PDA

View Full Version : Pakistan Military Airbase Under Attack!



IHM
22 May 11,, 20:27
Breaking News

KARACHI: Several explosions have been heard near the PAF Museum on Dalmia Road in Karachi. The force of the blasts have shattered the windows of surrounding buildings, reports said.

Heavy gunfire was also reported after the explosion. An eyewitness said that the blasts took place near the gate of Faisal Base.

“We have four dead and five wounded but the number could rise,” a security official told Reuters.

A large fire and a thick cloud of smoke has also been reported. Security forces have sealed the area.

“We are trying to check the cause of the blast. I cannot say,” said a senior police official. Another police official said gunfire was also reported from inside the base, Reuters reported.

“Several blasts were heard inside, the firing is still continuing,” Aslam Khan, a senior police officer at site told AFP.

“It’s a terrorist attack. More than 10 terrorists are inside. They have attacked a navy air station located in a Pakistan Air Force base,” said provincial home ministry official Sharfuddin Memon.

“One of the four aircraft inside the premises has been damaged,” he added.

Militants attack Karachi military base | Metropolitan | DAWN.COM (http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/22/loud-explosion-heard-near-paf-museum.html)

IHM
22 May 11,, 20:29
Blasts and cross firing continues for last two hours...

S2
22 May 11,, 20:36
Thanks, IHM. I've been trying to follow this but a thread was taken down elsewhere. Seems at least one P-3C Orion has been destroyed. What's interesting is that naval buses were thrice targeted in the last few weeks prior to this attack. Further, there was, if I understand correctly, considerable security ostensibly in place with the airfield some distance from entry-points.

How these guys penetrated as far as they apparently did will prove interesting.

IHM
22 May 11,, 20:42
Thanks, IHM. I've been trying to follow this but a thread was taken down elsewhere. Seems at least one P-3C Orion has been destroyed. What's interesting is that naval buses were thrice targeted in the last few weeks prior to this attack. Further, there was, if I understand correctly, considerable security ostensibly in place with the airfield some distance from entry-points.

How these guys penetrated as far as they apparently did will prove interesting.

You're welcome friend! One of my close friends from PAF updated me that 3 P3C have been destroyed. Pakistani media reports only one Orion!

OMG! Flood of conspiracy theories have begun in Pakistan. Blame the USA and India!! Few "analysts" explicitly mean that MOSSAD, CIA, RAW, Xe are hellbent on destroying Pakistan. Very sad state of affairs!!

IHM
22 May 11,, 20:48
Steve Buddy,

I think this is all inside! These terrorists have penetrated the intelligence agencies and Pakistan's military! There are loads of sympathizers of terrorists, serving as top echelons in Pakistan's military. PA has become very disgraceful with virtual intelligence failure time and again. Pakistan is better without them :mad:

IHM
22 May 11,, 20:52
... Latest but unconfirmed

Another blast few minutes back set two choppers blown on fire

IHM
22 May 11,, 20:58
My assessment!

How come Pakistan's nuclear installations can remain safe anymore? The place which has been attacked is completely NO GO ZONE for civilians! And security was extremely beefed-up; but it couldn't thwart off the attack.

IHM
22 May 11,, 21:07
Updates...

One another blast... 7th in a row!

P-3C is completely on fire; since it has huge fuel tank, therefore, flames and smoke are of epic proportions.

Double Edge
22 May 11,, 21:25
How these guys penetrated as far as they apparently did will prove interesting.
Indeed. This blowback was expected.

Wanted to start a thread to keep track of the implications for Pakistan over the OBL affair. This looks like strike#3 against Pakistan.

Question of course is how many more are required before the state is galvanised enough to strike back in force and how far that strike goes. The opportunity for the state to redeem herself in the eyes of her citizens and the wider world always remains.


I think this is all inside! These terrorists have penetrated the intelligence agencies and Pakistan's military! There are loads of sympathizers of terrorists, serving as top echelons in Pakistan's military. PA has become very disgraceful with virtual intelligence failure time and again. Pakistan is better without them
You're aware how easy it is for others to play this line up even more. I think it needs more evidence to back up. For instance how easy is it going to be to stage a similar attack like this again.

The last time if i recall correctly something like this happened was the attack at Rawalpindi GHQ, how far did the perps get that time. Penetrated the compound but no further and were beaten back eventually. Very symbolic. ZOMG ZOMG :)

My point is this attack has more PR value for the Jihadis than anything more. Its also pretty clear WHO they are targeting, ie Pakistan as in the state rather than her people. Pure insurgency. From this pov the attack on the Saudi diplomat earlier is in the same vien, attacking the supporters or allies of Pakistan. Are they going to try and go after the Chinese next, i wonder.

IHM
22 May 11,, 21:31
Question of course is how many more are required before the state is galvanised enough to strike back in force and how far that strike goes. The opportunity for the state to redeem herself in the eyes of her citizens and the wider world always remains.



Your views exactly resonate with the concerned and well-enlightened citizens of Pakistan!

This "Strategic Depth" has transformed into Strategic Death of Pakistan. Please wake up, Pakistan!!!

IHM
22 May 11,, 21:36
... If the civil government has any power then it should sack the chiefs of armed forces and intelligent agencies; but alas, the civil government seems hostage to the military establishment!

Double Edge
22 May 11,, 21:48
... If the civil government has any power then it should sack the chiefs of armed forces and intelligent agencies; but alas, the civil government seems hostage to the military establishment!
Only if you have a Pakistani spring :)

There has to be sizeable support from the ppl first before the state can act.

The only time what you asked for happened was in the 70s. Army & air force chief gone in 2 days. So there is a precedent but that bar is very high.

IHM
22 May 11,, 22:04
P 3-C is burning. Look at this picture

Militants storm PNS Mehran in Karachi | Metropolitan | DAWN.COM (http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/23/loud-explosion-heard-near-paf-museum.html)

S2
22 May 11,, 22:46
Inam,

"...From this pov the attack on the Saudi diplomat earlier is in the same vien, attacking the supporters or allies of Pakistan. Are they going to try and go after the Chinese next, i wonder."

These are some thought-provoking ideas. At least in Karachi there've been some non-civilian targets of late.

Your friends and you must be very careful now. The ISI will be looking for convenient scapegoats.

notorious_eagle
23 May 11,, 00:03
- 2 P3 Orions completely destroyed
- PN Marines and SSG-N are leading the operation now
- All foreigners are safe in the base
- No hostages taken by the terrorists
- 4 terrorists taken into custody
- Remaining terrorists are holed up inside and are surrounded by the special forces

Operation is still ongoing

notorious_eagle
23 May 11,, 00:05
Thanks, IHM. I've been trying to follow this but a thread was taken down elsewhere. Seems at least one P-3C Orion has been destroyed. What's interesting is that naval buses were thrice targeted in the last few weeks prior to this attack. Further, there was, if I understand correctly, considerable security ostensibly in place with the airfield some distance from entry-points.

