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Namelessone
23 Apr 10,, 21:05
FOXNews.com - Ariz. House votes to check candidates' citizenship (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/04/21/ariz-house-votes-check-candidates-citizenship/)

PHOENIX (AP) The Arizona House has approved a bill that would require President Barack Obama to show his birth certificate if he hopes to be on the state's ballot for a re-election bid.

The House approved the measure on a 31-29 vote, sending it to the Senate.

It would require U.S. presidential candidates who want to appear on the ballot in Arizona to submit documents proving they meet the constitutional requirements to be president.

Supporters say the bill would help settle a controversy over whether Obama was born in the United States.

Opponents say it's a waste of time that makes Arizona mocked by the rest of the country. Obama has released his Hawaii birth certificate proving he's a "natural-born citizen" qualified to be president.

gunnut
23 Apr 10,, 21:22
What was the argument put forth by gun-grabbers all the time? Why not register if you don't have anything to hide?

Gun Grape
23 Apr 10,, 22:48
Idiot Birther bill. Now signed into law. Along with the "Driving while Hispanic" bill.

The idiots have taken over the asylum in Arizona.

The Constitution says that it is the responsibility of Congress as the Electoral College to verify eligibility if there is doubt.

Its not up to the state to decide if someone is eligible for federal office. Someone will sue, the law will be voided as unconstitutional.

bfng3569
23 Apr 10,, 23:42
Idiot Birther bill. Now signed into law. Along with the "Driving while Hispanic" bill.

The idiots have taken over the asylum in Arizona.

The Constitution says that it is the responsibility of Congress as the Electoral College to verify eligibility if there is doubt.

Its not up to the state to decide if someone is eligible for federal office. Someone will sue, the law will be voided as unconstitutional.

kind of like washington huh?

and it might not be up to the state to decide if they are or are not eligable, but whats to stop the state from requiring the proof that they are?
and whats the big deal about actually requiring a canidate to prove they meet the legal requirements to hold the office they are running for?

Gun Grape
24 Apr 10,, 15:36
and it might not be up to the state to decide if they are or are not eligable, but whats to stop the state from requiring the proof that they are?

The Constitution. It is the responsibility of the Fed to make that decision, through the EC and certifying through a joint session of Congress.

If there is a question of "eligibility" all it takes is 1 Senator and 1 House member to bring it to the floor for investigation.

So in fact, the States do have a mechanism to require proof. Through their elected Federal members of Congress.



and whats the big deal about actually requiring a canidate to prove they meet the legal requirements to hold the office they are running for?

Already a mechanism to do so.

The major parties send a letter to every State stating that their candidate meets all eligibility requirements so that their candidate can get on the ballot.

If the State has a reason to think that info is false, they can either take it up in the courts prior to the inauguration or at the EC certification in Congress.

A State doesn't have the Constitutional authority to impose their own requirements for a Federal office

Roosveltrepub
24 Apr 10,, 15:59
I'm kind of surprised they haven't moved on to some theory Obama actually died as an infant and a kenyan was put in his place.

Bigfella
25 Apr 10,, 01:26
So much for the 'birthers' being a 'fringe' group comparable to 'truthers'. Firdt Dominionists set the curriculum in Texas, now 'birthers' passing bills in Arizona. The lunatic fringe just went mainstream. Glenn Beck must be so proud.

Julie
25 Apr 10,, 02:50
McCain said if Obama doesn't like AZ. law, he can put troops on border.

JAD_333
25 Apr 10,, 03:17
By gosh, the states are acting feisty these days. But they be better off avoiding silly stuff like this.

Maybe it's a grab for campaign contributions. A congressman recently remarked (can't recall his name) that if he'd advocate shooting illegal immigrants and dumping their bodies over the border, donation to his campaign would quadruple overnight.

I doubt it will pass the AZ senate.

JAD_333
25 Apr 10,, 03:36
McCain said if Obama doesn't like AZ. law, he can put troops on border.


Julie:

Wasn't McCain talking about Arizona's new immigration law and isn't the border in question the Ariz-Mexican border?

