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Double Edge
15 Jun 12,, 22:36
Just got into this tonight.

John Helm informs me there han't been a single goal less draw game so far.

Tonight's Sweden vs England is a nail biter.

What a roller coaster :Dancing-Banana:

dave lukins
15 Jun 12,, 23:52
Managed to pull of a win. Goodbye Sweden. adjö :biggrin:

Doktor
16 Jun 12,, 00:44
Good luck with Ukraine. I mean now that Rooney will be playing ;)

tantalus
16 Jun 12,, 17:44
Just got into this tonight.

John Helm informs me there han't been a single goal less draw game so far.

Tonight's Sweden vs England is a nail biter.

What a roller coaster :Dancing-Banana:

Man, you have been missing out. The spain/Italy game in particular boasted an incrediblely high standard. In fact only on four occassions so far has one of the teams failed to score in a game, there have been 16 games so far. The weakest group with Poland, Greece, the czechs and Russians are in action tonight. This soccer touranment has the best standard in the world. Only 16 teams participate, 14 who had to qualify out of a pool of 50 countries approx. 13 of the top 20 teams in the world (Fifa rankings) are in it. There increasing the number of teams to 24 the next time around which will surely dilute the quality, but iam not complaining as it helps with the irish chances of qualifiying. This is only our second time in the euros.

tankie
16 Jun 12,, 18:31
Man, you have been missing out. The spain/Italy game in particular boasted an incrediblely high standard. In fact only on four occassions so far has one of the teams failed to score in a game, there have been 16 games so far. The weakest group with Poland, Greece, the czechs and Russians are in action tonight. This soccer touranment has the best standard in the world. Only 16 teams participate, 14 who had to qualify out of a pool of 50 countries approx. 13 of the top 20 teams in the world (Fifa rankings) are in it. There increasing the number of teams to 24 the next time around which will surely dilute the quality, but iam not complaining as it helps with the irish chances of qualifiying. This is only our second time in the euros.

And out of it , i must admit you had a very strong group , c,mooooooooooooooooooon Englanddddddddd :biggrin:

Double Edge
16 Jun 12,, 20:53
c,mooooooooooooooooooon Englanddddddddd :biggrin:
How did you find England's play to date ?

missed the france game, they got the results against the swedes. seemed wobbly.

tantalus, i'm making a point to follow every game as possible from now on.

tankie
16 Jun 12,, 21:30
Well they are still suspect in defence dok? keep milner off he's a liability imo , to win we have to play better , much better . Rooney , will he , wont he ?? one man that can make a difference up front and midfield , , keep walcot on with him and lets see .

Doktor
16 Jun 12,, 22:35
Your defense sucked on the first two matches mate, hope they will improve so the forwarders won't sweat for nothing.

tankie
16 Jun 12,, 23:07
Your defense sucked on the first two matches mate, hope they will improve so the forwarders won't sweat for nothing.

Agreed .

Russia's out , Poland's out . The Greeks have something to be happy about as their country is in meltdown

tantalus
17 Jun 12,, 13:47
As a neutral Iam gutted the Russians are out as they play a great style of football, cant say the same for the Greeks, but fair play to them, nice for them given their economic woes and these kind of shocks are what the make the competition great. I mean, the russians smashed the czechs 4-1 on day 1 and now there out and the czechs have topped the group, mental.

Tankie,
Gutted with the irish matches, didnt come in with much expectation, Trapattoni has done a great job with a poor squad, but conceding early in both matches gave us no change to implement our game plans.

The irish fans have been nominated for a fair play award

The Green Army has put the smile back into Euro 2012 and has been nominated for a Fair Play Award for its tournament-defining mass sing-along moment.

The nation’s football supporters won the hearts of the continent with their magnificent 15-minute rendition of The Fields of Athenry through the closing minutes of Thursday’s 4-0 defeat to Spain in Gdansk. Thousands of Spanish fans joined in and clapped along.
‘Wonderful’ Green Army nominated for Fair Play award after sing-along | Irish Examiner (http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/wonderful-green-army-nominated-for-fair-play-award-after-sing-along-197643.html)
In fact, Arsene Wenger stopped the french commentators from talking on french tv for the last couple of minutes so that the viewers could just listen to the singing.

See link below for a segment of the singing...
Irish fans singing The Fields of Athenry vs Spain Euro 2012 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmCosY56lRI)

Double Edge
17 Jun 12,, 14:23
A clear version of the song for those not familiar with the melody & lyrics.

hZwSEpQptTM

tankie
17 Jun 12,, 14:46
Liverpool and Celtic fans sing it as well . Fair play to Ireland .

Firestorm
18 Jun 12,, 09:05
Well they are still suspect in defence dok? keep milner off he's a liability imo , to win we have to play better , much better . Rooney , will he , wont he ?? one man that can make a difference up front and midfield , , keep walcot on with him and lets see .

I don't understand why the England manager likes to start with Milner instead of Walcott. He scored just minutes after coming in against Sweden. There are no doubts about his quality. Overall in their group the French have looked more solid I must say. Will be very surprised if England make it to the finals. At least they qualified this time. :biggrin:

Meanwhile, the Dutch have been a huge huge disappointment after being touted as third favourites after Spain and Germany. Today's game was telling. Portugal just looked faster, stronger and more determined to win than them. The game wasn't as close as the scoreline seems to suggest. The Dutch didn't really create any good chances after the first goal despite having several star players in the team. Portugal looked really good in comparison.

Double Edge
18 Jun 12,, 11:00
heh, yeah that's the problem with assessing teams on paper. The reality was anything but.

The score should have been higher, for the portugese.

Doktor
18 Jun 12,, 13:33
That's the price a team pays when having so many "stars" within.

Same was happening to Real for a long time.

Double Edge
18 Jun 12,, 14:02
The dutch were runners up for the last world cup, which was only 2 years ago. The team is quite similar.

So its a big shock that they would be eliminated so early in the qualifying stages.

They were in control for the first ten minutes, then they lost it and never recovered.

Doktor
18 Jun 12,, 14:18
I don't know if you have followed them over the years.

Their play is nice for watching, but start a bit rougher game and if you are lucky to score first against them... they turn into unorganized little kids and their discipline drops.

Double Edge
18 Jun 12,, 14:51
The discipline thing you mentioned has been going on for many years now. it does rankle a bit. The chances of fouls go up and it creates a bad taste. The rumours are quite prevalent with the dutch, either that or they don't play as a team and want individual glory. But how could they have got to the final's in the last world cup if that was the case.

You expect them to play like pro's. They ARE pro's.

But it will start up in the knock out stages when the game is more critical do or die.

Commentator mentioned a game in WC 2006 in Nuremberg, called it the 'Battle of Nuremberg'. 2 send offs & 16 yellow cards, highest record of foul play ever for both WC & Euro. Disgraceful

Doktor
18 Jun 12,, 15:27
They changed the shrink since WC maybe :shrugs:

dave lukins
18 Jun 12,, 15:49
heh, yeah that's the problem with assessing teams on paper. The reality was anything but.

The score should have been higher, for the portugese.

There was no fight in the Dutch team. They didn't seem to want it..no fire no commitment.

tantalus
18 Jun 12,, 16:30
The dutch were runners up for the last world cup, which was only 2 years ago. The team is quite similar.

It's true and its interesting point to raise, but things are tricky to explain in sport, the margins are small and they were in a tough group. It is alwalys the way to look at the teams that exit and point blame and the teams that advance receive less scrutiny but its an oversimplication. Despite that Iam going to put my neck out and forward an opinion on the dutch campaign :). I would agree withthe sentiment of others that the dutch clearly lacked team unity and drive. In the Portugal game in may have even been a lack of belief after what happened to them in the first 2 games.
If you look at the Denmark game, they missed a host of chances and the Danes managed a smash and grab. Now the dutch ran out of the ideas in the last 20ms but we have seen time and again that teams struggle to break down defences at this level of the game, despite that they created an awful lot of chances early in the game. You get days like that in football but you can rarely afford them in a 3 match touranment format, especially facing 2 of the top 10 in the world in your following games. It is a punch in the gut thats difficult to recover from and the dutch failed. Now, they never received this blow in the world cup and its easy for everyone to play well when you dont get bad luck or have one of those days (ie Denmark game) and momentum does build in these competitions. IMO, this is what explains the difference between now and the world cup for the dutch. Mental fralities were exposed this time, introduced by their misfortune in the opening match, they couldnt handle the danish setback, the evidence isnt based on the fact they lost 2 more games against top quality oppostion, but because of the nature of the defeats. They played so poorly, no balance in the team, no cohesion, without confidence or effort despite so many great players. I felt the portugese were very negative in the opening match against the Germans but after watching that game last night iam pleased they advanced. The dutch simply didnt bring the right attitude that should accompany representing your country at this level.