How these guys penetrated as far as they apparently did will prove interesting.

It appears that they penetrated through the sewage system. The attackers knew the base very well and were able to quickly navigate to the hangars where the air assets were parked.

citanon
23 May 11,, 00:19
My assessment!

How come Pakistan's nuclear installations can remain safe anymore? The place which has been attacked is completely NO GO ZONE for civilians! And security was extremely beefed-up; but it couldn't thwart off the attack.

You've hit the nail on the head there. This attack and other recent events really make me wonder about the security of those nukes.

Parihaka
23 May 11,, 00:20
It appears that they penetrated through the sewage system. The attackers knew the base very well and were able to quickly navigate to the hangars where the air assets were parked.

Inside job?

citanon
23 May 11,, 00:22
It appears that they penetrated through the sewage system. The attackers knew the base very well and were able to quickly navigate to the hangars where the air assets were parked.

How could they have gotten these plans?

notorious_eagle
23 May 11,, 00:38
Inside job?

It looks like it, as soon as they got in they went straight to the hangars, they knew exactly where to hit. Anyways I am just speculating here, but one thing i know for sure is that their is going to be a thorough investigation as 2 valuable assets have been destroyed. Heads will definitely roll, wouldn't be surprised at all if the CNS is forced to offer his resignation and if there is inside help, the culprits will be found and brought to justice. Its similar to what happened after the assassination attempt on Musharraf, there was support from within the Army but at very lower level ranks, the people found guilty were swiftly picked up and eliminated.

notorious_eagle
23 May 11,, 01:50
Now there are reports that hostages have been taken, God dont know who to trust.

Parihaka
23 May 11,, 02:15
Now there are reports that hostages have been taken, God dont know who to trust.

It's difficult getting accurate information from the Pakistani media as the various claims and counterclaims over OBL showed. As OoE pointed out then, the truth will come out eventually. Meanwhile my condolences to all the serving personnel and their families.

Dreadnought
23 May 11,, 02:16
Definatly NOT the goverment/military.

Accounts of militant training camp near bin Laden


Email this Story

May 22, 2:11 PM (ET)

By CHRIS BRUMMITT

(AP) In this January 2011 satellite image, Guli Badral, Pakistan and the surrounding villages and...
Full Image



GULI BADRAL, Pakistan (AP) - In this Pakistani village surrounded by forests and glacial streams just 35 miles from where Osama bin Laden was killed, people become uneasy when asked what goes on up the mountain.

It's where villagers avoid cutting pine trees for firewood. And where they know not to ask questions.

When pressed, they say it's a secret training complex for Islamic militants and that the Pakistani army is aware of it - even though the army denies that it exists.

Accounts gathered by The Associated Press in the Ughi area of Mansehra district add to suspicion that Pakistan is playing a "double game" - that is, accepting U.S. aid to fight militants on the one hand but tolerating and in some cases even encouraging and harnessing the power of extremism on the other.


Three men who identified themselves as mujahedeen - militants - told the AP that the training complex is one of at least three in the region that between them house hundreds of recruits.

The mission, the three say, is aimed at taking recruits to Kashmir to fight Pakistan's archenemy, India. But Kashmiri veterans have been known to join forces with al-Qaida and other terror groups, including those fighting the U.S. and its allies in Afghanistan and elsewhere.

The charges of Pakistani duplicity have gathered strength in the aftermath of the May 2 U.S. raid against bin Laden, who was hiding in the army town of Abbottabad and a short walk from a military academy. Pakistani officials have denied any collusion, but the country is now coming under renewed pressure to abandon its links to all Islamist militant networks.

In 2001, Pakistani President Gen. Pervez Musharraf said the country was severing its ties to jihadi groups amid intense American pressure following the Sept. 11 attacks. But few are convinced that has happened.

The Mansehra area, a roughly four-hour drive north of the capital, Islamabad, was known to have hosted state-backed militant groups in the 1990s. The region was considered ideal for such activities largely because it is so close to Kashmir - about 25 miles from Pakistani-administered Kashmir, and about 45 miles from the boundary of the Indian-controlled part of Kashmir. Both countries claim the territory in its entirety.


(AP) In this May 9, 2011 photo, a Pakistani shopkeeper waits for customers in Guli Badral, Pakistan. ...
Full Image


When contacted by the AP last week, the army denied there are any training camps or any facilities hidden away in the Mansehra area. "The allegations are baseless," said spokesman Maj. Gen. Athar Abbas.

But in Guli Badral, locals say both extremists and men they presume to be soldiers are a familiar sight in the village square, where they shop for meat, flour and beans before getting back into pickup trucks for the two-hour trip along a rough track to the training camp.

The three militants who spoke to the AP about the camps did not give their names and asked that the names of their organizations not be published. They said there's an army checkpoint on the road leading to one of the larger camps, near the village of Khatai. Militants and villagers alike gave the same advice to an AP team: Do not attempt to get any closer. It's too dangerous.

At least one of the militants appeared motivated to speak out because of anger at the army, which he said was no longer so supportive as it once was. Before 2001, Kashmiri-focused militant groups had offices across the country where they could openly recruit and allegedly received considerable state funds.

The man said the army was "putting up hurdles" to the group's work, including briefly arresting some of its members. He gave no details.

But it's widely believed that the army has been unwilling to go a step further and dismantle militant training camps and crackdown on the groups using them.

The reason: Pakistan's obsession with neighboring India as an existential threat. The two countries have fought three wars since 1947 - two over Kashmir - and remain in a state of semi-hostility.

India has a larger army, so Pakistan views militants as a cheap and motivated force when needed.

Pakistan's alleged harboring of Afghan Taliban factions is also related to its hostility toward India. Pakistan fears being encircled by India, and wants an Afghan regime hostile to New Delhi when U.S. troops eventually withdraw.

"Pakistan has never changed its policy of using jihad as an instrument of its defense policy, even after 9-11," said Arif Jamal, author of "Shadow War: The Untold Story of Jihad in Kashmir."

"They do not want evidence of that getting out, but everybody knows what they are doing," Jamal said.

But this policy comes with a price.

Many of Pakistan's former jihadi proxies have already turned against their former patrons in disgust at their collaboration with Washington after 9/11. Allied with al-Qaida and the Pakistani Taliban, they have carried out scores of suicide attacks within Pakistan.

One group, Lashkar-e-Taiba, is of growing concern to the West because it is believed to be seeking international links and modeling itself on al-Qaida. Foreigners have attended its camps. Lashkar operatives were trained in Pakistan before carrying out the 2008 terror attacks in the Indian city of Mumbai.

The three militants who spoke to the AP said all the bases in Mansehra were training recruits for jihad in Kashmir, not Afghanistan. An essential part of that process is religious indoctrination, especially a willingness to kill - and die - for Islam, said Jamal, who visited Mansehra camps about a decade ago.

