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View Full Version : Does Greec belong to E.U???



Alex82
28 Jul 04,, 20:45
Does the country that violate human rights belong to E.U or facts are that there is no human right, one country will be allowed to brake human right law another will not.

After almost 50 years Greek macedonians are not allowed not to return but to sell their property that thay have in Greek macedonia after they leave.

This two sites are about violations of human right in greec from 1912 to today.

http://www.macedoniainfo.com/Greek_Balkan_Histery.htm

http://www.macedoniainfo.com/macedonia/

Praxus
28 Jul 04,, 21:04
I don't get it, seems like a bunch of drival.

eMGee
29 Jul 04,, 11:25
Hmm, interesting site. I'll read it when I get home from work.

A lot of the modern Greeks are practically ethnic Turks, just like in Bulgaria. I believe that in Macedonia, although not much, the ancient Hellas has been preserved better.

Their EU membership is quite odd indeed, countries like the Czech Republic, Slovenia, Serbia (before the NATO bombings), Croatia etc. after the fall of communism/Eastbloc/"Iron Curton" were always better off, surely economically, than Greece was I think.

Though I personally can't complain much about them, since they nicely stay in their own country and have always returned, when they came here to work in the past.

Ray
29 Jul 04,, 11:43
If it pleases people, lets just call them the 'missing link' between civilisation and barbarians. ;)

Each nation has to do what is good for her interests. Therefore, one must look deeper into the compulsions and not apply the same parametres as one would for themselves. But then, I could be wrong!

ZFBoxcar
29 Jul 04,, 16:26
heir EU membership is quite odd indeed, countries like the Czech Republic, Slovenia, Serbia (before the NATO bombings), Croatia etc. after the fall of communism/Eastbloc/"Iron Curton" were always better off, surely economically , than Greece was I think.

Greece
GDP - real growth rate: 4% (2003 est.)
GDP - per capita: purchasing power parity - $19,900 (2003 est.)
Unemployment rate: 9.8% (2003 est.)

Czech Republic
GDP - real growth rate: 2.5% (2003 est.)
GDP - per capita: purchasing power parity - $15,700 (2003 est.)
Unemployment rate: 10.5% (2003 est.)

Croatia
GDP - real growth rate: 4.5% (2003 est.)
GDP - per capita: purchasing power parity - $10,700 (2003 est.)
Unemployment rate: 18.9% (2003 est.)

Slovenia
GDP - real growth rate: 2.5% (2003 est.)
GDP - per capita: purchasing power parity - $18,300 (2003 est.)
Unemployment rate: 11.2% (2003 est.)

Nope. Greece is doing better.

eMGee
29 Jul 04,, 20:00
I still see countries like the Czech Republic, Slovenia etc. as way more promising. Don't forget, while Greece has been getting (EU) subsidies and tourists these countries were suffering under communism!

Alex82
29 Jul 04,, 20:27
I still see countries like the Czech Republic, Slovenia etc. as way more promising. Don't forget, while Greece has been getting (EU) subsidies and tourists these countries were suffering under communism!

You are wrong , under comunists in former Yugoslavia you could earn as much money as you can, as much you work as much you earn, the only think was that we only have one party communist party that we could elect.
Ask any older custom worker that worked on the custom what was YUGOSLAVIAN RED PASSPORT, today parport of E.U is nothing to compared to that passport. In Tito time Yugoslavians, Serbs, Croats, Muslims and other pople in Former Yugoslavia could travel without VISA in most of the countries in the World. Than after Tito died in 1980 other politician started to destroy his work. in Tito time yougoslavia was one of politicaly strongest countries in the world, with good relation with west and east.

Comunism in other comunists country and communism in former Yuogoslavia are not even close to be compared.

Praxus
29 Jul 04,, 20:38
Tito was no hero, he was a mass murdering tyrant just like every other communist dicator in human history.


You are wrong , under comunists in former Yugoslavia you could earn as much money as you can, as much you work as much you earn, the only think was that we only have one party communist party that we could elect.

Work is only worth what people are willing to pay you for it. The Government has no right to dictate how much one earns by arbitrarily deciding who works harder.

Alex82
29 Jul 04,, 23:45
Tito was no hero, he was a mass murdering tyrant just like every other communist dicator in human history.



Work is only worth what people are willing to pay you for it. The Government has no right to dictate how much one earns by arbitrarily deciding who works harder.

Tell me what makes tito mass murderer??? When he murder someone?
The only mass murder that he commited was at the and of WW II when partisans executed 6000 balist (albanian terorists that cleaned Kosovo from all serbian civilains, woman and children), if that is war crime to shoot terorists. And he aloso shoot traidors.

Tell me if people lived good under the king, would they turned against the king???
Of coure not.

And if tito that executed some 7000 traidors, german cooperators, spyes and other WHAT IS THAN AMERICAN PRESIDENT DURING WHOSE MANDATE U.S ARMY let be precise TIGER PLATOON EXECUTED BY FIRE SQAD OR FROM POINT BLANK MORE THAN 10 000 civilains, inocent unarmed old people, woman and children.

Tito never in his life ORDER execution of the children and american army did.

So before you took tito in your mouth take and read the history, AND ASK YOUR SELF WHAT I AM WHAT WE DID, WHAT MY COUNTRY DID, and when you CLEAN YOU COUNTRY that is the bigest PROTECTOR OF WAR CRIMINALS, AND MASS MURDERERS THAN COME AND speak to me about my country.

