Gambian leader orders gays out or beheaded

[Traps]

Thought Leader » Michael Trapido » Because you're all criminals

Thought Leader » Michael Trapido » Africans need to start a new battle for liberation from prejudice

Just as I had xenophobia sorted out in my mind, this continent throws up another whopper.

I don't care whether you are for or against this continent needs to start whacking prejudice on the head with a baseball bat!

[felakuti]

Gambian president Yahya Jammeh has threatened to behead gays unless they leave the country. He claims that Gambia is a country of believers and that these practices are sinful and immoral.

Whatever your beliefs this much is true — an African head of state is proposing, as acceptable conduct, that members of his community, be put to death based on sexual preferences. The criminal justice system of that country to will comprise an arbitrary decision by officials as to whether a person is gay or not, and pursuant thereto whether they get to live or die. Judge, jury and executioners being made up of hate-filled homophobes.

This presents us as Africans with the following questions :

Should it ever be moral or lawful to execute or even discriminate against people based on their sexual preferences, beliefs or anything else?

Can we ever condone or allow this type of arbitrary decision to be made by the government of an African state?

Is it not time that the African Union made it compulsory for certain legal and ethical standards to be met in African countries?

What sanctions, if any, should be imposed on African states that fall below these generally accepted standards?

The president is in Tanzania to meet with African leaders at the AU where the next steps in the unionisation of Africa are being discussed.

The questions of Zimbabwe and xenophobia are high on the agenda.

Make sure the issue of Gambia joins it, Mr President

May I ask who will impose the sanctions.According to wikipedia African 4 contries have the death penaly for the crime of homosexuality and only 18 out of 53 countries have no laws punishing homosexuality.Most of the countries that lack laws against homosexuality , have just not got round to banning it.

Will be quite funny to see any African country try to impose economic sanctions on Nigeria .Even the UN have the common sense to accept that some cultures dont accept immorality and they respect that.

I think you need to understand that we Africans are socially conservative and being gay is simply not accepted in our societies whether you like it or not.

Homosexuality laws of the world - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Traps]

Felakuti as a white, African, Jew who is not homosexual I have fought prejudice against blacks, gays, Muslims and any other kinds of irrational hatreds.

You are trying to put forward that because Africans are "socially conservative" this somehow excuses their behavior or to put it another way - is just the way it is so accept it.

Pardon my saying this but this is just so much garbage.

Africa is rotting and falling apart and the sooner they rid themselves of the hatred and prejudice - that so many dictators prey on to stay in power - the sooner the continent will become more stable and attractive to investors.

From tribalism, to parties to individual hatreds Africa know no end of wars and mass killing.

If you try to justify your prejudice as rational then how can you judge others on their hatreds.

I don't care if Africans are socially Martians they better get over themselves quickly if this continent is going to come into the 21st century.

[Agnostic Muslim]

Cultural relativism is an extremely weak and discredited defense for such barbarity.

[Bigfella]

I think you need to understand that we Africans are socially conservative and being gay is simply not accepted in our societies whether you like it or not.

Cool!

So you are saying that all we have to do is put up some weak as p*ss argument about 'culture' and it is OK to do anything.

Hmmm, lets see....I think you need to understand that Europeans don't consider black Africans to be actual humans. So, hush your subhuman mouth & let us actual people get on with running the world. OK fela?

Sucks to be treated like you aren't human, doesn't it?

[Fiona Shrot]

If homosexuality cannot be accepted by most people in their society, the government should make some laws to forbid gays' bars, two men's living in hotel together, the films like Brokeback Mountain and so on. Thus gays will not affect the rest in the society too much, while have their choices and freedom to some extent. To behead someone based on his sexual preference is somewhat horrible and too severe. I am sure that a lot of gays existed 200 years back in China- the fact is reflected in some classical literary works- and at that time the society were also very conservative like some parts in Africa today, but the gays seldom got any punishment by the law and the public also never claimed for such a law. It is just my opinion. After all, Gambia has her own right and decision about how to treat gays

[Bigfella]

Felakuti as a white, African, Jew who is not homosexual I have fought prejudice against blacks, gays, Muslims and any other kinds of irrational hatreds.

You are trying to put forward that because Africans are "socially conservative" this somehow excuses their behavior or to put it another way - is just the way it is so accept it.

Pardon my saying this but this is just so much garbage.

Africa is rotting and falling apart and the sooner they rid themselves of the hatred and prejudice - that so many dictators prey on to stay in power - the sooner the continent will become more stable and attractive to investors.

From tribalism, to parties to individual hatreds Africa know no end of wars and mass killing.

If you try to justify your prejudice as rational then how can you judge others on their hatreds.

I don't care if Africans are socially Martians they better get over themselves quickly if this continent is going to come into the 21st century.

Hear Hear!

Keep on fighting Traps. You are a credit to Africa.

[felakuti]

Felakuti as a white, African, Jew who is not homosexual I have fought prejudice against blacks, gays, Muslims and any other kinds of irrational hatreds.

You are trying to put forward that because Africans are "socially conservative" this somehow excuses their behavior or to put it another way - is just the way it is so accept it.

Pardon my saying this but this is just so much garbage.

Africa is rotting and falling apart and the sooner they rid themselves of the hatred and prejudice - that so many dictators prey on to stay in power the sooner the continent will become more stable and attractive to investors.

From tribalism, to parties to individual hatreds Africa know no end of wars and mass killing.

If you try to justify your prejudice as rational then how can you judge others on their hatreds.

I don't care if Africans are socially Martians they better get over themselves quickly if this continent is going to come into the 21st century.

I was trying to point out it was very silly to try impose sanctions on nations who punish homosexuality , when most of the continent has laws or are thinking abouts laws against homosexuality.

