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Two Tours in Afghanistan: Twenty Years and Two Armies Apart Read more: http://period

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  • Two Tours in Afghanistan: Twenty Years and Two Armies Apart Read more: http://period

    probably not much new, but still interesting i think

    Major Kinnunen is a lean, hard, soft-spoken infantryman whose eyes do not always smile when his mouth does. He has recently completed his second tour of duty in Afghanistan, which is not that unusual except that his first tour was over twenty years ago with the Soviet 40th Army This is his story

    Read more: Two Tours in Afghanistan: Twenty Years and Two Armies Apart - Military Review
    If i only was so smart yesterday as my wife is today

    Minding your own biz is great virtue, but situation awareness saves lives - Dok

  • #2
    BD1 Reply

    Ville,

    This was a valuable contribution. I'm primarily interested in the Soviet use of SPETSNATZ in offensive operations. Further, the use of SPETSNATZ units to support conventional operations suggests a far more expanded role than our SPECOPS forces have thus far seen in Afghanistan. Last, it was interesting that, although apparently little-used, Maj. Kinnunen's SPETSNATZ battalion was fully capable of mounted operations with two motorized (BTR) companies and one mechanized (BMP) company.

    Those units evidently possessed a great deal of operational flexibility as a result of those vehicles.

    Thanks for the article.
    "This aggression will not stand, man!" Jeff Lebowski
    "The only true currency in this bankrupt world is what you share with someone else when you're uncool." Lester Bangs

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    • #3
      glad you found it interesting. there is very little publicly written about our war there, if not counting ordinary reporters doing quick tours there. anything more specific is not in the open, even in my local mil.-forum is quite hush about these things. OPSEC and personal details are probably the reasons
      If i only was so smart yesterday as my wife is today

      Minding your own biz is great virtue, but situation awareness saves lives - Dok

      Comment


      • #4
        BD1 Reply

        "...there is very little publicly written about our war there..."

        True. Like the Romanians, Danes, Norwegians, Poles and others, all collectively representative entities of tiny countries with small correspondent/military scholar coverage.

        Someday, perhaps, there might be a well-written study of the experiences these military organizations acquired while deployed to Afghanistan. Major Kinnunen's review is a good first start.
        "This aggression will not stand, man!" Jeff Lebowski
        "The only true currency in this bankrupt world is what you share with someone else when you're uncool." Lester Bangs

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks for that very interesting piece. Not being a military man like S2 I probably don't fully appreciate the conditions and tactics described, but the competence of the Major clearly shows through. If he is typical of Estonia's officer corp and men, then it would seem that your country is well served by its military.
          To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

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          • #6
            Sir,the issue is very complicated.At least in our case the lack of reporting is a blessing in disguise.Army magazines have an article about A-stan in each edition(not very useful and informative,if you ask me),but otherwise the war gets in the news when of ours dies .That's good because the public opinion lacks the occasion to call the uniformed ones ''mercenaries'' each day .The bad thing is 95% have no darn idea why we're there and what we stand to gain.Experience mostly.
            OPSEC nears absurd heights in some higher echelons and that's the mildest way I can put it in public and in English.You'll get more details from English speaking media about deployments and ops.
            To give a hint of this,the very existence of SOF was made public only after an American diplomat thanked them publically.How the SOF are worshiped in your country is visible for a child.
            Most of the institutional lessons will probably be put to use in 10 years,when the current crop of mid-level officers rises to the top.
            One thing I could tell you.We ,as the rest of the Combloc are even better at COIN than your guys.We can drink water from a well and don't smash doors, to put it that way.Funny thing is in the early days in A-stan,the locals looked at the BTR's resembling APC's and AK's with suspicion.It took many unheard of Malkasians to convince them we disliked the Russians as much as them
            Those who know don't speak
            He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

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            • #7
              Mihais Reply

              "...We ,as the rest of the Combloc are even better at COIN than your guys.We can drink water from a well and don't smash doors, to put it that way..."

              Perhaps. However, I'd prefer you not resort to gross stereotypes to make your point. Given the small sample size of your forces I suspect America could field a veritable "A" team of COIN-attenuated pros into a brigade-sized element. Whether, 1.) we'd achieve the requisite coverage given Afghanistan's immense size, complexity and problems and, 2.) extract satisfactory results is another matter.

              COIN-based principles and practices have a disputable legacy. Whether derived of flawed implementation, poor conception or both is debatable. I know where I stand on that discussion but I'd be characterized as a dinosaur possessing a striking resemblance to Attila.
              "This aggression will not stand, man!" Jeff Lebowski
              "The only true currency in this bankrupt world is what you share with someone else when you're uncool." Lester Bangs

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              • #8
                Sir,it's not about stereotypes,not even about numbers.You know very well what I think about the whole COIN stuff.In essence police work with a military veneer worthy of being thrown at the dustbin while we return to the ole fashion style of war .My point was that given the restraints of our current policy,we're closer culturally from these people and we show greater empathy.That's the unanymous opinion of everyone I talked to.Given how critical of our own shortcomings and how appreciative of what's good in US army we are,I have little reason to doubt the assesment.And I know for sure I'd be challenged to play the nice guy.But I'll do it.Preferably after conducting some Spetsnaz style search and destroy missions.
                Those who know don't speak
                He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

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