshed have shaken confidence in Afghanistan's future, and senior officials are pointing fingers at a familiar foe: Pakistan.

                Officials say three Pakistanis' alleged involvement in a plot to assassinate the US ambassador here is evidence that Islamabad is not doing enough to stop terrorism, or is complicit in it.

                The rift is bad news for Washington -- which counts both countries as essential allies in the war on terrorism.

                Afghan officials have charged for weeks that Taliban and al-Qaeda agents were slipping in from Pakistan -- and that they were behind two deadly suicide bombings, the kidnapping and killing of Afghan security forces, and several major confrontations with the US-led coalition.

                Defense Minister Rahim Wardak told The Associated Press last week that rebels were receiving support from "regional powers" rattled by Afghanistan's request for a long-term US and NATO presence.

                "There is no doubt that there are countries in this region that have their own designs, and have had from long ago, and they are always trying to exploit the vacuums that have been created here," Wardak said.

                He didn't single out any country, but strongly hinted he was referring at least partly to Pakistan.

                Officials here say Islamabad is eager to resume its traditional role as regional power broker, and feels threatened by Kabul's warm relations with Pakistan's archrival, India.

                Pakistan vehemently denies any involvement in terrorism, saying it has done more than any other country in the fight against al-Qaeda. About 70,000 Pakistani troops have fanned out along the border, and Islamabad boasts turning over 700 al-Qaeda suspects to the United States.

                In Islamabad, Pakistani Information Minister Sheikh Rashid Ahmed expressed outrage at the Afghan statements.

                "Let us make it clear that Pakistan as a state is not involved in any unlawful activity on the Afghan soil, and such claims and allegations from the Afghan side must stop," he said. "No Taliban leaders are hiding here."

                Ahmed said his government supports Afghan President Hamid Karzai, despite domestic sentiment against the policy.

                "We have paid a political price by supporting him, but this support will continue," he said.

                Pakistani political analyst Talat Masood said that both countries have a history of blaming each other for their woes, and that the public war of words was a dangerous distraction.

                "The more they blame each other publicly, the more their relations are strained and the cooperation gets worse, to the advantage of the militants," he said.

                Washington has been forced to walk a tightrope to try not to offend either side.

                President Bush phoned Pakistani President Gen. Pervez Musharraf on Tuesday, according to White House press secretary Scott McClellan. Pakistani and Afghan officials say Musharraf and Karzai also spoke Tuesday.

                US military spokesman Col. James Yonts said Monday that foreign militants, backed by networks channeling them money and arms, had come into Afghanistan to try to subvert parliamentary elections slated for September.

                He said that for "operational security reasons" he could not identify the networks, nor say who supported them.


                Since March, hundreds of people -- including at least 29 US troops -- have been killed in a surge of violence across the south and east. This month, suicide bombers killed 20 people in a crowded mosque and wounded four US troops in a convoy. Afghan calls for Pakistan's help in stopping the violence have grown more strident. After the assassination plot against US Ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad was revealed, Kabul officials took the gloves off.

                "Some senior members of the Taliban, including some who are involved in killings and are considered terrorists, are in Pakistan," presidential spokesman Jawed Ludin said Tuesday at a Kabul news conference.

                Violence is worst near the border, Ludin said.

                "Our people are dying, our schools are getting burned, our mosques are getting blown up and our clergy are getting assassinated," he said. "Some provinces of the country, especially in regions that are close to Pakistani soil, are insecure in many ways."

                A senior official close to Karzai scoffed at suggestions that rogue elements of Pakistan's intelligence service, Inter Services Intelligence, or ISI, might be supporting militants without Musharraf's knowledge.

                The official, who spoke on condition of anonymity due to the issue's sensitivity, said Pakistan had played a major role in keeping Afghanistan's October presidential election safe, sealing the border and going after terrorists.

                But that cooperation has ended, and Afghan officials say they now think Pakistan was less than sincere.

                Ludin said he was not giving up on relations improving, but he offered only cautious optimism.

                "Neither Afghanistan nor the international coalition against terrorism will achieve success if we don't get the level of cooperation from Pakistan that we have had in the past," he said.

                "We are hopeful and we are confident that that (cooperation) will be forthcoming ... but at the moment as far as the situation goes, we still have more work to do."

                (Munir Ahmad in Islamabad contributed to this report.)

                rediff
                Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie!'...till you can find a rock. ;)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by hammer
                  The rift is bad news for Washington -- which counts both countries as essential allies in the war on terrorism.
                  No doubt that they cannot find,after all whom are they seeking help from.

                  The idea of mainstream pakistani staying away from extremism was also shattered when miandad's son was set to marry dawoods daughter and he justifies it by saying they are very good friends.

                  Has he(miandad) seen this http://www.ustreas.gov/press/releases/js909.htm
                  What's the difference between people who pray in church and those who pray in casinos?
                  The ones in the casinos are serious.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Everything seems odd.

                    Mushrarraf says that there are no terrorist camps. Here terrorist camps are proved as was also proved by Malik of Hurraiyat.

                    Musharraf lessons AQK, the nuclear peddler and places him under house arrest and then when abroad states that AQK is a "hero". Funny hero to be under house arrest and also forced to confess his misdeeds.

                    Plays the fool in the Mukhtar Mai case and makes a fool of the tribal laws, the normal laws and also on not allowing and then allowing her to go and then makes an ass of himself.

                    This man really is a wonder.


                    "Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."

                    I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.

                    HAKUNA MATATA

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      The latest

                      Rashid's request to visit J&K rejected

                      June 24, 2005 17:38 IST

                      http://in.rediff.com/news/2005/jun/24pak.htm

                      The Ministry of External Affairs on Friday rejected Pakistan Information Minister Sheikh Rashid's request to travel to Jammu and Kashmir by the Muzaffarabad-Srinagar bus on June 30.

                      The government has declined to accord permission to Sheikh Rashid to visit Jammu and Kashmir taking into account "all relevant aspects involved," External Affairs Ministry spokesman Navtej Sarna told reporters in New Delhi.

                      Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front chief Yaseen Malik's revelation that Rashid ran terrorist camps in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir is believed to be the reason why the MEA has refused him permission to enter Kashmir.

                      Though Rashid has denied the allegations, several retired Pakistan army chiefs and top politicians have confirmed his role in supporting terrorists.

                      So that is a official confirmation from india that it believed what yasin alleged
                      What's the difference between people who pray in church and those who pray in casinos?
                      The ones in the casinos are serious.

                      Comment

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