The camp near the village of Khatai houses a mosque big enough for 2,500 worshippers as well as dormitories and classrooms, according to one militant, who said his job is to deliver supplies like boots and jackets to the facility. He said firing exercises take place deeper inside the forest, where the recruits stay in tents.

Recruits may enroll in a four-week course that covers basic military skills, or three-month stints with extensive instruction in guerrilla warfare, according to this militant. He said "chosen graduates" are then sent to the Pakistani-controlled part of Kashmir for more explosives training.

Not every graduate goes on to fight, he said.

"We don't make just killing machines. Rather, we are trying to make them God-fearing men so that they don't do anything wrong during jihad," said the second militant.

The camp supplier said the training camps temporarily closed down in 2005 after an earthquake that killed 80,000 people brought international attention and aid groups to the region.

A signboard hammered into the ground in Guli Badral indicates that the American government once funded a health clinic here.

It's a poor region, where men chop wood to fire up the kettle in ramshackle tea houses, and boys ride donkeys down the main street.

Like northern Pakistan as a whole, its people are conservative Muslims. The militants, many of whom come from elsewhere in Pakistan, are known universally as the mujahedeen or holy warriors, an honorable group in Islam.

Militants garnered public goodwill - and donations - for their work in helping those affected by the earthquake.

"The mujahedeen do their own work," said school teacher Mohammad Sadiq. "They do not disturb anyone unless you cross into their territory."



iWon News - Accounts of militant training camp near bin Laden (http://apnews1.iwon.com/article/20110522/D9NCL3M00.html)

citanon
23 May 11,, 03:15
Terror attack on Karachi naval station, 10 killed (http://www.ndtv.com/article/world/terror-attack-on-karachi-naval-station-10-killed-107558)


"I can confirm that security forces have killed six of the attackers while the rest are holed up in one building of the air station and are fighting a losing battle," Malik (interior minister) told Aaj television channel....


The terrorists, numbering between 12 and 15, targeted PNS Mehran where some Chinese engineers were reportedly engaged in work within the Faisal airbase, at about 10.40 pm, sources said.

Reports suggest there is a hostage situation and the terrorists have taken over a building in the military complex. They are holding three Chinese military personnel hostage, reports say....


The militants apparently entered the Naval base and hangers through the Pakistan Air Force museum, a source said.

"They took advantage of the fact that people at that time were leaving for home from the PAF museum inside the Faisal base," the source said....

Parihaka
23 May 11,, 03:28
From what I understand the component parts are stored in different locations and require different authorities to combine them.

zraver
23 May 11,, 04:41
ISI jihadi puppets unleashed to target an asset that will make Americans think Pakistan is really in the fight, but targeted so it looks like RAW is behind it since losing P-3's benefits India's strategic picture. Probably also had sensitive equipment removed before hand for sale to China since the chain of custody is now shattered.

Julie
23 May 11,, 04:44
Dread:

May I ask, what relevancy your post has to this thread ??? :confused:

xinhui
23 May 11,, 04:49
I am not sure those P-3s are operational as a line-unit yet.

Dreadnought
23 May 11,, 05:16
Dread:

May I ask, what relevancy your post has to this thread ??? :confused:

Homegrown militants and how uncontrolable the situation is becoming in the last few days with attacks on Police, Army and now Navy installations, i can move to another thread Julie and delete from this one if you think more suitable.:)

citanon
23 May 11,, 05:25
ISI jihadi puppets unleashed to target an asset that will make Americans think Pakistan is really in the fight, but targeted so it looks like RAW is behind it since losing P-3's benefits India's strategic picture. Probably also had sensitive equipment removed before hand for sale to China since the chain of custody is now shattered.

Z, what about the Army's pride? You'd think they'd try to avoid something this embarrassing, or at least space out the humiliation a little more.

To me, this looks like the viper that Pakistan has been harboring in her bosom, is coming back to bite.

S2
23 May 11,, 05:56
"ISI jihadi puppets unleashed to target an asset that will make Americans think Pakistan is really in the fight, but targeted so it looks like RAW is behind it since losing P-3's benefits India's strategic picture. Probably also had sensitive equipment removed before hand for sale to China since the chain of custody is now shattered."

Very, very speculative.

Just as likely that some TTP element was able to contact and presuade/coerce some low-level base personnel into facilitating entry. What's happened here is unknown. The Pakistanis don't know. Nobody really does and likely never shall.

The only thing clear to me is a reasonably well-planned, well-executed sabotage op.

indian
23 May 11,, 06:12
Mostly done with insider help
pics:courtesy Bharat-Rakshak

indian
23 May 11,, 06:17
http://http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-13495127

BBC is saying there is a hostage situation there with foreign nationals

Double Edge
23 May 11,, 09:58
It appears that they penetrated through the sewage system. The attackers knew the base very well and were able to quickly navigate to the hangars where the air assets were parked.
How helpful would the cleaning staff be for this ?

Enough to get a general layout of the place.

Julie
23 May 11,, 12:22
Homegrown militants and how uncontrolable the situation is becoming in the last few days with attacks on Police, Army and now Navy installations, i can move to another thread Julie and delete from this one if you think more suitable.:)Just wanted it stated for the record. You can proceed here. :)

notorious_eagle
23 May 11,, 14:12
- 11 Pakistan Naval Soldiers killed, 3 Pakistan Rangers killed
- 4 terrorists captured, 6 killed

I honestly cant believe the utter incompetence of the Pakistan Navy, in a matter of hours 1/3 of Pakistan's ASW capability has been destroyed.

Kasrkin
23 May 11,, 14:13
I've been to these facilities, security was very tight and that was in better times. Security has been beefed up everywhere now. On the other it is a massive place with airfields and hangers seated in the middle of a massive city, so that would have helped with infiltration. The dedication and sophistication of these terrorists is impressive. Very embarrassing for the Pakistani Military nevertheless. Demonstrates a failure of intelligence as well as perimeter security.

Kasrkin
23 May 11,, 14:35
RUSI - Implications of the Karachi attack (http://www.rusi.org/analysis/commentary/ref:C4DDA43893D896/)

zraver
23 May 11,, 16:22
"ISI jihadi puppets unleashed to target an asset that will make Americans think Pakistan is really in the fight, but targeted so it looks like RAW is behind it since losing P-3's benefits India's strategic picture. Probably also had sensitive equipment removed before hand for sale to China since the chain of custody is now shattered."

Very, very speculative.

Just as likely that some TTP element was able to contact and presuade/coerce some low-level base personnel into facilitating entry. What's happened here is unknown. The Pakistanis don't know. Nobody really does and likely never shall.

