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  • Soldiers fear JTF2 to get Nazi name

    Soldiers fear JTF2 to get Nazi name

    Defence minister's proposed new moniker for elite unit can be shortened to 'SS'

    Published: Monday, December 18, 2006

    Defence Minister Gordon O'Connor wants to change the name of the Canadian Forces' top counter-terrorism unit, but the move is causing concern among some in the military because of the possibility the new moniker could be linked to Nazi Germany.

    Mr. O'Connor is looking at renaming the Ottawa-based Joint Task Force 2 as the First Special Service Regiment. But some in the defence community are worried the abbreviated version of that, the 1st SS Regiment, could turn into a public relations nightmare because of the potential Nazi connotations.

    The SS was considered the Praetorian Guard of the Nazis and renowned for its brutality on and off the battlefield.

    Chief of Defence Gen. Rick Hillier told military personnel about the name change at a "town hall" meeting last week

    Afterwards, the Citizen received calls and e-mails from defence personnel concerned about the potential for JTF2 to be saddled with a Nazi label.

    Other soldiers pointed out that JTF2 has worked extremely hard over the last 13 years to make its name known among allied special forces units and they questioned the wisdom of changing it now.

    Defence Department sources confirmed a name change is being considered and added that First Special Service Regiment is one of the potential new labels. They did not detail what other names are being considered, if any.

    Earlier this year, the military created the country's first special operations command to oversee JTF2, as well as the recently created Canadian Special Operations Regiment, a special operations aviation squadron and an expanded nuclear, biological, chemical and radiological response unit.

    Mr. O'Connor's plan would see JTF2 and the special operations regiment referred to as the 1st and 2nd battalions of the First Special Service Regiment.

    But some in the military point out that JTF2 is unique in the Canadian Forces since it is the country's only Tier One counter-terrorism/special operations unit. That Tier One standing means it is on par with elite foreign special forces units such as Britain's Special Air Service. Giving JTF2 a battalion designation in a regiment diminishes that uniqueness and ignores the last 13 years of its history, some soldiers argue.

    Asked about Mr. O'Connor's plans to change JTF2's name and the concerns about the Nazi SS designation, Etienne Allard, the minister's director of communications, responded: "Canada's new government is in the process of reviewing the future needs and priorities of the Canadian Forces. When the Canada First defence strategy is approved by the government, announcements will be made at the appropriate time."

    Defence Department sources, however, argue it is highly unlikely the new name would be referred to as the 1st SS Regiment or as an SS Regiment. They pointed out, for instance, that the existing Royal Canadian Regiment is not called the RC Regiment when referred to in an abbreviated form. Instead, it's called the RCR. The department sources expect the new regiment will be called the 1SSR when it is discussed in military circles or in the public

    They also noted that JTF2 can trace its historical lineage to the First Special Service Force, better known as the Devil's Brigade, a joint U.S.-Canadian commando unit that operated with distinction during the Second World War.

    This is not the first time a name change for JTF2, established in 1993, has been considered.

    The military looked into renaming JTF2 in 2002 after Liberal MP David Pratt suggested the special forces unit be called something more descriptive. The name Joint Task Force 2, he said, was confusing to some parliamentarians as it gave little indication that the unit was a special forces organization. To add to the confusion, the Canadian military has a tendency to dub various organizations as a "joint task force" even though they are unrelated to the elite unit.

    Mr. Pratt, then chairman of the Commons defence committee, wrote then-Liberal defence minister John McCallum with the suggestion that JTF2 be called the Canadian Special Service Force or the Second Special Service Force. The names were in reference to the First Special Service Force of the Second World War.

    Mr. McCallum rejected the special service force label since it was too closely linked to the U.S., but he did order a review of the JTF2 name. A decision, however, was later made to stick to the status quo after JTF2's soldiers voted overwhelmingly to keep their original name.

