resupplying ammo while at sea

[eocoolj]

Another question for you guys:

While browsing the internet, I came upon this picture showing the USS New Mexico being resupplied with 14" shells. I assume the reloading of 16" shells for the Iowas was handled in a similar way.

How were shells transferred onto the battleships? How long would the guns have to be out of service to completely refill the magazines? In a time when the guns were being fired very often (say during WWII), how often would the magazine need replenishment? Was any replenishment at sea required during the 80s when all the Iowas were reactivated?

Thanks for your help!

[RustyBattleship]

Hoo boy! I worked in the Fittings design section for 12 years designing the Replenishment At Sea (RAS) systems that transferred such cargo over to the ships.

Most photos you will find on the Internet are of Fueling at Sea (FAS) systems because they are more dramatic looking with the 7-inch diameter fuel hoses draped from their span wires.

Cargo and ammunition uses separate equipment in the form of Replenishment tripods, Sliding Padeyes, Manila Highline, etc.

They all come under the general event of Underway Replenishment (UNREP).

Almost any RAS transfer event is scheduled to last only about 8 hours and preferably in the daylight to reduce the risk of injuries. An FAS is usually only about 2 hours unless the ship is totally dry.

On a Battleship, all ammo can be laid out on the decks as your photo shows. Then the BB's own ammo handling systems take it from there to pass it on down to the magazines.

One loadout I was on with the New Jersey at Seal Beach Naval Weapons Station (using a floating crane to load the ammo on board) all 16" projectiles and powder bags and all 5" projectiles and propellent cases were loaded onto the ship in about 8 hours. But it took the crew several more hours to pass the ammo on down to the magazines.

So, for generalization you can estimate that a ship like a BB would be off line for an entire day before being completely loaded out and ready for several more days (or weeks) of duty.

Also, during an ammo loadout, other ship's stores are also supplied such as food, coffee, medical supplies, soda pop, canned goods, etc. So during a full UNREP, the entire crew is kept pretty busy.

[Dreadnought]

Nice job Mr. L.:)

[eocoolj]

This may be a stupid question, but those shells have to be secured to the deck somehow when they are laying out like that, right? I can imagine them rolling all over the place if the sea picked up or something like that.

Also, how does the ship's ammo handling system work? Are there trap doors somewhere in the deck that the ammo is loaded down through? Surely they dont bring the ammo into the turrets and load it down that way?

[RustyBattleship]

This may be a stupid question, but those shells have to be secured to the deck somehow when they are laying out like that, right? I can imagine them rolling all over the place if the sea picked up or something like that.

Also, how does the ship's ammo handling system work? Are there trap doors somewhere in the deck that the ammo is loaded down through? Surely they dont bring the ammo into the turrets and load it down that way?

You will notice in your picture that none of the shells are set so they may roll over the side. Also small wood wedge blocks are used extensively (like wheel chocks on a carrier).

The ship's ammo handling system is a series of round "strike down" hatches in the decks and uses a wire rope system working off an outrigger on top of the turret. The same hatches are used for both projectiles and powder cannisters. It's just that the projectiles make a turn back into the turret foundation then struck down by their ammo hoists to whatever projectile flat they are to stow on. The powder cannisters go all the way down to the bottom of the ship and a series of monorails move them into the powder magazines where they are stacked like cordwood.

The 5"/38 ammo is passed into the upper handling rooms of the mounts and then struck down through their projectile and powder hoists to the magazines on the third deck.

[TopHatter]

Here's a few shots of both 16-inch and 5-inch projectiles on deck during the 80's

[eocoolj]

thanks for the pictures tophatter. I absolutely love high resolution photos of the battleships, when I can find them. If you have any more interesting ones (or if you have already posted them elsewhere), I would be really interested in seeing them. Thanks.