The only thing clear to me is a reasonably well-planned, well-executed sabotage op.

of course it is, but watch over the next several days my post will reflect the various theories that begin to bubble up depending on what faction the poster favors. India and the US will blame the ISI, Pakistan will blame Indian supported afghanis and baluch terrorists and we both know the USN is worried about what might be sent to China.

drhuy
23 May 11,, 16:31
geez, now they said there were only 4-6 militants. who said Taliban cant have their own 'SEAL'

Dreadnought
23 May 11,, 17:18
KARACHI, Pakistan (AP) - Pakistani commandos regained control of a naval base Monday from a team of Taliban militants who attacked then occupied the high-security facility for 18 hours - an exceptionally audacious act of insurgent violence that dealt a humiliating blow to the military.

The attackers - thought to number around six - destroyed at least two U.S.-supplied surveillance planes and killed 10 security officers, officials said. At least four of the attackers were killed, and two others may have escaped, said Pakistan Navy chief Nauman Bashir.

The Pakistani Taliban claimed responsibility for the assault in the city of Karachi. The militants said it was revenge for the May 2 American raid that killed al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden, and the insurgents were under orders to fight until the death.

"They do not want to come out alive, they have gone there to embrace martyrdom," said spokesman Ahsanullah Ahsan.


The insurgent team armed with grenades, rockets and automatic weapons stormed Naval Station Mehran under cover of darkness late Sunday, using ladders and cutting the wire to get into the facility, Interior Minister Rehman Malik said.

Once inside, they scattered around the compound, setting off explosions and hiding in the sprawling facility.

During the day Monday, the militants were holed up in an office building in a gunbattle with commandos, navy spokesman Irfan ul Haq said. Navy helicopters flew over the base, and snipers were seen on a runway control tower.

By the afternoon, Haq said the militants had been defeated. "Thanks be to God, the base is cleared and the operation is over," he said. Commandos leaving the complex flashed victory signs to reporters.

Malik said he saw some of the bodies of the attackers, even showing a picture of one lying bloodied on the grass that he took with his cell phone. He said the were dressed in black and looked "like the Star Wars characters."


Six Americans and 11 Chinese aviation engineers were on the base but escaped unharmed, he said.

The insurgents' ability to penetrate the facility rattled a military establishment already embarrassed by the unilateral American raid on bin Laden and raised the possibility they had inside help.

It will also likely lead to more questions over the safety of Pakistan's nuclear weapons. In 2009, Islamist terrorists stormed army headquarters close to the capital, holding hostages for 22 hours. But unlike the attack Sunday in Karachi, the attackers then failed to deeply penetrate the complex.

The unilateral U.S. raid on bin Laden's compound in the northwest Pakistani garrison city of Abbottabad has triggered a strong backlash against Washington, as well as rare domestic criticism of the armed forces for failing to detect or prevent the American operation. Pakistani leaders insist they had no idea the al-Qaida boss had been hiding in Abbottabad.

This is the third major attack the group has claimed since the bin Laden killing. The others were a car bombing that slightly injured American consulate workers in the northwest city of Peshawar and a twin suicide attack that killed around 90 Pakistani paramilitary police recruits.

At least two P-3C Orions, maritime surveillance aircraft given to Pakistan by the U.S., were destroyed, he said. The U.S. Navy puts the cost of the planes at $36 million each.

The United States handed over two Orions to the Pakistani navy at a ceremony at the base in June 2010 attended by 250 Pakistani and American officials, according to the website of the U.S. Central Command. It said by late 2012, Pakistan would have eight of the planes.

U.S. Embassy spokesman Alberto Rodriguez said the Americans were working as contractors to help support the P-3C aircraft but did not report to the U.S. Embassy or Consulate. Four of them were part of a Lockheed Martin contract engineering and technical support team, he said.

Karachi, a city of around 18 million people, has not been spared the violence sweeping the country, despite being in the south and far from the northwest where militancy is at its strongest. In April, militants bombed three buses taking navy employees to work, killing at least nine people.

The Pakistani Taliban and other militant groups have little direct public support, but the army and the government have struggled to convince the people of the need for armed operations against them. The militants' identification with Islam, strong anti-American rhetoric and support for insurgents in Afghanistan resonates with some in the country.

Also Monday, Pakistani intelligence officials said a pair of suspected U.S. missiles hit a vehicle and killed four people near the Afghan border. It was the latest in an uptick of strikes following the bin Laden raid.

The attack occurred in Machi Khel area in North Waziristan, a tribal region home to several militant groups attacking U.S. forces in Afghanistan. The U.S. relies heavily on missile strikes to target foes in Pakistan. Pakistan objects to the attacks publicly, but is believed to support them in private.

The two officials spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to talk to reporters. They said they did not know the identities of the people killed.

iWon News - Pakistani troops retake naval base from militants (http://apnews1.iwon.com/article/20110523/D9ND69C81.html)

diablo49
23 May 11,, 18:05
2 escaped!? Jesus.:mad:

citanon
23 May 11,, 18:08
KARACHI, Pakistan (AP) - Pakistani commandos regained control of a naval base Monday from a team of Taliban militants who attacked then occupied the high-security facility for 18 hours - an exceptionally audacious act of insurgent violence that dealt a humiliating blow to the military.

The attackers - thought to number around six - destroyed at least two U.S.-supplied surveillance planes and killed 10 security officers, officials said. At least four of the attackers were killed, and two others may have escaped, said Pakistan Navy chief Nauman Bashir.

The Pakistani Taliban claimed responsibility for the assault in the city of Karachi. The militants said it was revenge for the May 2 American raid that killed al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden, and the insurgents were under orders to fight until the death.

"They do not want to come out alive, they have gone there to embrace martyrdom," said spokesman Ahsanullah Ahsan.


The insurgent team armed with grenades, rockets and automatic weapons stormed Naval Station Mehran under cover of darkness late Sunday, using ladders and cutting the wire to get into the facility, Interior Minister Rehman Malik said.

Once inside, they scattered around the compound, setting off explosions and hiding in the sprawling facility.

Just six of them, got in with ladders and wire cutters, and 2 might have escaped?!! :eek::mad::confused:

Dreadnought
23 May 11,, 18:26
Another source:

Islamabad, Pakistan (CNN) -- At least 10 members of Pakistan's military were killed in a gun battle with Taliban militants at a naval base in the coastal city of Karachi, authorities said Monday.

The clashes raged for hours after attackers with guns and grenades stormed the compound Sunday night. By Monday afternoon, the base had "been cleared from the terrorists," a Pakistani navy spokesman said.

In addition to the 10 dead, at least 15 other Pakistani troops were wounded in the fighting, Pakistani Interior Minister Rehman Malik said.

Investigators have found the bodies of three attackers and believe a fourth is buried in debris, he said. They suspect two militants escaped, he said, citing witness reports.

The Pakistani Taliban said the attack at the Mehran naval air station was to avenge the killing of innocent civilians. The group's spokesman, Ihsan Ullah, told CNN on Monday that Pakistani security forces are carrying out those killings on the instruction of the United States in the name of a "war on terror."

One of the attackers had detonated a suicide jacket, Malik said, and another one was found wearing an undetonated jacket.