So a combination of mental fralities, team unity, bad luck and quality oppostion see the dutch out. Actually I havnt stuck my neck out at all on that 1, just used every plausible explanation in my analysis :biggrin:.

Doktor is right that teams with big name players can have these problems with work etiquette and unity. Big egos and all that, but just watch the spanish for example. Full of stars but play as a team and man do they work hard and win it back fast. They probably dont even all like each other with the rivarly in recent years between Barca and Madrid even worse than normal and the catalonia issue. Thats speculation on my part but if it is true than all the more impressive imo. Spanish team is comprised of real pros.

Firestorm
18 Jun 12,, 18:52
Commentator mentioned a game in WC 2006 in Nuremberg, called it the 'Battle of Nuremberg'. 2 send offs & 16 yellow cards, highest record of foul play ever for both WC & Euro. Disgraceful

It was actually 4 send-offs and 16 yellow cards. And it was against Portugal. Although to be fair the referee did get carried away in that game.

tankie
18 Jun 12,, 19:20
heh, yeah that's the problem with assessing teams on paper. The reality was anything but.

The score should have been higher, for the portugese.

If Nani had played as if he was in a team instead of being a greedy prima , they would have been in double figures , and he missed a goal a 10 year old cud have put away .

Double Edge
18 Jun 12,, 20:08
If Nani had played as if he was in a team instead of being a greedy prima , they would have been in double figures , and he missed a goal a 10 year old cud have put away .
We are forgetting the contributions of Stecklenburg here. He saved at least three sure goals.

tankie
18 Jun 12,, 20:52
/\

Thats what they get paid for ;)

Double Edge
18 Jun 12,, 22:53
There's something dodgy about that Spanish goal.

looked off side to me but the studio said it was a handball off Iniesta.

Too bad for the Croats, ref nor linesman saw it.

tantalus
18 Jun 12,, 22:59
There's something dodgy about that Spanish goal.

looked off side to me but the studio said it was a handball off Iniesta.

Too bad for the Croats, ref nor linesman saw it.
It was near the end and they had to win though so not as bad. I was watching the irish game naturally, but I heard that the Croats should have scored before that and the spanish would have been out had they lost so maybe they are quite lucky. It would have been some shock...

Double Edge
18 Jun 12,, 23:03
No Villa or Pujol. The Spanish team is just not the same without them. They looked beatable and these guys are #1.

tankie
19 Jun 12,, 00:42
There's something dodgy about that Spanish goal.

looked off side to me but the studio said it was a handball off Iniesta.

Too bad for the Croats, ref nor linesman saw it.

Yet another call goes out for playback tech , stop the friggin cheats .

tankie
19 Jun 12,, 20:11
OMG just seen Englands line up for tonight against Ukraine , no carrol /no walcott / Rooney the friggin wonderhorse upfront on his own and that dozy cheatin wanker milner in midfield on the right , bye bye England .Adraw is all we need , please prove me wrong and win , but ?????????

Doktor
19 Jun 12,, 20:24
Maybe Hodgson wants them fresh later in the game. Walcott wasn't starter in the previous matches, why would he be now.

As for Rooney... Oh well, I bet he is crying to Alex now and the Scotsman is laughing hard :biggrin:

Double Edge
19 Jun 12,, 20:29
OMG just seen Englands line up for tonight against Ukraine , no carrol /no walcott / Rooney the friggin wonderhorse upfront on his own and that dozy cheatin wanker milner in midfield on the right , bye bye England .Adraw is all we need , please prove me wrong and win , but ?????????
You will win this one.

Doktor
19 Jun 12,, 20:54
You will win this one.

I think the same. However, I never thought Netherlands would score only 1 goal and leave the tournament without a point.

tankie
19 Jun 12,, 21:09
I hope your both right but up to now 22 mins in , im down to the bones of my fingers , i see nothing about our play to encourage me , buttttttt fingers xed

tankie
19 Jun 12,, 21:32
Half time ,,OMG :slap:

tankie
19 Jun 12,, 22:07
Ukraine have been robbed , deffo a goal , we were lucky , imo , still a draw was enuff as it turned out the win was better ,shrek was handed a gift of a goal , still im glad we got thro

Doktor
19 Jun 12,, 23:28
Tomorrow I'll buy a referee jersey and will cheer for England (and Barca when EC is over).

bigross86
19 Jun 12,, 23:56
Utter stupidity. This sport needs some form on instant replay, if only on goals and cards, or at least goal line technology. Complete and utter stupidity

YellowFever
20 Jun 12,, 00:11
Agreed.

How dumb is it that a sport like basketball, with points in the hundreds, stop for instant replays on questionable calls but a sport that frequently ends in 1 nil does not?

The higher a single point can impact a game, the more instant replay is needed.

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 00:26
This sport needs some form on instant replay, if only on goals and cards, or at least goal line technology.
Where do you draw the line ?

Fouls. dives, hand balls etc

At what level does this tech make an appearance and how to explain its absence in lower level games. Do games with tech become more fair and those without less.

As it stands there is no difference between what's required to play in a slum or the world stage.


Complete and utter stupidity
That's what those in charge think about more technology.

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 00:37
How dumb is it that a sport like basketball, with points in the hundreds, stop for instant replays on questionable calls but a sport that frequently ends in 1 nil does not?

The higher a single point can impact a game, the more instant replay is needed.
Passion, uncertainty & tension. That's what football is about.

Adding tech is going to detract from all of that.

bigross86
20 Jun 12,, 00:47
Then keep it on goal line technology and instant replay on goals. Leave the randomness in everything else. Dives, cards, handballs, offside, all that is up to the ref. But I can recall 3 goals in World Cup games that were clearly goals even after instant replay where the ref called them as not goals. England's goal is extremely cringe-worthy....


http://www.metacafe.com/watch/4820149/englands_disallowed_goal_against_germany_world_cup _2010/


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6w6Nv4btI3Q&feature=related

View from 1:51


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTiZip4Wbcc&feature=related

bigross86
20 Jun 12,, 00:51
Alternatively:

Super Bowl XLIII - James Harrison's 100 Yard Interception Return - Today's Christian Videos (http://www.godtube.com/watch/?v=J12J9MNU)

Tell me, what's better, the disappointment of a team rightly scoring and not having it counted, or the disappointment of a team that was rightly scored against, with the technology merely confirming this? Why should a team that rightly scores have points discounted or disallowed?

NFL has the same element of randomness, the coaches are allowed to challenge a call and refs can review calls on their own initiative. If they are wrong, they lose one of 3 timeouts available to them. Rugby has the same element of randomness, a ref is allowed to call the booth to get a ruling on whether a team scores a try or not. Major League Baseball has instant replay that will check if balls hit over the fence near foul lines were fair or foul. Timing is not a factor, since like football/soccer, rugby doesn't stop the clock either

Keep the intrusion to a minimum, but some form of technology is needed if only on scoring plays

Doktor
20 Jun 12,, 00:53
The ref was virtually on the line and didn't see it. No tech, but a laser eye surgery would help him see it crossing the line.


Passion, uncertainty & tension. That's what football is about.
Adding tech won't make it less interesting watch, would only add to a fair game.


Where do you draw the line ?

Fouls. dives, hand balls etc

At what level does this tech make an appearance and how to explain its absence in lower level games. Do games with tech become more fair and those without less.

As it stands there is no difference between what's required to play in a slum or the world stage.


That's what those in charge think about more technology.

Given how wide spread this game is, FIFA and national associations will have to file a bankruptcy. No wonder their attitude towards adding the tech.

Tarek Morgen
20 Jun 12,, 00:53
The one arguement I can somewhat understand against adding too much technology is that all nations that take part in those cups should be able more or less under the same conditions at home they would encouter in the tournament (at leist in their top league). Yet there are quite a lot of countries were grading up the teams and stadiums is simply not doable moneywise, yet a "low-tech" approach like a fourth official would still be possible. That said, some of the line goal techs seem simple enough to be used even in the poorer countries.

bigross86
20 Jun 12,, 00:58
As it stands there is no difference between what's required to play in a slum or the world stage.