You cant nor should you compare homosexuality to other societal prejudices. The main difference being you cant change your skin colour or your sex but as a man you can choose whether or not to have sex with another man.

I also think it is quite silly to suggest the reason Africa is not progressing is because of hatred of homosexuality.May I ask you how making homosexuality legal will progress africa in an economically.Is it going to attract the critical gay investments every country needs to survive?

The only way to stop the killlings and for africa to progress is to have nation states based on homogenous tribes. I personally think that is too late , that is why I no light in africa future.

[Bigfella]

If homosexuality cannot be accepted by most people in their society, the government should make some laws to forbid gays' bars, two men's living in hotel together, the films like Brokeback Mountain and so on. Thus gays will not affect the rest in the society too much, while have their choices and freedom to some extent. To behead someone based on his sexual preference is somewhat horrible and too severe. I am sure that a lot of gays existed 200 years back in China- the fact is reflected in some classical literary works- and at that time the society were also very conservative like some parts in Africa today, but the gays seldom got any punishment by the law and the public also never claimed for such a law. It is just my opinion. After all, Gambia has her own right and decision about how to treat gays

Fiona, there is no polite way to put this, but you don't have the first idea what you are talking about. You do not understand human rights & you do not understand democracy.

Basic human rights exist precisely to protect people from majorities who don't like them.

Lets choose an example. Lets say that the majority of people in a nation don't like Han Chinese. Is it OK to ban them from having children with each other?; from marrying?; from using Chinese names?; from speaking Chinese even in the privacy of their own homes?; How about banning all use of Chinese characters in signs or in print?

In short, is it OK to outlaw being Chinese if a majority want it?

[Bigfella]

You cant nor should you compare homosexuality to other societal prejudices. The main difference being you cant change your skin colour or your sex but as a man you can choose whether or not to have sex with another man.

I also think it is quite silly to suggest the reason Africa is not progressing is because of hatred of homosexuality.May I ask you how making homosexuality legal will progress africa in an economically.Is it going to attract the critical gay investments every country needs to survive?

Quit while you are behind Fela.

1) You can change both skin colour AND sex. Should you have to do so because a majority in your society are ignorant & prejudiced?

2) Studies show that cities with high homosexual populations are more creative & more economically productive. This has led even Singapore to loosen its traditional persecution of homosexuals.

In typical fashion, Singapore has missed the point. The cities aren't successful because there are gays there, they are successful because they are tolerant & open. This encourages intelligent, creative people to stay, or even move there.

ALL discrimination damages society. I suggest you get that through your skull quick smart.

[felakuti]

Quit while you are behind Fela.

1) You can change both skin colour AND sex. Should you have to do so because a majority in your society are ignorant & prejudiced?2) Studies show that cities with high homosexual populations are more creative & more economically productive. This has led even Singapore to loosen its traditional persecution of homosexuals.

In typical fashion, Singapore has missed the point. The cities aren't successful because there are gays there, they are successful because they are tolerant & open. This encourages intelligent, creative people to stay, or even move there.

ALL discrimination damages society. I suggest you get that through your skull quick smart.

1) I meant you cant choose your skin color or sex when your born , your born with it.You can however choose who you have sex with.

You are obviously ignorant of african culture and you should stop applying you liberals ideals here.

[felakuti]

If homosexuality cannot be accepted by most people in their society, the government should make some laws to forbid gays' bars, two men's living in hotel together, the films like Brokeback Mountain and so on. Thus gays will not affect the rest in the society too much, while have their choices and freedom to some extent. To behead someone based on his sexual preference is somewhat horrible and too severe. I am sure that a lot of gays existed 200 years back in China- the fact is reflected in some classical literary works- and at that time the society were also very conservative like some parts in Africa today, but the gays seldom got any punishment by the law and the public also never claimed for such a law. It is just my opinion. After all, Gambia has her own right and decision about how to treat gays

I agree with you on the beheading part ,its bit too nasty for me.I am mostly a fan of the firing squad.

I am normally not a strong supporter of the death penalty since it does not really act as a deterrent in most crimes and is only used a means of revenge which I dont feel is right .But giving the death penalty to those convicted of being gay is something I absolutely agree with , because there is so much evidence that shows that states who punish homosexuality have lower amount of gays in such countries.

[bolo121]

Felakuti i think you are missing his point.
You cannot hide behind the fake justification of culture to justify oppression.
The very basis of freedom is that people whom you do not agree with also have the right to speak and behave as they wish.
Persecution of people just because you feel that they are somehow unclean, or immoral is a violation of their freedom.
The more free and open a society is the more stable and prosperous it gets.

This is precisely Africa's main problem. Too much hate and too little tolerance.

[Bigfella]

1) I meant you cant choose your skin color or sex when your born , your born with it.You can however choose who you have sex with.

You are obviously ignorant of african culture and you should stop applying you liberals ideals here.

You are obviously ignorant about both sexuality & basic human rights. Stop applying your primitive prejudices here.

Opinions are relatively easy to change, sexual orientation is not. Would this mean that us 'liberal' europeans would be justified in discriminating against Africans because they CHOOSE to discriminate against homosexuals? What level of discrimination do you think would be acceptable? Should we just segregate you, or expel you from our societies entirely? Please, I am curious to know.

[Bigfella]

Felakuti i think you are missing his point.
You cannot hide behind the fake justification of culture to justify oppression.
The very basis of freedom is that people whom you do not agree with also have the right to speak and behave as they wish.
Persecution of people just because you feel that they are somehow unclean, or immoral is a violation of their freedom.
The more free and open a society is the more stable and prosperous it gets.

This is precisely Africa's main problem. Too much hate and too little tolerance.

Thank you Bolo. Spot on.