Julie
25 Apr 10,, 04:19
Julie:

Wasn't McCain talking about Arizona's new immigration law and isn't the border in question the Ariz-Mexican border?Yes, but this involves alot of violence beginning to occur, and McCain had requested troops on the border, but wasn't granted. Then, poof, this occurs.

And yes, states are getting feisty these days, but I think the more power the Federal Government tries to wield, the feistier the States are going to become. History has proven this.

JAD_333
25 Apr 10,, 05:26
Yes, but this involves alot of violence beginning to occur, and McCain had requested troops on the border, but wasn't granted. Then, poof, this occurs.

And yes, states are getting feisty these days, but I think the more power the Federal Government tries to wield, the feistier the States are going to become. History has proven this.

I like it. Time the states started reminding the central government where it got its power. I am feeling like a loyal citizen of Virginia these day. I'm still 100% for the Union, but damned if I'll back a national popular vote for president. The states should decide who becomes president. But I stray... :)

McFire
25 Apr 10,, 14:27
Good for Arizona. Having been stationed there for four years, I can say that Arizonans are maverics compared to other states. If they think something needs to be done, they'll do it. The hell what the rest of the country thinks. The rest of the country doesn't live in Arizona and therefore shouldn't dictate how Arizonans should live.
Seems to me that if an ILLEGAL immigrant is in our country ILLEGALLY, shouldn't we send them back to where they came from so they can come back LEGALLY? Is it that hard to pull a small piece of plastic from one's pocket to prove their identity? Why is the constitution being applied to those ILLEGALLY in our country?
Will obama ever produce the actual birth certificate and put an end to the controversy? His certificate doesn't look like any of my in-laws' birth certificates (they were all born and raised in Hawaii). Though I do think he was born in Hawaii, he probably has some embarassing/controversial skeletons in his closet.

Julie
25 Apr 10,, 14:51
I fully agree on all points.

highsea
25 Apr 10,, 17:47
The birth certificate issue is pure baloney. I don't have my original either, it's a copy.

There were two daily newspapers in Honolulu in 1961, both of them had birth announcements for Obama, as was the custom back then. I've seen them, the microfilm photocopies are available on various web sources.

As far as I'm concerned, that ends the question.

On the other matter, the Arizona border- it is complete chaos there, and if the federal gov't refuses to act, it's the responsibility of the state gov't to do so.

The Tuscon sector of CBP intercepted 241,000 illegals last year alone, in that ONE sector. They catch somewhere between 1/4 to 1/10 of them, so that tells us how many get through.

The violence is spilling over in a big way. There were 650 kidnappings in Phoenix last year. Ranchers getting murdered, gunfights with border patrol, there is a $250,000 bounty on border agents from the Juarez Cartel.

Absolutely we need National Guard on the southern border.

bfng3569
25 Apr 10,, 17:57
The Constitution. It is the responsibility of the Fed to make that decision, through the EC and certifying through a joint session of Congress.

If there is a question of "eligibility" all it takes is 1 Senator and 1 House member to bring it to the floor for investigation.

So in fact, the States do have a mechanism to require proof. Through their elected Federal members of Congress.



Already a mechanism to do so.

The major parties send a letter to every State stating that their candidate meets all eligibility requirements so that their candidate can get on the ballot.

If the State has a reason to think that info is false, they can either take it up in the courts prior to the inauguration or at the EC certification in Congress.

A State doesn't have the Constitutional authority to impose their own requirements for a Federal office

i wouldnt think that they could or would be able to impose their own requiements, but just the ability to be sure those requirements are met.

and it appears, that indirectly, they do.

Gun Grape
25 Apr 10,, 17:58
Yes, but this involves alot of violence beginning to occur, and McCain had requested troops on the border, but wasn't granted. Then, poof, this occurs.

And yes, states are getting feisty these days, but I think the more power the Federal Government tries to wield, the feistier the States are going to become. History has proven this.



McCain requested troops? How and from whom?