Major League Baseball has instant replay, little league baseball doesn't. Does this mean that little league and high school players are any less adept at the game, any less skilled? The chances of a false call granting points or taking away points will be slim during a player's career. Why not at least give the player the points when they are rightly deserved? Why condone giving points when they weren't earned?

Take Maradona's Hand of God. If it wasn't a goal, it shouldn't have been scored a goal, all drama aside. Why grant unearned points, and why take away earned points?

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 01:03
But I can recall 3 goals in World Cup games that were clearly goals even after instant replay where the ref called them as not goals.
So that would be 3 out of a total of how many uneventful games ?


Tell me, what's better, the disappointment of a team rightly scoring and not having it counted, or the disappointment of a team that was rightly scored against, with the technology merely confirming this? Why should a team that rightly scores have points discounted or disallowed?
What is the scale of the problem for which a fix is being proposed ?


England's goal is extremely cringe-worthy....
As was Maradona's hand of god.

bigross86
20 Jun 12,, 01:10
Hand of God shouldn't have been allowed, plain and simple. Quick review would have confirmed this. You are merely proving my point when you say it was also cringe-worthy. The fact that it was allowed reflects poorly on the entire sport.

The question is not how many games proceeded uneventfully. The question is why in games where points were rightfully scored, they shouldn't be granted? The amount of games where this is actually an issue is so small that it really won't affect the sport.

Doktor
20 Jun 12,, 01:11
So that would be 3 out of a total of how many uneventful games ? [
One of those 3 (and there are more, Chelsea:Barca comes to mind) helped Argentina becoming World champs.

YellowFever
20 Jun 12,, 01:27
Passion, uncertainty & tension. That's what football is about.

Adding tech is going to detract from all of that.

We've heard this excuse countless times when Baseball, Football (our kind) and Basketball were all thinking of adding instant replay. They've all incorporated it to some degree now most of the viewers think it was the right thing to do.

How will passion and tension be reduced with the introduction of instant replay? Uncertainty surely will be, but that's actually good for the game. If you think your sport will have added passion and tension on the chance that a ref might get a call wrong, maybe it's not worth watching.

The more we can take out human mistakes from the officiating and not have the process interfere too much with the spectators' enjoyment of the game, the better.



So that would be 3 out of a total of how many uneventful games ?


This quote just about proves our point doesn't it?

The game is not going to be stopped every few minutes for replays. It will be stopped for important moments when a single play can decide the outcome of games. Chances are, it will be used once every few games, IF THAT.

If there is a sport that NEEDS instant replay, it's Football (Soccer). A game with so few points scored NEED to get it right.

Doktor
20 Jun 12,, 01:39
The game is not going to be stopped every few minutes for replays. It will be stopped for important moments when a single play that can decide the outcome of games. Chances are, it will be used once every few games, IF THAT.

Don't hold your breath on that one. Virtually every game has suspicious ref calls. Offsides and penalties come to mind.

The question is what kind of an event will be considered worth of replay.

bigross86
20 Jun 12,, 01:45
In a game that is as fluid and dynamic as soccer, rugby comes to mind. Plenty of action, many penalties, knock-ons, not clearing the ruck, etc... Clock doesn't stop for the penalties or goals, just like in soccer. Rugby has instant replay for tries. No reason soccer can't have instant replay for goals. This way the "randomness" crowd still get their fix of randomness.

The entire thing that started this thing, the Ukraine goal that wasn't, was started from an offside position, but no one is bothered with the refs not calling that. But if the ref is already gonna let the game continue, at least score the goal they earned. If the ref wanted to disallow the goal due to it being offside, that's fine, but the ref never called offside, so the goal should count

Doktor
20 Jun 12,, 02:17
What offside mate?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JtNRU4LpDM

bigross86
20 Jun 12,, 09:31
29450

Screen shot showing a wider angle of the field, corresponding to 0:01-0:02 shows the Ukraine player offside

Doktor
20 Jun 12,, 10:11
You are right.

Seems the refs need a more thorough eye checks before every match ;)

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 10:40
Don't hold your breath on that one. Virtually every game has suspicious ref calls. Offsides and penalties come to mind.

The question is what kind of an event will be considered worth of replay.
Exactly and how do you ensure consistency around the world.


29450

Screen shot showing a wider angle of the field, corresponding to 0:01-0:02 shows the Ukraine player offside
Bingo!

if only they used the right picture to make the call :)

Doktor
20 Jun 12,, 10:42
Exactly and how do you ensure consistency around the world.

Same consistency for what when the ball is out, when is offside, etc, etc...

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 11:19
How will passion and tension be reduced with the introduction of instant replay? Uncertainty surely will be, but that's actually good for the game. If you think your sport will have added passion and tension on the chance that a ref might get a call wrong, maybe it's not worth watching.
Just wanted to create a backdrop. Set the scene.

Another factor unique to football that contributes to the mix, eg. you never play a man down or even more as a result of a serious foul for the full extent of the game.


We've heard this excuse countless times when Baseball, Football (our kind) and Basketball were all thinking of adding instant replay. They've all incorporated it to some degree now most of the viewers think it was the right thing to do.

The more we can take out human mistakes from the officiating and not have the process interfere too much with the spectators' enjoyment of the game, the better.
You can add more sports to that list that have since incorporated instant replay. The common factor in all of them is that they can be interrupted. Interruptions do not detract from game play.

Whereas football depends on flow. As little interruptions as possible. That is how you can sit through a 1-0 match. The underlined bit is tricky to achieve in football. The thinking is to refuse anything that could cause problems.

When i attended a Giants game i could not understand why the crowd cheered when the home team gained ten yards. They were cheering like as if a goal got scored. Then somebody told me there is a lot of micro management that goes into winning just those ten yards and that it is an achievement. The mindset is very different in your football. Stop start stop start to prepare for the next advance etc. To me that seemed quite slow & erratic because i wasn't using the correct mindset.

Is it conceivable that one day your players will be wearing bio feedback sensors calling homebase so as to further optimise player management on the field.


This quote just about proves our point doesn't it?

The game is not going to be stopped every few minutes for replays. It will be stopped for important moments when a single play can decide the outcome of games. Chances are, it will be used once every few games, IF THAT.

If there is a sport that NEEDS instant replay, it's Football (Soccer). A game with so few points scored NEED to get it right.
Yes and no

Yes in the few instance it happens and we can manage to keep it to just those instances.

No, because once you introduce such 'features' it will be impossible to prevent creep in other areas as Dok mentioned. The result is a game that gets interrupted regularly. Very good for advertisers, not so good for the game itself.

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 11:39
Hand of God shouldn't have been allowed, plain and simple. Quick review would have confirmed this. You are merely proving my point when you say it was also cringe-worthy. The fact that it was allowed reflects poorly on the entire sport.
One quick review leads to more.

Mentioned hand of god to show a contrast with the Ukraine game. Two contrasting instances where England was penalised & profited from the decision. All teams, in every tournament everywhere in the world are affected by the same uncertainty. Does that balance things out for everybody at least cost.


The question is not how many games proceeded uneventfully. The question is why in games where points were rightfully scored, they shouldn't be granted? The amount of games where this is actually an issue is so small that it really won't affect the sport.
You can use that underlined bit to advocate changes for many ref decisions. That is the problem.

I asked the question to get an idea of the scale of the problem. How significant is it. Because it only crops up at the major tournaments and the same discussion follows each time. Hand of god was 26 years ago, yet the rules of the game remain unchanged to this very day. Why is that.

Football is very conservative or resistant to progressive ideas it would seem :)

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 11:46
Same consistency for what when the ball is out, when is offside, etc, etc...
How to deal with the situation that some games in some countries are more fair than elsewhere.

Requires the tech be available world wide and used at all levels for pro games. Domestic leagues as well as amateur. Does such a consensus exist.

This is an all or nothing, everywhere proposition.

Doktor
20 Jun 12,, 12:53
How to deal with the situation that some games in some countries are more fair than elsewhere.

Requires the tech be available world wide and used at all levels for pro games. Domestic leagues as well as amateur. Does such a consensus exist.

This is an all or nothing, everywhere proposition.

As I said, the reason FIFA and most natn'l associations don't like the idea is the cost.

As for your concern about interruptions... it can be done like in tennis with limited numbers of reviews per half time/whole match.

tankie
20 Jun 12,, 14:30
Passion, uncertainty & tension. That's what football is about.

Adding tech is going to detract from all of that.

Works brill in rugby !

tankie
20 Jun 12,, 14:35
As I said, the reason FIFA and most natn'l associations don't like the idea is the cost..