"We have daily 9/11 in this country. You see how we are suffering," he said. "And therefore, this is my appeal to the international community ... trust us, trust us, because this is a time we need you to support us morally."

Authorities said militants wielding rocket launchers, automatic weapons and hand grenades attacked the base about 11 p.m. Sunday. They used ladders to scale a wall at the back of the base and jumped into the compound, Malik said.

Two witnesses -- Amjad Bashir and Talha Hashmi -- reported at least 10 explosions in the subsequent hours.

Each blast was typically followed by a sustained exchange of gunfire, Hashmi said.

He said that several of the explosions -- thought to be the result of two military aircraft and a fuel tank catching fire and releasing plumes of smoke -- were particularly large.

The attackers destroyed two P-3C Orion maritime patrol aircraft sold by the United States to Pakistan, Pentagon spokesman Col. Dave Lapan said. Six American contractors at the base during the attack moved to safety and were not injured, he said.

The nation's military personnel responded with what an Malik called a "major operation" at the base, which is about 10 kilometers (6 miles) from Karachi's main airport.

According to the Pakistani navy's website, the Mehran base "is efficiently supporting day and night operational activities of all (naval aviation) squadrons." A host of courses are also offered on its grounds, from helicopter and air navigation instruction to sea survival.

The Pakistani Taliban represents a confederation of Taliban groups in northwestern Pakistan, where they are based. The group, which is headquartered in Quetta, is separate from the Afghan Taliban, which has been focused on re-establishing the Islamic Emirate in Afghanistan. Both groups swear allegiance to Taliban leader Mullah Omar and have close ties to al Qaeda.

Karachi, which is considered the main commercial hub of Pakistan, has seen a drastic increase in political, ethnic and religious violence in recent months.

Just over three weeks ago, three people were killed and at least 20 were injured when a hand grenade exploded at a gambling club in the southern Pakistani city.

The grenade was tossed into the club by one of two unidentified people riding past the facility on a motorbike, according to Javed Baloch, a senior police official in Karachi.

The Taliban said it was behind an April 28 roadside bombing on a main road through Karachi that left at least five dead and 10 injured.

Two days earlier, three were killed and more than 30 wounded when remote-controlled bombs detonated near two buses carrying Pakistani navy officials.

10 Pakistani troops killed in gun battle at naval base - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/23/pakistan.base.attack/index.html)

siddharth
23 May 11,, 20:35
Pakistan is gonna be in deep shit. America probably understands that if militants climb up a ladder and light up a country's important naval base, the nukes aren't too far down the road. And also the army and air force bases.:frown:

Vinod2070
23 May 11,, 20:43
My assessment!

How come Pakistan's nuclear installations can remain safe anymore? The place which has been attacked is completely NO GO ZONE for civilians! And security was extremely beefed-up; but it couldn't thwart off the attack.

At the other place, they are claiming it was easy for civilians to just walk in! It apparently had a museum that anyone can walk in.

Also marriage halls!

xinhui
23 May 11,, 20:57
"ISI jihadi puppets unleashed to target an asset that will make Americans think Pakistan is really in the fight, but targeted so it looks like RAW is behind it since losing P-3's benefits India's strategic picture. Probably also had sensitive equipment removed before hand for sale to China since the chain of custody is now shattered."

Very, very speculative.

Just as likely that some TTP element was able to contact and presuade/coerce some low-level base personnel into facilitating entry. What's happened here is unknown. The Pakistanis don't know. Nobody really does and likely never shall.

The only thing clear to me is a reasonably well-planned, well-executed sabotage op.



I agree it is very speculative. even with burned out wreckage, there are ways to account for missing eq. that said, there are Chinese in that base, but the American who are there will surely know if something fishy is going on.




Malik said 17 foreigners -- 11 Chinese and six Americans -- were inside the base at the time. All had been evacuated safely. The Americans were contractors working for SAIC and Lockheed Martin doing maintenance on the aircraft.

Two P-3C Orions, maritime patrol aircraft supplied by the United States, were destroyed, said Colonel David Lapan, a Pentagon spokesman.

Pakistan retakes naval base after attack - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110523/wl_nm/us_pakistan_blast;_ylt=AihwvjqOAqCVwR79ksUwu7NvaA8 F;_ylu=X3oDMTJpMmttZW1hBGFzc2V0A25tLzIwMTEwNTIzL3V zX3Bha2lzdGFuX2JsYXN0BGNwb3MDMQRwb3MDMgRzZWMDeW5fd G9wX3N0b3J5BHNsawNwYWtpc3RhbnJldGE-)

Double Edge
23 May 11,, 21:05
..and we both know the USN is worried about what might be sent to China.
Then why give the P-3's to Pakistan in the first place and deliver 6 more in 2012 :confused:

Dreadnought
23 May 11,, 23:29
Then why give the P-3's to Pakistan in the first place and deliver 6 more in 2012 :confused:

Because these planes were surplus and upgraded (wings replaced,elect suite changed) to replace the ancient ones they had for the job. I doubt they are a match to the USN standard these days. The US isint dumb to China's eyes being friendly with the Paks. And India herself showed an intrest in these same planes to replace the Bears from what i read but chose another option in planes such as the Boeing P-81 (export) Posiden MMA (multimission maritime aircraft) these are to be delivered starting in 2013 to the Indian Navy.

I wont post the article because I dont have a link for it but im pretty sure you can find one linked to the story if you look for the plane between the two military sites.

zraver
23 May 11,, 23:59
I agree it is very speculative. even with burned out wreckage, there are ways to account for missing eq. that said, there are Chinese in that base, but the American who are there will surely know if something fishy is going on.


Pakistan retakes naval base after attack - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110523/wl_nm/us_pakistan_blast;_ylt=AihwvjqOAqCVwR79ksUwu7NvaA8 F;_ylu=X3oDMTJpMmttZW1hBGFzc2V0A25tLzIwMTEwNTIzL3V zX3Bha2lzdGFuX2JsYXN0BGNwb3MDMQRwb3MDMgRzZWMDeW5fd G9wX3N0b3J5BHNsawNwYWtpc3RhbnJldGE-)

Oh it is speculative, but no you can't account for anything but black boxes when a plane burns. Planes are mainly made of alumanum which ignites at the combustion temps of many other items but burns at near 7000 degrees. A burning plane is a thermal hell that leaves little behind but scorched earth.

Dreadnought
24 May 11,, 02:02
In fairness, this is the article I mentioned above about the P3's but I do not have a credible link. I'll post it here, take it at face value.