    At the time, military spokesman Maj. James Simiana said JTF2 was the most popular moniker among those serving in the unit. "After 10 years of history, the name JTF2 has a high recognition factor by other government departments, Canadian Forces members, allies and indeed the public," he pointed out.

    JTF2 also reflects the joint aspect of the unit since its ranks are open to service from members of the army, air force and navy, Maj. Simiana noted.


    http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/...24&k=90695&p=2
    To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway

  • #2
    Heck, wouldn't be the first time Canadians had a First Special Service Force. The FSSF (joint Canadian/American special unit) was arguably the toughest unit in the entire war. I think those guys could chew iron filings and sh!t nails out to 20 feet.

    FSSF, WWII.

    -dale

    Comment


    • #3
      Oh, you wouldn't believe the names that were touted around.

      Amongst the considerations

      Ready Assault Group (RAG)
      First Assualt Group (F-A-G and later 1AG)

      Part of the problem is that most of the time we just spelled it out as in Rrr-Aie-Gee or Eff-Aie-Gee and it doesn't occur to us until someone actually said f-ag or rag.

      Comment


      • #4
        I like First Ready Assault Group (FRAG). It's a gamer term for killing another player in a first person shooter (fps) game.

        Would the head of the Ready Assault Group be RAGHEAD?

        Come to think of it, the Secret Service is already SS.
        "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

        Comment


        • #5
          First Response Operations Group has a nice ring to it.
          In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.

          Leibniz

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          • #6
            Oh god, I can just see it now, Dion accuse "miseur 'arper" of being a little ideological extreme right-wing dictator.

            Personally I would prefer if they renamed JTF2 to ULP

            Uber L337 Pwnzors

            Comment


            • #7
              Canadian Rapid Assault Parachutists
              To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway

              Comment


              • #8
                That's not my concern. My concern is that if JTF 2 gets regt colours, then it automatically gets army funding without army oversight. SOR anyone? Remember that the SOR gutted 3 RCR of its jump company and 2 Brigade got absolutely no say in the matter. Hell, 2 Brigade even lost part of CFB Pet for the SOR.

                Hell, why not restore CFB Pet back to the SOG (Special Operations Group) comprising of the SOR (Special Operations Regiment), aka the CAR (Canadian Airborne Regiment) and the JTF 2 (or whatever it will be known), aka the Pathfinders.

                While we're at it, ship 2 Brigade (the 2nd Canadian Mechanized Brigade Group) over to CFB Gagetown since the Maritimes only got one Battle Group (2 RCR, and the 8CH) and let SOG run LFCA.
                Last edited by Officer of Engineers; 20 Dec 06,, 04:16.

                Comment


                • #9
                  a special operations aviation squadron and an expanded nuclear, biological, chemical and radiological response unit.
                  A SO aviation squadrons flying what?
                  To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by troung View Post
                    A SO aviation squadrons flying what?
                    Right now, Griffins but talks are underway to see if they can hook onto the Navy's buy.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Acknowledging that it had this name long before the Nazis came around, but has anybody ever heard of the United States Secret Service?
                      “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

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                      • #12
                        I'd say First Encounter Assault Recon but it's taken.
                        As is Tactical Assault Group, which is my personal favourite (our Military CT units) so... hmm...
                        How about just calling it the Special Forces Group, with subsidairy SF Units, Detatchments and Teams that are given alpha numerical designations, with their individual purpose being 'classified'.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          how about LOG something L, Operational Group

                          Cuz I mean LOG would advertise Canadian logging well. It gives it kind of a Paul Bunyan feel, which is good, cuz he was badass.
                          In Iran people belive pepsi stands for pay each penny save israel. -urmomma158
                          The Russian Navy is still a threat, but only to those unlucky enough to be Russian sailors.-highsea

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                          • #14
                            LOG stands for LOGISTICS

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by -{SpoonmaN}- View Post
                              I'd say First Encounter Assault Recon but it's taken.
                              BLAST!!! Why didn't I think of that???

                              Just call it Special Operations Regiment. Simple and meaningless.
                              "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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