Dont agree, why is it that EVERY viewer gets an instant playback of incidents which are questioned ?? there's a massive screen in the stadiums , surely 3 seconds for the ref to take a look , cost dont come into it .;)

dave lukins
20 Jun 12,, 14:51
Works brill in rugby !

And Tennis. Wimbledon start in a few days and 'hawkeye' will be kept busy as usual. We must move with the times.

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 14:52
Works brill in rugby !
Rugby as well as Tennis can be interrupted.

Doktor
20 Jun 12,, 15:10
Dont agree, why is it that EVERY viewer gets an instant playback of incidents which are questioned ?? there's a massive screen in the stadiums , surely 3 seconds for the ref to take a look , cost dont come into it .;)

Maybe in England with 267 cameras on every pitch (plus 25.231.541 on the entrances :Dancing-Banana:)


Rugby as well as Tennis can be interrupted.

We are not talking athletics or swimming here :cool:

Doktor
20 Jun 12,, 19:30
Rugby as well as Tennis can be interrupted.

Sepp Blatter thinks football is ripe for new tech as well.


Goal-line technology is a 'necessity', demands Blatter after Ukraine's cruel blow against England

Football's most powerful man Sepp Blatter has demanded goal-line technology is introduced after Ukraine's heartache against England.

The co-hosts were denied an equaliser in Tuesday's crunch Group D decider that ultimately saw them crash out of Euro 2012.

John Terry hooked clear a shot from Marko Devic in the 62nd minute but replays showed the ball was clearly over the line.

FIFA president Sepp Blatter: 'After last night’s match #GLT is no longer an alternative but a necessity.'

Blatter hopes to convince the game's rule-makers - the International Football Association Board - to give technology the green light.

Blatter became a convert to goal-line technology after Frank Lampard was denied a legitimate goal in England's 2010 World Cup defeat to Germany.

That failed to convince UEFA president Michel Platini - the favourite to succeed Blatter as the most powerful man in world football - who remained wedded to his belief additional assistant referees behind each goal was the best way forward.

That left Platini red-faced after he made bold claims on the eve of the game about the effectiveness of five officials.

He said: 'With five, officials see everything. They don't take decisions without being fully aware. There's also a uniformity of refereeing. For example, they don't call unintentional handballs. That uniformity has led to more flowing football.'

Goal-line technology isn't a problem,' he said. The problem is the arrival of technology because, after, you'll need technology for deciding handballs and then for offside decisions and so on. It'll be like that forever and ever. It'll never stop. That's the problem I have.'

However, the introduction of some form of goal-line technology is now virtually inevitable.

IFAB are expected to approve at least one of two systems that have been subject to in-depth testing when they meet in Kiev the day after the July 1 Euro 2012 final.

Hawk-Eye, the camera-based system made famous after being successfully introduced to tennis, and GoalRef, which relies on a chip in the ball, were both selected for further tests at IFAB's meeting in March.

One of them could be introduced for the first time at December's FIFA Club World Cup in Japan.

England's friendly win against Belgium at Wembley this month witnessed a Hawk-Eye test, although the results were not made public.

.....

Euro 2012: Sepp Blatter demands goal-line technology after Ukraine v England | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/euro2012/article-2162013/Euro-2012-Sepp-Blatter-demands-goal-line-technology-Ukraine-v-England.html)

tankie
20 Jun 12,, 19:40
And for once in his life he is correct .

YellowFever
20 Jun 12,, 19:51
Anyway, to reset this thread.

I think Germany is going to win and they'll probably walk over everybody.

The team is the same methodical, robotic selves they were a decade ago.

tankie
20 Jun 12,, 20:00
I want us poms to win but reckon on portugal.

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 20:32
Sepp Blatter thinks football is ripe for new tech as well.
Just doing his job and responding to the concerns of a host nation.

Everything i've said here and in the 2010 cup thread is stuff i learnt from discussion with friends in the UK in the early 90s. Amazed its held good for nearly twenty years now.


Blatter hopes to convince the game's rule-makers - the International Football Association Board - to give technology the green light.
underlined bit is the qualifier.

IFAB (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Football_Association_Board) are the ones that call the shots here.


Each UK association has one vote and FIFA has four. IFAB deliberations must be approved by three-quarters of the vote, which translates to at least six votes. Thus, FIFA's approval is necessary for any IFAB decision, but FIFA alone cannot change the Laws of the Game—they need to be agreed by at least two of the UK members. There is also a quorum requirement that at least four of the five member associations, one of which must be FIFA, have to be present for a meeting to proceed.
Brits can block any move with just two of their associations not showing up to a meeting.


That failed to convince UEFA president Michel Platini - the favourite to succeed Blatter as the most powerful man in world football - who remained wedded to his belief additional assistant referees behind each goal was the best way forward.

That left Platini red-faced after he made bold claims on the eve of the game about the effectiveness of five officials.
Will he stick to his guns or not.


Hawk-Eye, the camera-based system made famous after being successfully introduced to tennis, and GoalRef, which relies on a chip in the ball, were both selected for further tests at IFAB's meeting in March.

England's friendly win against Belgium at Wembley this month witnessed a Hawk-Eye test, although the results were not made public.

One of them could be introduced for the first time at December's FIFA Club World Cup in Japan.
if the results were not made public then its not a given when they could be introduced. But they are actively examining the option.

Double Edge
20 Jun 12,, 20:52
I think Germany is going to win and they'll probably walk over everybody.

The team is the same methodical, robotic selves they were a decade ago.
Aren't they just.

So clinical in their execution.

I would root for Spain but without Villa they have lost a significant edge.

A Spain v England final would be tops. England last entered the semi's in '96. Still they finished top of their group which means France get to face Spain :biggrin:

French have to be the most temperamental team there is. When they're upto it they can win the tournament, otherwise they will just bomb very badly and create a most awful stink like at the last world cup. The sacked the whole team, allowed very few veterans to get into their new supposedly better behaved team.

Yella, you're gonna hate Spain's play, they are into mind games and not doing anything flash until they see an opportunity. Spain are an acquired taste.

tankie
21 Jun 12,, 20:36
White wine spritzers at the ready :tankie:, Portugal and Check Rep to watch ,, and ready to pull the ref to pieces ,, with Dok disagreeing :grump: ;)

Double Edge
21 Jun 12,, 20:40
Portugal win ?

tankie
21 Jun 12,, 20:47
Portugal win ?

Think so . Hmmm 25 min both sides look good CZR slightly better imo 2 YELLA cards for port,nani got the 1st ?

Double Edge
21 Jun 12,, 21:34
Half time. Its still anyone's game.

tankie
21 Jun 12,, 21:39
Yup , Port, are starting to look better now , Ronaldo was unlucky tho , hit the post .

Double Edge
21 Jun 12,, 21:42
Czech manager must be chewing up the team for allowing Ronaldo 3 tries on target.

Keep this up and he's bound to get some in.

tankie
21 Jun 12,, 21:49
Czech manager must be chewing up the team for allowing Ronaldo 3 tries on target.

Keep this up and he's bound to get some in.

Along with Messi , Ronaldo must rank as one of the best and looks likely to score , very hard to combat that sort of skill , but still its any ones game .

edit ,

Without Ronaldo ,Port/are nothing special after tonights show , CZR caved in , im changing my prediction about the euro winners , Germany or England .

Double Edge
21 Jun 12,, 23:09
Well the Czechs are out, done in by Ronaldo. he might get a few more scalps if he keeps his form.

There is one player i can't help mentioning.

Milan Baros, remember him ? 2004 Euro cup this Czech set the place on fire, as top scorer but he was virtually invisible in this tournament.

tankie
22 Jun 12,, 13:03
C,MONNNNNNNN England ,,,,but 1st there's that little problem of Italy on Sunday night ,, speshly Balloteli , hopefully he will be his usual hot headed self n get sent awwwf , he's a BIG threat :redface:

Doktor
22 Jun 12,, 13:09
Well the Czechs are out, done in by Ronaldo. he might get a few more scalps if he keeps his form.

There is one player i can't help mentioning.

Milan Baros, remember him ? 2004 Euro cup this Czech set the place on fire, as top scorer but he was virtually invisible in this tournament.

Baros still plays?

Double Edge
22 Jun 12,, 13:43
He did this time in all of CZ's matches and for the full duration but you would not have noticed.

Most definitely his last tournament.