New Patrol Aircraft in South Asia

April 25, 2006: In April, 2006, Lockheed Martin Corp. was awarded an initial $6 million contract to begin upgrading P-3C aircraft purchased by Pakistan, the US' on-again, off-again ally in the War on Terror. Pakistan has ordered nine of the aircraft from the US Navy's surplus fleet. At the same time, the US' own P-3C felt is deteriorating fast under a heavy work load. The Navy is finding it increasingly difficult to maintain its own squadrons. In fact, the US Navy is decommissioning its six remaining Reserve patrol squadrons so that their aircraft can be sent to active duty squadrons (the last reserve squadron will be gone by 2008). Approximately 140 US Navy P-3Cs have been prematurely retired since 2003 because of deterioration, as well as to make available money for the P-8A Multimission Maritime Aircraft being developed for introduction to the US fleet in 2012. In the past three years the Navy has been flogging itself under an intense program of re-winging its lowest time P-3Cs as well as bringing all of its P-3Cs up to the latest tactical capabilities.

In November, 2004, Pakistan had given Portuguese aircraft refitter OGMA a contract to refurb its two P-3Cs, which had been grounded since 1999 following the crash of a third during training. At that time, Pakistan was considering purchasing eight older P-3B aircraft from the US' "boneyard" at David Monthan AFB, where scores of older P-3As and P-3Bs are stored. The most modern version of the P-3B – the P-3B TACNAVMOD "Super Bee"-- uses the same airframe, engines, and flight systems as the original P-3C, but the mission systems, sensors, sensor stations, and interior layout are very different.

In May, 2005, Pakistan decided to obtain P-3Cs, which would be upgraded to a capability similar to the US Navy's Anti-Surface Warfare Improvement Program (AIP) and the Block Modification Upgrade Program (BMUP). This upgrade includes the ability to see ground activity in any weather, in great detail, and fire Maverick and SLAM-ER guided missiles. The upgrade would also include better sensors for electronic warfare activity. In addition, Pakistan has also expressed the intention of adding modifications to the aircraft to allow it to employ the French Exocet and Chinese C-802 anti-ship missiles, as well as the French-Italian A244 torpedo. All these mods would give these P-3Cs formidable capabilities over land. Such aircraft have been heavily used by the U.S. Navy since the 1990s.

Pakistan took delivery of its first new P-3C in October, 2005, and began its replacement of its fleet of creaky Atlantique and Fokker F-27-200/400 maritime-patrol aircraft. The new aircraft are ostensibly to be used in the War on Terror, although only a nugget would not also expect them to be used to keep an eye on India as well.

Pakistan's arch rival India had been looking at the eight ex-US P-3Bs to replace its outdated fleet of ex-Soviet Bear aircraft but earlier this year announced that, instead, it was pursuing talks to acquire the smaller, cheaper, and far less capable Falcon 900 maritime patrol aircraft derivative. The Indian Navy's eight Tu-142 maritime patrol aircraft are obsolete and cost a small fortune to continue to operate. India had approached several Israeli companies to upgrade its Bears. However, this negotiation was ended when Russia – another US "ally of convenience" whose loyalties seem up for the highest bidder – warned that any contracts with Israeli companies would result in Russia's suspending any support for the India's Tu-142s.

The initial $6 million contract is just the start. The P-3C aircraft for Pakistan will be paid for, in part, through US military assistance as part of the global war on terror, and the total cost for the eight airplanes plus upgrades is initially estimated to be $970 million. The P-3Cs are to be part of a weapons acquisition contract expected to be worth $1.3 billion. Other weapons included in the package are 2,000 TOW-2A missiles, 60 Harpoon missiles, six Phalanx 20mm guns, and the upgrade of six additional gun systems.

Indian Navy

Boeing Submits Proposal to Indian Navy for Long-Range Maritime Patrol Aircraft

(Source: Boeing Co.; issued April 13, 2006)

ST. LOUIS --- A team led by Boeing today submitted its proposal to develop and deliver eight long-range maritime reconnaissance and anti-submarine warfare aircraft to the Indian navy.

Boeing is offering a variant of its P-8A Multi-mission Maritime Aircraft, which is currently in development for the U.S. Navy. The proposed aircraft would provide India with a significantly improved maritime patrol and reconnaissance capability.

"We have proposed a unique system that will enhance the capability of the Indian navy in anti-submarine and anti-surface warfare," said Rick Buck, Boeing program manager for P-8A international programs. "The increased range, speed, radius of action and advanced combat power inherent in our 21st century solution will enable the Indian navy to fully patrol and influence events in its entire operational region. Additionally, the commonality inherent in our solution will greatly enhance the interoperability and supportability objectives publicly supported by both the U.S. and Indian navies."

Boeing is the prime contractor and systems integrator for the U.S. Navy's P-8A Multi-mission Maritime Aircraft. The Boeing team includes CFM, Northrop Grumman, Raytheon and Smiths. The U.S. Navy plans to purchase 108 aircraft, with deliveries beginning in 2009.

Boeing's proposal includes the development of a unique Indian navy P-8 configuration, significant participation for Indian industry, test and certification activities, and eight aircraft delivered over a four-year period.

Under the request for proposal, bids were to be submitted by April 13, 2006, with first deliveries occurring within 48 months of the contract award.

A unit of The Boeing Company, Boeing Integrated Defense Systems is one of the world's largest space and defense businesses. Headquartered in St. Louis, Boeing Integrated Defense Systems is a $30.8 billion business. It provides network-centric system solutions to its global military, government and commercial customers. It is a leading provider of intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance systems; the world's largest military aircraft manufacturer; the world's largest satellite manufacturer and a leading provider of space-based communications; the primary systems integrator for U.S. missile defense; NASA's largest contractor; and a global leader in sustainment solutions and launch services.

subba
24 May 11,, 20:53
Actually i am quite happy that 2 Orions were destroyed. Lesser danger and threat to India. American arming of Pakistan has always hurt India and provided the Pakistani's with a sense of renewed adventurism against India.

However what worries me are the conflicting reports coming in. First about the number of attackers, hostages and then nothing no hostages and voila only 4 attackers of which 2 escaped..15 hours post start of attack.

1. This obviously would have had some sort of internal help.

2. What happened to the Hostages? If they got the Orions, would'nt they have got some Chinese hostages as was being reported through the night? I think they were released in exchange for 'free passage'.

3. ISI False flag possibly to divert attention from the Rana trial linking ISI to 26-11, or the Osama episode showing the PA to be victim also.

4. Precursor ISI false flag to others to follow as the trial possibly drags ISI to the mud, to be followed by a big incident in India.

5. Genuinely worried about Pakistani Nukes. (Not them being stolen, but the uniformed Jihadi's enacting a sell out under attack and JDAM on India their pet paranoia).

6. Worried about some media reports in the West that say terror is 'OK' against India but red lines apply if carted to the West.

If i am not mistaken the GOI would be thinking and worried on these grounds.

Tronic
25 May 11,, 00:30
The articles regarding the Indian navy which you put up is somewhat outdated. Indian Navy has already selected the P-8I as its future maritime patrol aircraft.




Boeing India Home: P-8I (http://www.boeing.co.in/ViewContent.do?id=3264)

The Indian navy is the first international customer for the P-8. Boeing signed a contract Jan. 1, 2009, to deliver eight long-range maritime reconnaissance and anti-submarine warfare aircraft to the Indian navy. Boeing will deliver the first P-8I within 48 months of contract signing, and the remaining seven by 2015......