If the Gov of Arizona wanted troops on the border, then she can deploy the Arizona NG.

bfng3569
25 Apr 10,, 18:00
Good for Arizona. Having been stationed there for four years, I can say that Arizonans are maverics compared to other states. If they think something needs to be done, they'll do it. The hell what the rest of the country thinks. The rest of the country doesn't live in Arizona and therefore shouldn't dictate how Arizonans should live.
Seems to me that if an ILLEGAL immigrant is in our country ILLEGALLY, shouldn't we send them back to where they came from so they can come back LEGALLY? Is it that hard to pull a small piece of plastic from one's pocket to prove their identity? Why is the constitution being applied to those ILLEGALLY in our country?
Will obama ever produce the actual birth certificate and put an end to the controversy? His certificate doesn't look like any of my in-laws' birth certificates (they were all born and raised in Hawaii). Though I do think he was born in Hawaii, he probably has some embarassing/controversial skeletons in his closet.

imagine that, its now illegal in arizone to be, well, illegal.....

Gun Grape
25 Apr 10,, 18:03
Is it that hard to pull a small piece of plastic from one's pocket to prove their identity? Why is the constitution being applied to those ILLEGALLY in our country?

yea, that pesky Constitution gets in the way.

What is your reason for asking a certain individual to prove his right to be in this country?

And what piece of plastic proves US citizenship?

The Constitutional protections apply to everyone that is in the States.

Roosveltrepub
25 Apr 10,, 18:09
I wonder if the feds will step in ala GA in the 60s when 99 percent of those temporarily detained turn out to be hispanic.

JAD_333
25 Apr 10,, 18:51
This thread is veering off course...it's about Arizona's yet-to-pass law requiring candidates for national office to prove their US citizenship...

Now we're moving into the topic of immigration, which is a much more important political bomb out west.

The immigration law Arizona recently passed is creating political havoc. It seems to have caused Reid to juggle the Senate calendar, sacrificing what shred of bipartisanship remained in the Senate.

I set up a thread to discuss immigration in this light. Doing so here isn't fair to people who go by thread titles.


http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/american-politics/55464-reid-delays-climate-bill-last-minute-focus-immigration-reform.html

Gun Grape
25 Apr 10,, 23:17
As JAD stated earlier. We should move this line of discussion to the immigration thread that he posted.

This thread is about those crazy birthers. And the idiots in Arizona that passed this birther bill

Parihaka
25 Apr 10,, 23:35
posts moved
http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/american-politics/55464-reid-delays-climate-bill-last-minute-focus-immigration-reform.html

troung
25 Apr 10,, 23:42
Problem I see is this very stupid birther bill takes away from the border security issue; makes it easy to tar as the product of fringe wierdos.

Julie
25 Apr 10,, 23:43
McCain requested troops? How and from whom?

If the Gov of Arizona wanted troops on the border, then she can deploy the Arizona NG.That's what I thought also, but here it is:

McCain in Tucson, calls for troops at border
Posted: Apr 25, 2010 1:39 PM EDT
Updated: Apr 25, 2010 2:02 PM EDT

TUCSON (KGUN9-TV) - Sen. John McCain was in Tucson Saturday as part of a round of town halls in southern Arizona. The Republican is campaigning for re-election to the U.S. Senate.

The question on many peoples' minds was: "What does the senator think about Arizona's new immigration law?

McCain's message to the Obama administration and Homeland security chief Janet Napolitano - Arizona's former governor - was: get the border secured.

Speaking at a town hall at Pima Community College's east campus, McCain defended Gov. Jan Brewer's decision to sign Senate Bill 1070 into law Friday. But he would not say if he supports the law as written.

"That's a state decision. I have not had a chance to take a look, but the fact is the state is acting because the federal government hasn't," McCain said.

McCain had his own 10-point plan to boost border security. He crafted the plan with fellow Republican Sen. Jon Kyl.

"Basically, we've got to get 3,000 troops to the border and hire 3,0000 more," McCain said.

McCain in Tucson, calls for troops at border - KGUN 9 On Your Side, Tucson News, Weather & Sports (http://www.kgun9.com/Global/story.asp?S=12371682)

sappersgt
26 Apr 10,, 19:16
Problem I see is this very stupid birther bill takes away from the border security issue; makes it easy to tar as the product of fringe wierdos.

Not good timing. Passing the birther bill at the same time discredits the legitimacy of the immigration bill.