Doktor
22 Jun 12,, 13:48
I haven't watched the Czech games, but I am really surprised he plays, even for Galatasaray.

tankie
22 Jun 12,, 20:24
Any predictions for Germany V Greece t'nite , obviously hoping the Greeks can do em , but im thinking the Germans are gonna be toooooo good forrem .

2, 0 to Germany .;)

:pop:

tankie
22 Jun 12,, 21:36
Half time 1 0 , Greeks are not even at the game , how its only 1 0 is a wonder ???

Doktor
22 Jun 12,, 21:43
Imagine the headlines in Greece tomorrow if it is more :insane:

tankie
22 Jun 12,, 21:48
It cant not be more m8 , maybe another couple for Germany coz they are not breakin sweat in this one sided game , i thought Greece was hoping for a nil nil draw n try to win on penalties :slap:

Double Edge
22 Jun 12,, 21:50
Am taking the Germans for granted on this one. They are playing a very attacking game.

Will there be an equaliser and extra time. Now that the Greeks have had a pause to size up the situation.

tankie
22 Jun 12,, 21:55
Am taking the Germans for granted on this one. They are playing a very attacking game.

Will there be an equaliser and extra time. Now that the Greeks have had a pause to size up the situation.

Dont think so m8 , i reckon the Germans will get maybe 2 more then rest some top players .

edit , Greece proves me wrong , 1 1 :biggrin:

Double Edge
22 Jun 12,, 22:01
Whup de doo :Dancing-Banana:

1-1 !

GAME ON!

tankie
22 Jun 12,, 22:04
Dya know , this euro will never cease to contradict and amaze me ? Germans caught sleeping and suffer for it .

dave lukins
22 Jun 12,, 22:09
Dya know , this euro will never cease to contradict and amaze me ? Germans caught sleeping and suffer for it .

Still think they will win 4 : 1

Double Edge
22 Jun 12,, 22:10
Germans reply but i think the Greeks ain't out of it yet.

tankie
22 Jun 12,, 22:13
Still think they will win 4 : 1

A win for sure nuts , but what a weird game , greeks seem to only want to layback and counter a break , surely bad tactics , but worked for their 1st one , but not again methinks 3 1 now , your predict is a cummin bro

tankie
22 Jun 12,, 22:20
4 1 it is , germans will take off some players now i reckon

dave lukins
22 Jun 12,, 22:25
A win for sure nuts , but what a weird game , greeks seem to only want to layback and counter a break , surely bad tactics , but worked for their 1st one , but not again methinks 3 1 now , your predict is a cummin bro

As usual the Germans will not be bitten twice by lacksadaisical defence. They will put more and more pressure on the Greeks until they relinquish their Golden Fleece :biggrin:

Double Edge
22 Jun 12,, 22:27
What a rout.

dave lukins
22 Jun 12,, 22:47
Gifting them a suspect penalty was naughty. He had his back to the ball for crying out loud.

dave lukins
22 Jun 12,, 22:49
If England thinks Ronaldo's goal was good the German goals were brilliantly taken. Such skill.

Firestorm
22 Jun 12,, 23:00
The Germans seem to have amazing bench strength. Their usual A-team at the front - Podolski, Muller and Gomez didn't start this game. Reus was playing only his 9th or 10th game for the national side and he scored. Klose opened his account in trademark style with a header. They have Kroos waiting in the wings. Lars Bender who scored against Denmark and Mertesacker are available if needed. And it seems as if pretty much every player in the team has good attacking ability regardless of where they play. They are a true delight to watch right now.

They have to be careful though. They were in similar form during the world cup. And they are likely to run into Spain if they reach the Final.

dave lukins
22 Jun 12,, 23:01
As the great Poet Cinaethon of Sparta would have said " 'Tis bleak to be a Greek" :frown:

Doktor
22 Jun 12,, 23:02
Klose never seize to fascinate me.

BTW, anyone noticed that this was almost like German B team?

Greeks should have stayed quiet at 1-0:tongue:

Doktor
23 Jun 12,, 09:37
I have read that this game was fixed.

The German government is sponsor of both teams.

Double Edge
23 Jun 12,, 21:05
Spain got their first goal.

This is looking to be a fact paced exciting game. Though it seems like there is just one team on the field.

Doktor
23 Jun 12,, 23:27
Is it only me, or the formations were:

Spain 0-10-0
France 10-0-0

:red:

Double Edge
24 Jun 12,, 00:26
Spain 4-3-3
France 4-5-1

First half the Spaniards dominated. The second half was better for the French but they could not finish.

dave lukins
24 Jun 12,, 01:30
Spain 4-3-3
France 4-5-1

First half the Spaniards dominated. The second half was better for the French but they could not finish.

Lots of fancy close passing but nothing to excite the juices.

tankie
24 Jun 12,, 16:22
The frogs caved in ,,,,,as usual :whome: now for the game t/nite , poms v eyeties , woo hoo , beers in the cooler ready for

The next Italian job without the mini's , lets hope its steamrollers

and blow the bloody doors off .:biggrin:

Double Edge
24 Jun 12,, 17:19
I hope England wins but this one is really hard to call.

Can England build further on their play from the qualifying rounds ?

That they topped their group seem more of a fluke to me than method.

How i wish England could inspire confidence when they play instead of anxiety.

The one England match i always remember is round of 16, WC 98 against Argentina. Due to the petulance of a young Beckham, England played a man down for a major portion of the match + extra time and still managed to hold Argentina back only to lose on penalties.

Now that was a very rousing performance that England have not come close to reproducing since. It did not matter that they lost they did themselves very proud that day.

Doktor
24 Jun 12,, 20:00
Speaking of England...

What happened to Lennon (Aaron, not John:whome:).

I remember when he substituted Beckham I was fairly surprised by his play.

Saw him later he still maintained the same style.

Haven't seen him in the national team for 2 years IIRC, why?

tankie
24 Jun 12,, 20:18
Dunno m8 , managers choices .

Doktor
24 Jun 12,, 20:25
Might be something with his attitude.

Anyway, a good right winger.

Double Edge
24 Jun 12,, 20:40
29485

tankie
24 Jun 12,, 20:50
Chances both ends 1st 5 minutes , gonna be good

tankie
24 Jun 12,, 22:33
1st 0 0 draw . we look tired now for extra 30 , hope it dont go to penalties .

Double Edge
24 Jun 12,, 22:34
Damn it, Rooney's bicycle kick was so close !!!

England's defense looks solid.

tankie
24 Jun 12,, 22:47
Damn it, Rooney's bicycle kick was so close !!!

England's defense looks solid.

Which game u watching , we are crap in defense , and upfront .

Double Edge
24 Jun 12,, 22:49
Check out the Italy stats for shots on target ;)

tankie
24 Jun 12,, 22:56
Check out the Italy stats for shots on target ;)

Counting the 2 that hit the woodwork , they have created more chances than we have and unlucky not to score

Double Edge
24 Jun 12,, 22:57
That Italy has done but you've been suffocating them pretty well too.

tankie
24 Jun 12,, 23:02
That Italy has done but you've been suffocating them pretty well too.

Naaa m8 , if that was the case they wouldnt be getting shots off ;)

Double Edge
24 Jun 12,, 23:06
34 opportunities and 20 on target for Italy. Why no score ?

Johnson has been stellar.

Have England been lucky in this game

HELL YEAH :biggrin:

tankie
24 Jun 12,, 23:15
Lets hope the luck dont run out ,,penalties ,,yeeeeuk

Double Edge
24 Jun 12,, 23:19
1st penalty

Man city vs Man city

tankie
24 Jun 12,, 23:26
Best team won

Double Edge
24 Jun 12,, 23:27
Something about England and penalties..

Cannot remember the last time they won with them.

Doktor
24 Jun 12,, 23:36
England's midfield sucked.

Man of the match Terry.

dave lukins
25 Jun 12,, 01:19
England's midfield sucked.

Man of the match Terry.

Agreed. They were so unfit it embarrassing. They could not put three passes together, and talk about sheer panic in the goal mouth. These guys very very highly paid ie..Rooney £300k a WEEK and he might as well not have been there. I have seen dud cheques passed better than some of their efforts. To end the game with penalties is not good for the winner and not good for the loser. Play on until the first goal goes in.

snowhole
25 Jun 12,, 08:39
Something about England and penalties..

Cannot remember the last time they won with them.

In 1996 Euro (against Spain). And that was the only once they've won out of their entire 7 encounters with penalties.

Doktor
25 Jun 12,, 09:40
Was thinking about the game...