.....The P-8I is the first international model of the P-8A. In July 2010, Boeing successfully completed the final design review (FDR) for P-8I, locking in the design for the aircraft, radar, communications, navigation, mission computing, acoustics and sensors, as well as the ground and test support equipment. The final design review also paves the way for the program to begin assembling the first P-8I aircraft.

Dreadnought
25 May 11,, 02:10
Actually i am quite happy that 2 Orions were destroyed. Lesser danger and threat to India. American arming of Pakistan has always hurt India and provided the Pakistani's with a sense of renewed adventurism against India.

However what worries me are the conflicting reports coming in. First about the number of attackers, hostages and then nothing no hostages and voila only 4 attackers of which 2 escaped..15 hours post start of attack.

1. This obviously would have had some sort of internal help.

2. What happened to the Hostages? If they got the Orions, would'nt they have got some Chinese hostages as was being reported through the night? I think they were released in exchange for 'free passage'.

3. ISI False flag possibly to divert attention from the Rana trial linking ISI to 26-11, or the Osama episode showing the PA to be victim also.

4. Precursor ISI false flag to others to follow as the trial possibly drags ISI to the mud, to be followed by a big incident in India.

5. Genuinely worried about Pakistani Nukes. (Not them being stolen, but the uniformed Jihadi's enacting a sell out under attack and JDAM on India their pet paranoia).

6. Worried about some media reports in the West that say terror is 'OK' against India but red lines apply if carted to the West.

If i am not mistaken the GOI would be thinking and worried on these grounds.

Umm, India has brought American arms as well my friend, it wasnt just Pakistan and not just planes as far as I know.

The first major sale of US military hardware was a refurbished warship, the USS Trenton, renamed INS Jalashwa. It is India's second largest naval combat vessel and is participating in the current military exercise. Another large transaction was the acquisition of six Hercules C-130J military transport aircraft worth $1 billion. It was India's largest arms purchase from the US, so far.

This was an article in 2007

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/II08Df01.html

Dreadnought
25 May 11,, 02:11
The articles regarding the Indian navy which you put up is somewhat outdated. Indian Navy has already selected the P-8I as its future maritime patrol aircraft.

Understood, it was just diffacult to find a half decent article where the two and some background are mentioned. Thanks

notorious_eagle
25 May 11,, 03:21
Investigation team to probe PNS Mehran attack
DAWN.COM
(1 hour ago) Today

Prime Minister Syed Yousuf Raza Gilani talking to media persons at PNS Mehran after attending a high level briefing about the terrorist’s attack on the Naval Base. - File Photo

KARACHI: An investigation team headed by a Rear Admiral of the Pakistan Navy began formal investigation into the PNS Mehran attack on Tuesday, DawnNews reported.

According to Interior Ministry officials the investigation team includes officers from Pakistan Air Force, FIA, Rangers and Naval Intelligence along with Pakistan Navy officers.

A senior officer of the Interior Ministry’s Crisis Management Cell has said that the PNS Mehran attack has caused Pakistan a loss of 6.47 billion Rupees.

The team will review the incident, collect evidence and record statements of on-duty officers present on the field.

The official also said that due to security reasons the name of the head of the committee is being withheld.

Separately, PPP member Abdul Qadir Patel chaired a National Assembly’s Standing Committee meeting on the PNS Mehran incident, calling the attack a security failure.

The committee said that the intelligence agencies had failed. Expressing concern over the incident the committee called upon the heads of intelligence agencies.

According to the committee the government does not have a policy in place to end terrorism.

Investigation team to probe PNS Mehran attack | Pakistan | DAWN.COM (http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/24/investigation-team-to-probe-pns-mehran-attack.html)

Dreadnought
25 May 11,, 04:11
Let me guess the outcome....We have a TERRORIST infestation and we refuse to find our ass with both hands until we are good and ready or threatened to do so!:eek::eek::biggrin:

Let me rephrase that...Until another country has to cross our borders to kill those that do nothing but kill for a living and then we scream "soverignty" and "murder" of a known worldwide terrorist but ignore the real issue that they live, train and attack from Pakistan soil and "we have no idea of this", or "there is no evidence to prove this".

So whats everybody so mad about?:rolleyes:

Dreadnought
25 May 11,, 04:50
US terrorist links Pakistani ISI to Mumbai attacks
May 24, 6:55 PM (ET)

By EILEEN SULLIVAN and SOPHIA TAREEN

CHICAGO (AP) - An admitted American terrorist who scouted sites where militants went on a deadly three-day rampage in Mumbai in 2008 speaks so softly that at times he's difficult to hear.

But echoes of David Coleman Headley's testimony alleging close coordination between Pakistan's main intelligence agency and militants are reverberating far beyond the Chicago courtroom where he is the government's star witnesses in a terrorism trial at a pivotal moment in U.S.-Pakistan relations and the global fight against terror.

Headley's troubling allegations in the trial of a Chicago businessman accused of collaborating in the three-day siege on India's largest city come just weeks after Navy SEALs found Osama bin Laden hiding in a military garrison town outside Islamabad, raising concerns that Pakistan - which receives billions of dollars in U.S. aid - may have been protecting the world's most wanted terrorist.

Pakistan has deflected the accusations and repeated what it's maintained since 2008: The country's top intelligence agency, the Inter-Services Intelligence agency, known as ISI, had no links to Lashkar-e-Taiba, the Pakistani-based terrorists who claimed credit for the Mumbai attacks.

"It is nothing," a senior ISI official told The Associated Press when asked about Headley's testimony.

Not so to the U.S. government, which has guided Headley through days of testimony where he provided rare insight into the web of international terrorism. Headley's longtime friend, Chicago businessman Tahawwur Rana, is accused of helping Headley establish a cover story so he could do pre-attack surveillance in India beginning in 2006.

The ISI knew about the plot and helped fund and direct the three-day assault in November 2008 that killed more than 160 people, including six Americans, Headley said. A "frogman" in Pakistan's military even helped select a landing site in Mumbai where Lashkar terrorists would arrive by boat, he testified.

Headley recalled an instance a few years before the Mumbai plot conception when Lashkar leaders wanted to get signoff from the ISI before making a decision that could have diplomatic consequences with the U.S.

"They coordinated with each other, and ISI provided assistance to Lashkar," Headley said.

Headley shared some of these details with Indian authorities last year. But his testimony in a Chicago federal courtroom is the first time the 50-year-old Pakistani-American has spoken publicly in the U.S. about his role.

"The fact that the government is making him our witness says a lot," said Rep. Peter King, the New York Republican who chairs a key homeland security oversight congressional committee. The testimony, King said, is sending a signal to Pakistan. "Pakistan has to be more cooperative and has to do a better job in cutting its ties" with terrorists, he said.

The White House had no comment when asked about the implications of Headley's testimony.