[TopHatter]

thanks for the pictures tophatter. I absolutely love high resolution photos of the battleships, when I can find them. If you have any more interesting ones (or if you have already posted them elsewhere), I would be really interested in seeing them. Thanks.

Go to Photo Archive Main Index if you want tons of pictures of pretty much any warship in the US Navy after the advent of steel and steam.

I usually use navsource as a quick one-stop-shop for good pictures.

Then there's the DoD media website, which is here Defense Visual Information Center (DVIC)

Just plug in the appropriate search words like "battleship" or "USS Missouri" etc

You'll find photographs like this http://www.dodmedia.osd.mil/Assets/S...-05-00339.JPEG in quantities that boggle the imagination.

You'll lose years of your life looking at these two websites, trust me.

[RustyBattleship]

Just to whet your whistles as to what the projectile stowage in turret II of an Iowa looks like:

[Gun Grape]

Question about unrep capability

With the decommissioning of the AOE-1 Class, do we still have a crane that can transfer 16in pallets at sea?

I know they could stll be transfered via vertrep. But, does the new T-AKEs have the same capability for ammo transfer?

[RustyBattleship]

With the decommissioning of the AOE-1 Class, do we still have a crane that can transfer 16in pallets at sea?

I know they could stll be transfered via vertrep. But, does the new T-AKEs have the same capability for ammo transfer?

They would have to. Actually transfer systems are much safer today and actually less complicated. We used to have high lines that were kept in a constant tension by winches or counterweights or even hydraulic cylinders. In the late 60's we had this enormouse robot amidships (USS Mahan for one) called the Fast Automatic Shuttle Transfer (FAST) to bring in missiles just for strike down (not sending). It looked like a praying Mantis with a huge head.

We had Rube Goldberg rigging systems on sending ships that would boggle the mind (as it did mine). Receiving systems weren't much better.

Then out of the blue we get a job order to install a sliding padeye on the ships.

A what?

Well, the padeye only LOOKED like it slid up and down. But it was positively controlled and took up acres of less room on a ship. Underway replenishment-at-sea.

It met all safety requirements of ammunition transfer including missiles and nuclear warheads.

And until I retired in 1994, I never heard of one breaking.

[eocoolj]

]Maybe there is no reason at all for this, but why does the Wisconsin have its #2 turret turned around almost as far as it will go in this picture? It seems like a position you would almost never have the turret in, especially while doing un underway replenishment.

[Dreadnought]

One reason may be that located underneath the turret gunhouse there is an access scuttle. This can also be used to pass powder or projectile. When the turret is rotated (such as 90^ or more in this picture it will align a crane arm located on top of the turret with the scuttle located below the gunhouse in the deck and you can hang chain falls or simular equipment from the crane arms. There is also an armored scuttle located approximately 50' from the turret in the interior of the ship on the port side next to a damage contol locker that has one of the monorail I beams and crane in the overhead.

[tlturbo]

Here are a couple more pictures that go along with what Rusty has posted and said.
Pic #1 is a sling that was used to move the shells around.
Pic #2 shows them lowering the projectile down through the deck hatch with the crane that Rusty pointed out is mounted on top of the turret.

[tlturbo]

Rusty - I have a question for you.

Here is a picture of the base plug from my 16".


There are 4 holes. The 2 round holes I assume are for some king of spanner wrench used to install the plug. When I took it out, I put a socket in each one and put a crowbar between and used that to unscrew it (reverse threaded).

BUT the other 2 holes are rectangular with a lip over hanging part of the hole. It appears something could be put into these slots, rotated 90 degrees and locked in. Kind of the same principal as replacing a burnt out tail light bulb in a car. Push in, and turn to lock it in.

I found reference that these holes were for a "padeye" and since you mentioned this same term, do you know what these holes were used for and the gadget used? I also have a pic of a projectile from the TEXAS and that smaller shell has the same exact configuration. Were they moved hanging upsidedown at some point?

Thanks - so glad to have your wealth of knowledge available.

Terry