Random thoughts:

Italians played Catanagio from 25' till the end, only they moved in front of the opponents goal :Dancing-Banana:

One thing bothers me: Why Roy substituted two forwarders at once, even more so early? Wouldn't it been better to refresh the midfield?

Still feel sorry for Terry. The man shouldn't been on the loosing side.

dave lukins
25 Jun 12,, 12:35
Was thinking about the game...

Random thoughts:

Italians played Catanagio from 25' till the end, only they moved in front of the opponents goal :Dancing-Banana:

One thing bothers me: Why Roy substituted two forwarders at once, even more so early? Wouldn't it been better to refresh the midfield?

Still feel sorry for Terry. The man shouldn't been on the loosing side.

There was some suspicious subs and I think he was scared of taking Rooney off even though he was one of the worst players on the pitch. They couldn't play together as a team and that was their downfall. We need new players, more hungry players and players with commitment. Terry to me was man of the match and deserves better praise in the UK tabloids.

tankie
25 Jun 12,, 14:45
There was some suspicious subs and I think he was scared of taking Rooney off even though he was one of the worst players on the pitch. They couldn't play together as a team and that was their downfall. We need new players, more hungry players and players with commitment. Terry to me was man of the match and deserves better praise in the UK tabloids.

Not read the guttershite yet nuts , but I can imagine their reporting , the team was/is dire , after the 1st 15 minutes im up for it , then nowt , fizzled out , the prima's are too busy in nightclubs to worry about the game , they have made their money , shrek needs it to finance his brothel/granny antics , he was crap , a total deadbeat , Hodgson aint the man for the gig , he's ANOTHER yes man to the F/A , agree on Terry , big hearted commitment , Carrol fresh on , stopped running , Walcott never tried .

Penalties yeeeeuk , ah well , c,mon the Krauts , their beers the best so im going for them :tankie:

Parihaka
25 Jun 12,, 15:39
A wise man of my acquaintance said the mid-field played like cnuts. A bookie of my acquaintance said last week that England played to a script and that they would play like cnuts in this game (and loose on a penalty shoot out). Wise men both though I suspect the bookie makes more money.

Doktor
25 Jun 12,, 16:08
Bookie making money on 0-0 with Italy? :confused:

tantalus
25 Jun 12,, 16:28
In 1996 Euro (against Spain). And that was the only once they've won out of their entire 7 encounters with penalties.

I dont think its an anomoly, as in a chance deviation from 50:50, english footballers are not as technically gifted, including striking of the ball (same with Irish) as most nations on the mainland. Hence they lose more often than not.

Tough way to exit, but Italy were the better team. Honestly I think the english should be disappointed with their performance. They were organised and defended well, worked hard, but they didnt look like a team who felt they were going to score. I think their mentality was weak. Italy looked scores better in general play and I don think the gap should be that big. I am not a fan of Hodgson, I dont like his mentality, or his general attitude that they punched above their weight and that its been a success. I wouldnt be happy with that performance last night if I was a english man. They are better than that, they should be offering alot more.

phoggy
25 Jun 12,, 16:50
Not read the guttershite yet nuts , but I can imagine their reporting , the team was/is dire , after the 1st 15 minutes im up for it , then nowt , fizzled out , the prima's are too busy in nightclubs to worry about the game , they have made their money , shrek needs it to finance his brothel/granny antics , he was crap , a total deadbeat , Hodgson aint the man for the gig , he's ANOTHER yes man to the F/A , agree on Terry , big hearted commitment , Carrol fresh on , stopped running , Walcott never tried .

Penalties yeeeeuk , ah well , c,mon the Krauts , their beers the best so im going for them :tankie:

Tankie,

Do not so sad after defeat of your THREE LIONS team to Italy in the quarter finals with a penalty shoot out last night ! The Jogi´s boys (The Krauts) will overrun THE AZZURRI for you in semi-final on Thursday !
The GERMAN Team will win the match with THE AZZURRI in semi-final on Thursday, BECAUSE :

1. Angela Merkel is MUTTI of EURO countries.:):):)
2. Hairstyles of Joachim Löw (Coach of the DFB ELF) look better than hairstyles of Cesare Prendalli (Coach of AZZURRI-Team).
3. Philipp Lahm (German Captain, defensive player) is the secret weapon of German Team ! With 1,68 m he is a top specialist for stealthty, left wing attack in low level :biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

And last but not least…..

4. On Thursday evening Tankie will sing german national anthem at home with a glas german beer and pray for a win of THE KRAUTS.:Dancing-Banana::Dancing-Banana::Dancing-Banana:

dave lukins
25 Jun 12,, 16:59
I dont think its an anomoly, as in a chance deviation from 50:50, english footballers are not as technically gifted, including striking of the ball (same with Irish) as most nations on the mainland. Hence they lose more often than not.

Tough way to exit, but Italy were the better team. Honestly I think the english should be disappointed with their performance. They were organised and defended well, worked hard, but they didnt look like a team who felt they were going to score. I think their mentality was weak. Italy looked scores better in general play and I don think the gap should be that big. I am not a fan of Hodgson, I dont like his mentality, or his general attitude that they punched above their weight and that its been a success. I wouldnt be happy with that performance last night if I was a english man. They are better than that, they should be offering alot more.

If that was an American Football/basketball team the coach would have kicked them of the field never to play professional again. For Hodgson to say they played 'well' 'gave their all' and 'punched above their weight' then he must have watched a different match to the rest of us.

Doktor
25 Jun 12,, 17:14
Dave,

I doubt any manager in English PL would tolerate what your national team did last night.

tankie
25 Jun 12,, 18:15
Tankie,

Do not so sad after defeat of your THREE LIONS team to Italy in the quarter finals with a penalty shoot out last night ! The Jogi´s boys (The Krauts) will overrun THE AZZURRI for you in semi-final on Thursday !
The GERMAN Team will win the match with THE AZZURRI in semi-final on Thursday, BECAUSE :

1. Angela Merkel is MUTTI of EURO countries.:):):)
2. Hairstyles of Joachim Löw (Coach of the DFB ELF) look better than hairstyles of Cesare Prendalli (Coach of AZZURRI-Team).
3. Philipp Lahm (German Captain, defensive player) is the secret weapon of German Team ! With 1,68 m he is a top specialist for stealthty, left wing attack in low level :biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

And last but not least…..

4. On Thursday evening Tankie will sing german national anthem at home with a glas german beer and pray for a win of THE KRAUTS.:Dancing-Banana::Dancing-Banana::Dancing-Banana:

Ein zwei drei veir , lift your stein n drink your beer ( student prince ) :tankie: Im not sad m8 , mad yes ? I hope ya do win m8 , then hope for a P/G final , at least it would be a game , Krauts being their methodical Tutonic selves crushing the untermenche , while Ronaldo is showing flashes of magic ,,,,and the odd diving ov course and the obligatory kisses if he scores :hug::tankie::hug:

Double Edge
25 Jun 12,, 19:20
For Hodgson to say they played 'well' 'gave their all' and 'punched above their weight' then he must have watched a different match to the rest of us.
Why can't he just be telling the truth ?

Last night I thought England played the best they could in the tournament so far. That Italy got nothing after being so good and having three times more shots on target is testament to it. Unlucky for Italy or lucky for England is just part of it.

Tarek Morgen
25 Jun 12,, 19:24
I missed most of the games but was surprised to hear the results of the ENG- ITA match. I though that kicking England out on penalties was OUR job.

Doktor
25 Jun 12,, 19:29
Why can't he just be telling the truth ?

Last night I thought England's defense played the best they could in the tournament so far. That Italy got nothing after being so good and having three times more shots on target is testament to it. Unlucky for Italy or lucky for England is just part of it.

Fixed.

Firestorm
25 Jun 12,, 19:36
Why can't he just be telling the truth ?

Last night I thought England played the best they could in the tournament so far. That Italy got nothing after being so good and having three times more shots on target is testament to it.
No. It is a testament to some crappy finishing by the Italians. The job of the defense is to stop the opposition from getting into a position from where they can easily score. Not to pray and hope that the opposition's strikers will mess things up. The Italian forwards will need to up their game against the Germans for sure. I don't think they will have trouble creating chances. I have a feeling the awesome German midfield has hidden their deficiencies in defense. If the Greeks can score two, then well...


Meanwhile, Andrea Pirlo's penalty was sheer class. :wors:

tantalus
25 Jun 12,, 19:45
Why can't he just be telling the truth ?