Headley, who said he started working with Lashkar in 2000, said the Pakistan-based terror group, which means Army of the Pure in Urdu, and the ISI operate under the same umbrella.

As Headley scouted sites for targets in Mumbai, he met regularly and received money from someone he said was an ISI major, known only as "Major Iqbal." U.S. officials think that is an alias and his real name is not known.

Iqbal and Headley's regular Lashkar contact, Sajid Mir, both gave him the same instructions for where to go and what to scope out, though mostly in separate meetings, he said. Headley would provide videos he took of sights in Mumbai to Iqbal and then to Mir.

Headley said Mir and Iqbal were in contact with each other. In one instance, Iqbal told Headley that he would be provided with a list of potential sites in Mumbai, and later Mir gave Headley the list.

In October 2008, Headley said he and his Lashkar and ISI handlers all met together in Pakistan, just one month before the attacks. During this meeting, the men also talked for the first time about a separate plot to attack a Danish newspaper that in 2005 had printed cartoons of Prophet Muhammad, Headley said. That plot was foiled by law enforcement.

"I suggested we only focus on the cartoonist and the editor," Headley testified of a later meeting with Mir. "He said, 'All Danes are responsible for this.'"

Prosecutors also showed emails between the three men - some of them forwarded to Rana - detailing points on the Mumbai attacks and the aftermath. They wrote in code from ever-changing email addresses including some that came from transliterated Urdu words into English.

Born Daood Gilani, Headley grew up both in the United States and Pakistan, the son of an American mother and a Pakistani father. At times during court testimony, attorneys had to ask Headley, who talks softly with a slight British accent, to speak up so his testimony could be heard.

Though Rana is on trial, much of Headley's testimony so far has focused on his dealings with Iqbal, Mir and Abdur Rehman Hashim Syed, identified by prosecutors as a retired Pakistani military with links to Iqbal. Syed was referred to as "Pasha" during testimony and three are charged in absentia.

The senior ISI officer told the AP that they have no idea who Major Iqbal is. "Do you have any idea how many Iqbals there are in Pakistan?" he asked. The officer spoke on condition of anonymity because his agency does not allow its members to be named in the media.

Some experts have been skeptical about Headley's testimony and say he is not the most credible witness. Headley reached a plea deal with prosecutors in the terrorism case in exchange for avoiding the death penalty and previously had been an informant for the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration after a conviction on heroin smuggling charges.

Rana's attorney has called Headley "manipulative" and accused him of leading many lives.

Though the U.S. has had a long relationship with Pakistan, King said it is out of necessity, not love. And allegations that the ISI was working with terror groups is not new.

The ISI, which is part of Pakistan's military, has a history of spawning and funding jihadi groups to fight India, in particular for the disputed territory of Kashmir. Pakistan's military relies heavily on these groups in the absence of the conventional might to take on India, defense analyst Ayesha Siddiqua has said.

Former President Pervez Musharraf long ago promised to cut off close ties with militants, but there is no evidence that he followed through.

iWon News - US terrorist links Pakistani ISI to Mumbai attacks (http://apnews1.iwon.com/article/20110524/D9NE3ERO0.html)

Vinod2070
25 May 11,, 05:42
Well, the facts are clear.

The PN and PAF have been infested with terrorist sympathizers. The PA already had a large number of them.

The future looks pretty bleak. There doesn't seem any willingness to take on the menace, not even an acknowledgement of the deep shyt they are in.

Not even a thought about changing the course which brought them to this pass, just passing the buck.

It is India which forced them to be so heavily military centric country, the USA which abandoned them after using them, the politicians which refuse to order the drone shooting down and so on.

Tronic
25 May 11,, 05:48
Umm, India has brought American arms as well my friend, it wasnt just Pakistan and not just planes as far as I know.

The first major sale of US military hardware was a refurbished warship, the USS Trenton, renamed INS Jalashwa. It is India's second largest naval combat vessel and is participating in the current military exercise. Another large transaction was the acquisition of six Hercules C-130J military transport aircraft worth $1 billion. It was India's largest arms purchase from the US, so far.

This was an article in 2007

Asia Times Online :: South Asia news - US exercising India's military muscles (http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/II08Df01.html)

Dread, Pakistan buying its weapons is not a problem. I think what subba is inferring to is the US military aid to Pakistan which has resulted in that country acquiring India specific conventional weapons such as Harpoon missiles, upgraded F-16s, even P-3Cs. Pakistan is now demanding they also get the Predator. Ironical for a country which hasn't even showed a willingness to actively fight on the ground and such overt hostility to Drone strikes to be requesting the same drones for themselves. :rolleyes: Pakistan actually 'buying' these weapons is a totally different cup of tea. ;)

Dreadnought
26 May 11,, 05:07
Tronic, I dont think you will have to worry as Pakistan wont be demanding anything about Drones.

lemontree
28 May 11,, 14:38
ISI jihadi puppets unleashed to target an asset that will make Americans think Pakistan is really in the fight, but targeted so it looks like RAW is behind it since losing P-3's benefits India's strategic picture. Probably also had sensitive equipment removed before hand for sale to China since the chain of custody is now shattered.

My thoughts exactly...there are 3 aircraft sqns and 2 chopper units in PNS Mehran (P3C Squadron (28 Sqn), Atlantic Squadron (29 Sqn), Fokker Squadron (27 Sqn), Seaking Squadron (111 Sqn) and Alouette Squadron (333 Sqn)....and the jihadis blow up only 3 acs?..

Double Edge
28 May 11,, 18:58
Pakistan is now demanding they also get the Predator. Ironical for a country which hasn't even showed a willingness to actively fight on the ground and such overt hostility to Drone strikes to be requesting the same drones for themselves. :rolleyes: Pakistan actually 'buying' these weapons is a totally different cup of tea. ;)

Tronic, I dont think you will have to worry as Pakistan wont be demanding anything about Drones.
Any chance of an understanding that Pakistan will get said drones once operations conclude as a pre-condition to having allowed them to conduct operations ?

They operate from Pak bases so they are already half-pakistani :biggrin:

highsea
28 May 11,, 22:02
Any chance of an understanding that Pakistan will get said drones once operations conclude as a pre-condition to having allowed them to conduct operations ?No.

The drones are useless without the supporting infrastructure, and the US isn't going to start turning over military satellites to Pakistan (or anyone else).

Parihaka
28 May 11,, 22:03
Oops, highsea beat me to it....

highsea
28 May 11,, 22:23
Well shit, what are we supposed to do? Bring PAF pilots to Florida or Nevada so they can hold the joystick?

The whole "give us drones" thing is smokescreen. They know it's impossible, it's just propaganda.

Parihaka
28 May 11,, 23:57
The whole "give us drones" thing is smokescreen. They know it's impossible, it's just propaganda.

Never underestimate the stupidity of a politician.

highsea
29 May 11,, 03:49
Agreee

(double post, too may eee's)