Move America Forward

[Major_Armstrong]

This looks interesting.

http://www.moveamericaforward.org/


Also see

http://www.rushonline.com

http://www.foxnews.com

[List]

Sorry, I'm not seeing the point. When I saw the title I thought it might refer to speeding up America's cultural progression. I don't see anything specific linking those three sites besides them all being right wing in some form. One is a right wing news organization, one is an anti-Kerry website warning that your life depends on defeating the democrats, and the other seems to be against any criticism of Bush/America/the war on terror. I didn't see anything groundbreaking.

[Dragoon]

Some of us think that americas social pro(Re)gression is going just to damn fast. social progression and govenrnment have nothing to do with each other. Social progression is a very one on one thing. anyone who tells you to vote for them because they want to change society is a con-man....,
Or worse They think that the government is the answer to all questions

[Major_Armstrong]

These leftists keep putting my threads in the Dead Zone on their message board. They gave me troll status, too.


http://forum.microsuck.com/cgi-bin/u...ubb=forum&f=11

[ChrisF202]

Some of us think that americas social pro(Re)gression is going just to damn fast. social progression and govenrnment have nothing to do with each other. Social progression is a very one on one thing. anyone who tells you to vote for them because they want to change society is a con-man....,
Or worse They think that the government is the answer to all questions

I think we need to slow all this social progression (gay marriage, affirmative action, immigration debates, etc) down and just think about the future of our country for a second, think about the positives and negatives.

[List]

Some of us think that americas social pro(Re)gression is going just to damn fast. social progression and govenrnment have nothing to do with each other. Social progression is a very one on one thing. anyone who tells you to vote for them because they want to change society is a con-man....,

I'm not sure what you mean. Both major American political parties have positions/policies on a number of major social/cultural issues. That includes things like gay marriage, sex-ed, and abortions. It has everything to do with the government when it's the government and the courts that need to decide whether or not certain things should be legal. What has happened in America over the last half century cannot possibly be called regression, regression would be going back to how certain things were before.

[Confed999]

These leftists keep putting my threads in the Dead Zone on their message board. They gave me troll status, too.


http://forum.microsuck.com/cgi-bin/u...ubb=forum&f=11

I'm certain most of those people would acheve the same status if they posted here. Stuff like that is why I don't post on the hard left boards, no fun.

[barrowaj]

That website is just about the biggest load of bunk I have ever seen. It seems that "moving America forward" entails silencing any criticism for the war on Iraq or the "war on terror."

Not agreeing with the Iraq war is not the same thing as being anti-American or not supporting the armed forces. Many troops themselves presumably did not agree with the war, but went to serve their country anyway.

Furthermore, the website assumes that the "war on terror" is something that is physically tangible, and winnable (through the use of force) in the first place. Anti-american sentiment is what breeds terrorists, and current US foreign policy has greatly increased anti-american sentiment.

Those extremist websites, along with left-leaning websites are contributing to the political polarization of America. This is amplified by the fact that we have only have 2 real political parties.

What do you think about having mandatory voting, a ranked voting system (ie. list the candidates from favorite to least favorite), and the abolition of the electoral college? Those are the qualities of true democracy. This would create a truly broad spectrum of political ideas that better reflect the wishes of the American people.

[Praxus]

Not agreeing with the Iraq war is not the same thing as being anti-American or not supporting the armed forces.

See I and many others believe the invasion of Iraq along with the Invasion of other countries is a nessecity to protect the rights of American Citizens. Since we hold this view we must believe that anyone not supporting these actions is supporting something contrary to the interist of American citizens and they are therefor anti-american.

[Confed999]

That website is just about the biggest load of bunk I have ever seen.

Seen the Move On site?

entails silencing any criticism for the war on Iraq or the "war on terror."

Or it could be about making their point too, isn't that allowed? Mike Moore can put documentry on his movies, and these guys can have a website. It doesn't matter if you're happy about either, it's about freedom of speach.

Those are the qualities of true democracy.

We don't have a democracy for a reason. The discrimination and class warfare is bad enough now, how could one expect to preserve any freedoms under a majority rules system? A true democracy is tyrany of the majority, and it's bad enough with a republic.

[barrowaj]

See I and many others believe the invasion of Iraq along with the Invasion of other countries is a nessecity to protect the rights of American Citizens. Since we hold this view we must believe that anyone not supporting these actions is supporting something contrary to the interist of American citizens and they are therefor anti-american.

Yes, I understand that many people have that point of view. However, that point of view is simplistic and has two main flaws:

1. You assume that the invasion is a necessity to protect the rights of Americans. This is a far-fetched opinion that doesn't take into consideration the views of all Americans (or even a large majority).

2. You say that NOT supporting the invasion is supporting something contrary to the interests of American citizens. That connection is a logical fallacy. Your views are not wholly representative of everything that is the interests of American citizens. Therefore you cannot make the argument that not supporting the war is the same as supporting something contrary to the interests of American citizens.

In other words, you are saying that anyone who doesn't support the war is anti-Praxus. That is fine if you want to define yourself and all of your views as revolving around the issue of the invasion of Iraq. However, I wouldn't call someone who did support the invasion of Iraq anti-barrowaj.

What you are calling for is a political policy called democratic centrism. It basically means that no matter what you may think, once the policy is decided, you can't outwardly dissent from the party line. It is a main tennent of an ideology called Lenninism.

[barrowaj]

Seen the Move On site?

Yeah, I don't live by that one either.

Or it could be about making their point too, isn't that allowed? Mike Moore can put documentry on his movies, and these guys can have a website. It doesn't matter if you're happy about either, it's about freedom of speach.

Right but these people are about using ad hominem arguments and trying to silence other people's views by attacking them, not presenting an argument justifying the Iraq war.

We don't have a democracy for a reason. The discrimination and class warfare is bad enough now, how could one expect to preserve any freedoms under a majority rules system? A true democracy is tyrany of the majority, and it's bad enough with a republic.

The Bill of Rights is the foundation of our personal freedoms. Having a true democracy would not change that. It would just better reflect the wants of the American people. I would say that tryanny of the majority beats the hell out of tyranny of the minority.

[Confed999]

See I and many others believe the invasion of Iraq along with the Invasion of other countries is a nessecity to protect the rights of American Citizens. Since we hold this view we must believe that anyone not supporting these actions is supporting something contrary to the interist of American citizens and they are therefor anti-american.

I saw it as necessary for humanity, to remove Saddam. So anyone against removing him would be for keeping him in power, thus pro-Saddam. Interesting how different points of view can mesh.

barrowaj, the point is "anti-American" is an opinion. I don't think the anti-war people are anti-American, I think they are pro-Saddam. But that's just an opinion too.

[Confed999]

Right but these people are about using ad hominem arguments and trying to silence other people's views by attacking them, not presenting an argument justifying the Iraq war.

People can't be silenced by a website. Prove their statements 100% wrong and they'll call them opinion, you cannot silence them, and in return they cannot silence you. Give and take.

The Bill of Rights is the foundation of our personal freedoms. Having a true democracy would not change that.

In a true democracy if 50% of the people plus one want to change your rights they may. It makes it disasterous to be a minority. It makes it unwise to live in a small town. Adding a constitution makes us a constitutional republic again, right?

[Confed999]

That website is just about the biggest load of bunk I have ever seen.

I just read the whole site and it looks to me as if they say alot about what was right about the Iraq invasion, what all has been accomplished and how many are better off. I see independant opinions that support their argument, but nowhere do I see them actively trying to take away your right to say what you want.