Last night I thought England played the best they could in the tournament so far. That Italy got nothing after being so good and having three times more shots on target is testament to it. Unlucky for Italy or lucky for England is just part of it.

I think its wrong to draw an assessment from the result. Sometimes a team wins playing poorly, sometimes a team scrapes a draw, most often they lose. It's about playing probabilities. Playing the way England played last night, they will most often fall in the latter category.

"Unlucky for Italy or lucky for England is just part of it". I disagree, its most of it, yes there was reasonably good defending and hard work and both were massive factors in managing a draw, but so was luck. If this tie, with these approaches was played 10 times in a row, they would lose the vast majority of them.

Essentially, it comes down to your assessment of how good one thinks Italy are and how poor one feels england are before a ball is kicked, when judging afterwards if this was a good england performance. I dont think the gap is that big. Ofcourse, iam measuring the gap on the difference of the teams in general play, not the scoreboard.

Dave,
Hodgson didnt say those things literally, Iam just giving my view of his general attitide and demeanor during the touranment.
He did say
"I think we have done well to come through the tournament without losing a match in normal time at least."
To be fair you have to talk up your team in certain situations, but I think his attitude towards england's chances affected the team's mentality before the game.

Doktor
25 Jun 12,, 22:27
A team that doesn't want the ball, won't get it.

If you have any chances to watch the match again, just look at the passes of the Italian defense with the ball passing next to England's attackers.

Pirlo's kick was awesome, I forgot that.

Has anyone noticed how Italians played long high balls? And they were always precise. When I was a kid it was English game. And Italians were defending.

tankie
25 Jun 12,, 23:56
Our new song now is , tears on my pirlo ,pain in my heart , and a sacking on my mind :slap:

Hodgson aint the guy for the job FFS Liverpool binned him quick enuff , yes he has had some success but
it wont be with England , he's a yes boy to the F/A , same reason Brian Clough was rejected all them years ago , he would have managed his way and picked the right guys for the gig , not overrated shreks and to hell with the F/A , 3 lions my arse donkies with asses in charge .:mad::mad:

tankie
25 Jun 12,, 23:59
A team that doesn't want the ball, won't get it.

If you have any chances to watch the match again, just look at the passes of the Italian defense with the ball passing next to England's attackers.

Pirlo's kick was awesome, I forgot that.

Has anyone noticed how Italians played long high balls? And they were always precise. When I was a kid it was English game. And Italians were defending.

Ya takin the piss right , watch that again .:pari::pari::pari::pari::pari::pari::pari:

Double Edge
27 Jun 12,, 20:04
Spain vs Portugal

Thoughts ?

Will this be a dreary affair (both sides too cautious) that ends up in a penalties lottery.

tankie
27 Jun 12,, 20:09
Im for Portugal , and im hoping to see a good game tonight , not the theatricals and divers , but a game worthy of a semi final .Spain may be too good for them tho ,,,butttttttttttttttttttt.

Double Edge
27 Jun 12,, 20:14
If Villa & Pujol were in the lineup i would say Spain win.

Now its a coin toss.

tantalus
27 Jun 12,, 20:21
Spain vs Portugal

Thoughts ?

Will this be a dreary affair (both sides too cautious) that ends up in a penalties lottery.

Spain 1 Portugal 0
Spanish games are nearly alwalys fairly similiar and alot of people find their games boring. I dont subscribe to that though. Their ability to control the ball, short pass and move into the available lines is relentless in its execution.

Football beauty.

Double Edge
27 Jun 12,, 20:46
Oh yeah i've come to appreciate Del Bosque's style of play, its very mental.

phoggy
27 Jun 12,, 21:07
I will tip the Spanish team (The Red Fury) to win this match (2-1).
Why ? Here is my reason :
The game of the Portugese team (The Team of The Shields) depends strongly on performances of ONE person. Namely : RONALDO.
When he could be turned off, then the Portugese should have no one left, who can effectively score goals.

And now to the match...
we are now at the 21. minute. The result is still 0 : 0...

tankie
27 Jun 12,, 21:16
The refs a cnut

phoggy
27 Jun 12,, 21:59
The result is still 0:0.

I wonder whether the Portugese have enough condition to continue their power play such as in the first halftime….

tankie
27 Jun 12,, 22:08
Yella cards r fluttering now , but spain seems to be getting to grips at the mo, almeeda for portugal is a tosser .

kato
27 Jun 12,, 22:12
Nah, not really. Still going back and forth.

kato
27 Jun 12,, 22:27
Ronaldo really fails today.

The girlfriend of the Spanish keeper is hot though.

tankie
27 Jun 12,, 22:38
Lets hope its not pens again .

tantalus
27 Jun 12,, 22:39
This is very tight. Hard to see where the goal is coming from.

With the entire Portugese defense on yellow, wouldnt be surprised to see some extra pressure applied by the spanish on the ref for every foul.

phoggy
27 Jun 12,, 22:42
0:0 after 90 minutes.
They go now into overtime (two halves of 15 minutes)....
Which team :confused:can stay power for the next 2x 15 minutes fighting ?...:confused:

kato
27 Jun 12,, 22:55
Spain seems to have the upper hand right now, though it's just before they switch sides...

Bigfella
27 Jun 12,, 22:58
Penalties again. Oh joy.

Bigfella
27 Jun 12,, 23:02
Oops! thats what I get for watching wiht the sound off. Still some life in this.

phoggy
27 Jun 12,, 23:11
117. minute. Still 0:0.
3 minutes to play....
Who scores now a goal, will win the match....
The clock ticks....
It tends to a second penalty shoot out again...

Double Edge
27 Jun 12,, 23:28
Fabregas goal was just at the edge, a little slower and the goalie would have got it.

Spain are in the finals.

phoggy
27 Jun 12,, 23:28
The match is over !
Spain has won with 4:2 in Penalties shoot out !

tankie
27 Jun 12,, 23:32
Ah well , c,monnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn herfy pils :biggrin:

tankie
27 Jun 12,, 23:53
To tell the truth , this whole euro games has been disappointing from a spectators view .

tantalus
27 Jun 12,, 23:53
Fabregas goal was just at the edge, a little slower and the goalie would have got it.

Spain are in the finals.

It was a great dive. Surely the keeper will feel agrieved with the ill luck of the post. He will be having nightmares for weeks about it.

Congrats to Spain, offered more in extra time and now there 1 game from an historic 3 in a row. Provides a little extra spice for the final.

Double Edge
28 Jun 12,, 00:54
It was a great dive. Surely the keeper will feel agrieved with the ill luck of the post. He will be having nightmares for weeks about it.
I couldn't believe he got it in. A little to the left and he'd had hit the post and lost it.

dave lukins
28 Jun 12,, 10:50
It was a great dive. Surely the keeper will feel agrieved with the ill luck of the post. He will be having nightmares for weeks about it.

Congrats to Spain, offered more in extra time and now there 1 game from an historic 3 in a row. Provides a little extra spice for the final.

...and lots of pressure. I fancy Spain and Germany in the Final with Germany to win

kato
28 Jun 12,, 11:37
Germany will lose to Italy in the semi-final. They always do, just like it was clear that Italy would kick out England.

dave lukins
28 Jun 12,, 11:44
Germany will lose to Italy in the semi-final. They always do, just like it was clear that Italy would kick out England.

I know Italy but who is this other team...England? Mumbai FC could have kicked their a$$es:biggrin:

Doktor
28 Jun 12,, 11:58
Before this tournament the Italians didn't have any hopes. They said they'd be happy if they pass the groups.

My reply was if you pass the groups, you will play in the finals :Dancing-Banana:

Germany and (surprisingly to me) Italy play the best game (for watching) from those that passed the groups and it is really a shame this ain't the finals.

As for Germany loosing to Italy, I guess this team will break the curse.

Double Edge
28 Jun 12,, 12:52
Germany will lose to Italy in the semi-final. They always do, just like it was clear that Italy would kick out England.
You are superstitious ?

Curse of the Azzurri: Can Germany end Italy jinx at major tournament after seven failures? | Daily Mail (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/euro2012/article-2165341/Euro-2012-Can-Germany-end-Italy-jinx-seven-failures.html?ito=feeds-newsxml)

kato
28 Jun 12,, 13:43
You are superstitious ?
Nah, realistic :tongue:

phoggy
28 Jun 12,, 16:40
GERMAN vs ITALY
-----------------------------------------------

Where is The Oracle Paul The Octopus ?
I need you now !

29516

tankie
28 Jun 12,, 16:45
Theres a new kid on the block , on the beeb last night ,,,twere a PIG

Double Edge
28 Jun 12,, 17:50
Nah, realistic :tongue:
Is Italy the same today, Is Germany the same today, as on those previous matches ?


The Germans seem to have amazing bench strength. Their usual A-team at the front - Podolski, Muller and Gomez didn't start this game. Reus was playing only his 9th or 10th game for the national side and he scored. Klose opened his account in trademark style with a header. They have Kroos waiting in the wings. Lars Bender who scored against Denmark and Mertesacker are available if needed. And it seems as if pretty much every player in the team has good attacking ability regardless of where they play. They are a true delight to watch right now.

They have to be careful though. They were in similar form during the world cup. And they are likely to run into Spain if they reach the Final.

tankie
28 Jun 12,, 20:47
Lets hope to see a great game t/nite

Krauts r up forrit , saved on the line in 1st 5

kato
28 Jun 12,, 21:01
Bit slow so far compared to Portugal's powerplay yesterday.

kato
28 Jun 12,, 21:07
Italia !!

1:0

Double Edge
28 Jun 12,, 21:10
Lets hope to see a great game t/nite

Krauts r up forrit , saved on the line in 1st 5
Absolute cracker so far.

tankie
28 Jun 12,, 21:27
2 0 , ballotelli the danger man , krauts are suffering now but still a good game at last

kato
28 Jun 12,, 21:28
At 20:49 i said this game will end 2:1 for Italia.

Right now it looks more like 4:1...

Double Edge
28 Jun 12,, 21:31
This is carnage, i cannot believe this is happening to Germany !!

What can Loew do to reverse it.

kato
28 Jun 12,, 21:35
Add an extra two guys behind Hummels and Bartstuber... (i.e. add extra cover to Ballotelli and the other guy)

phoggy
28 Jun 12,, 21:36
Mamamia.....
just 44 minutes but already 0-2 for Jogi´s boys !!!
Huhuhuhu.....huhuhuhu

tankie
28 Jun 12,, 21:36
cud easy been 2 2 , but the eyties have their tales up now :tankie:

kato
28 Jun 12,, 21:49
Klose and Reus moving in for Gomez and Podolski.

Double Edge
28 Jun 12,, 22:26
Ten minutes left and i'm not seeing a German response.

kato
28 Jun 12,, 22:32
Well, there was a response... it just fizzled out pretty quickly.

Still going with 2:1

tankie
28 Jun 12,, 22:34
Good game , well played , Italy deserved it in the end .

tankie
28 Jun 12,, 22:36
Well, there was a response... it just fizzled out pretty quickly.

Still going with 2:1

Haha a pen in injury time

kato
28 Jun 12,, 22:36
penalty... 2:1

what did i say?

dave lukins
28 Jun 12,, 22:38
Auf Wiedersehen bis zum nächsten Mal deutscher.

tankie
28 Jun 12,, 22:40
Krauts certainly had their chances

Double Edge
28 Jun 12,, 22:44
That would have been an awesome game if it was a final. A difficult act to beat.

Now its Italy & Spain in the finals.

Considering how well England held Italy back, have there been any thoughts about that. English defense was better.

kato
28 Jun 12,, 22:53
This calls for:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3CVHRy4M-Q

phoggy
29 Jun 12,, 09:39
After the Match (1)
_______________________________________

" The future for Germany lies within that team, but tonight you could clearly see they hit the wall. They were outplayed by Italy in the first half and Italy produced a magnificent display in the second half. Italy get all the credit tonight, they were deserved winners. As a whole team Germany couldn't match up with Italy, they lost all the battles in midfield. They couldn't control Pirlo, they couldn't control Montolivo, they couldn't control De Rossi. And on nights like this you need a star and tonight Balotelli was that man."

Jürgens Klinsmann on BBC / 28.06.2012

29520

phoggy
29 Jun 12,, 09:46
After the Match (2)
__________________________________________________ ___

1.
German wife : “ Honey, do you want, that I cook for you Spaghetti today ?”
German husband : “ NO ! NO ! NO ! I don´t want Balotelli …eh..eh..eh…I means Spaghetti any more !” :mad::mad::mad:

2.
Balotelli… eh..eh..eh …Spaghetti will be banished from menu of German families for one month – exceptional Tutti…Frutti ! :):):)

Double Edge
01 Jul 12,, 20:07
Right, this is the big one.

Who will lift the cup ?

kato
01 Jul 12,, 20:32
The pre-final show is rather ridiculous.

tankie
01 Jul 12,, 20:32
Close call , hmmmmmmmmmmmm Spain 2 1 .

kato
01 Jul 12,, 20:33
Italy 3:2.

Double Edge
01 Jul 12,, 21:02
SPAIN 1 - 0

:Dancing-Banana:

tankie
01 Jul 12,, 21:04
Hope it carries on like this ,, Spain one up , a fab goal

Double Edge
01 Jul 12,, 21:18
Dunno m8, Italy are looking more threatening.

I want Spain to win.

Double Edge
01 Jul 12,, 21:28
Spain 2:0

yesssssssssssss!

tankie
01 Jul 12,, 21:41
Spain is the best i've ever seen . If Italy get back into this game it must rank as an all time great.

Double Edge
01 Jul 12,, 22:14
Italy are playing one man down, they are dead.

tankie
01 Jul 12,, 22:29
Italy are playing one man down, they are dead.

Yes shame for them but i dont think 11 would have made a difference Spain were brill , made history .

Double Edge
01 Jul 12,, 22:35
Spain have been struggling for decades to win and finally they get a golden team that did it 3 times in a row :)

And they did it without Villa & Pujol :eek:

dave lukins
01 Jul 12,, 23:34
Italy were well beaten and given a masterclass on how to play football by Spain. Balotelli storming off at the end was the only sour note to the whole evening which is a pity as he is such an arrogant, angry young man. One day he will grow up to be a great footballer.

Double Edge
01 Jul 12,, 23:58
Yes shame for them but i dont think 11 would have made a difference Spain were brill , made history .
Germans knackered them in the semi-final. Italy had to go over & beyond to beat them. They can be proud of that.

A bad decision to use all subs early, maybe Brandelli had no choice. Could have been different. A 2-1 win was deffo possible.

tankie
02 Jul 12,, 09:28
I hope our UK side was watching just how a TEAM should play , thoroughly enjoyed them , well done Spain , magnificent ,, Pirlo was not allowed to operate and Baloteli made to look 3rd rate ,,,,, ole . :cool:

Bigfella
02 Jul 12,, 12:27
Hate Spain, despise Italy. Any time Italy loses in a major tournament by 4 goals is a good day, so I'll take the win.

Double Edge
02 Jul 12,, 17:09
I hope our UK side was watching just how a TEAM should play , thoroughly enjoyed them , well done Spain , magnificent ,, Pirlo was not allowed to operate and Baloteli made to look 3rd rate ,,,,, ole . :cool:
This is the thing, will this tiki taka sytle of play catch on with other teams. Now that Spain has 3 trophies to show for it. I think not, culture plays a bigger role. Maybe in southern europe but not in the north.

England's is an attacking style of play not cagey hold onto the ball.

Double Edge
02 Jul 12,, 17:19
Here we go, no goaline tech until there is more consultation.

UEFA want decision on goalline technology delayed | Reuters | Jul 1, 2012 (http://in.reuters.com/article/2012/07/01/soccer-euro-platini-technology-idINDEE86003P20120701)


The International Football Association Board (IFAB), comprising the four British associations and four members from FIFA, is expected to sanction the use of technology when it meets in Zurich on July 5.

UEFA have been experimenting with a five-man refereeing team, including two assistants who stand behind the goal, and UEFA want IFAB to endorse their system at the same time as delaying any decision on technology.

"We have evaluated 1,000 matches at the highest level and Pierlugi Collina, (UEFA's refereeing officer) showed us all the situations and benefits following three years of tests," said Infantino.

"The executive committee of UEFA unanimously agreed to issue a statement for full support for this system and to request to IFAB and FIFA to allow the five referees to officiate in the future.

"The results from these 1,000 matches were extremely positive and there was just one serious mistake. Unfortunately it happened during these Euros as we all know, but there was unanimous support.

"The executive committee is asking FIFA and IFAB to start an open debate about technology in football involving all stakeholders before any decision is taken in this area."

Any amendment to the law needs at least six of the eight members of IFAB to vote in favour which is widely expected to be the case in Zurich.