Alex82
30 Jul 04,, 15:14
You clearly know nothing about Yugoslavia. My parents can know, they've been to Yugoslavia, and had friends there, during the Tito regime and Yugoslavia was a lot better off.

By the way, most people form Yugoslavia predicted wars and conflicts, when Tito died.


Totaly right!!! Before jumping to conclusion about Serbs, and Yugoslavia , Tito and Balcan you shoul take and read some book about Balcan History, History of Serbs, croats, Muslims BUT READ IT from the begining.

It is obvious that people are watching too much CNN.

Yiannis
10 Aug 04,, 01:01
"A lot of the modern Greeks are practically ethnic Turks, "

When Turks first arrived in the lands of the Byzantine empire they were very few in number, with historians estimating the Seljuk tribe at a few thousand. At the same time the population of Constantinople alone, was in excess of 300.000 making her the largest city in Christendom, if not the world.
However, as nomads the Turks were mobile and they were also skilled in warfare. Hence they managed to conquer ever increasing tracts of territory (esp. after Magikert 1071) in the process islamisizing the native Greeks even as they adopted elements of their culture.
Hence the exact opposite of what you posit is true.


"I believe that in Macedonia, although not much, the ancient Hellas has been preserved better."


As evidenced by :

the macedonians' bulgarian dialect and the cyrillic alphabet (formulated by Greek monks Cyril and Methodius to facilitate Slavic conversion to Christianity) they have been using to write it down since the 1940s (before they didn't have a written form of their dialect).

macedonians who watch (and understand) Bulgarian broadcasts on T.V. and read Bulgarian papers; the ones that can read anyway.

their customs (dances, celebrations) that have absolutely nothing to do with ours.

their slavic names and surnames.

the inumerable historical artifacts and inscriptions in cyrillic that speak of a bulgarian civilization in ancient Macedonia :tongue:

While I don't understand why they don't want to be identified as Slavs they are certainly welcome to become Greeks if they want to. All they have to do is learn our language, adopt our customs (they can keep their own as well- especially if they involve large gatherings and drinking/dancing). As they are already Orthodox Christians (Slavs having been prosyletized by the Greeks of Byzantium) they don't even have to convert! They still have to adopt the Greek rites though.
Untill that happens however, they are xeni and that is that as far as their hellenism is concerned.

"Their EU membership is quite odd indeed, countries like the Czech Republic, Slovenia, Serbia (before the NATO bombings), Croatia etc. after the fall of communism/Eastbloc/"Iron Curton" were always better off, surely economically, than Greece was I think."

You are welcome to come and see for yourself. A good time would be during the Olympics, which we are hosting.

"Though I personally can't complain much about them, since they nicely stay in their own country "

Its one of teh best countries in the world and has great people, why shouldn't we? :)

"and have always returned, when they came here to work in the past."

Psst, don't say that too loud or some of the 3 million Greeks now living in the U.S. might hear you. Check out our Olympic baseball team. They are all Greek U.S. citizens as baseball in Greece is virtually unknown.

Radamanthys
22 Aug 04,, 07:37
Does the country that violate human rights belong to E.U or facts are that there is no human right, one country will be allowed to brake human right law another will not.

After almost 50 years Greek macedonians are not allowed not to return but to sell their property that thay have in Greek macedonia after they leave.

This two sites are about violations of human right in greec from 1912 to today.

http://www.macedoniainfo.com/Greek_Balkan_Histery.htm

http://www.macedoniainfo.com/macedonia/


Biased sites, envy motives. I am Greek Macedonian. Vlach. FYROM has very good relations with Greece and FYROM's economy is based on Greek help. So, no need to for flamewars. Especially, when there is an issue about giving to local municipalities power... You got my drift

zimbrul
22 Aug 04,, 07:48
Biased sites, envy motives. I am Greek Macedonian. Vlach. FYROM has very good relations with Greece and FYROM's economy is based on Greek help. So, no need to for flamewars. Especially, when there is an issue about giving to local municipalities power... You got my drift


Could you explain the term "Vlach".What does it mean you are Vlach?I thought the vlachs use to live in what is now Transilvania , used to be Vlachia.

Radamanthys
22 Aug 04,, 09:58
Could you explain the term "Vlach".What does it mean you are Vlach?I thought the vlachs use to live in what is now Transilvania , used to be Vlachia.


There's an endless biography about the vlach issue. In Greece, Greek Vlachs speek the vlachian dialect as well, which composes part of ancient Greek, latin (ancient Roman latin) and Slavic words.

Transylvania was the most known Vlach area. In fact, there isnt an homogenous vlachian tribe. Lets say that Vlachs are the latin speaking people in every country. An idiom that is based more on language rather than ethnicity. Something like religion.

Static Caster
06 Sep 04,, 10:10
I really enjoyed reading non-Greeks & non-Macedonians post their uneducated opinions on the Greek\Macedonian matter. Yiannis, thank you for clarifying many FACTS about our nation.......

Also:

A lot of the modern Greeks are practically ethnic Turks


You obviously no nothing about history...thank you for the laughs :tongue:

Confed999
06 Sep 04,, 18:07
non-Greeks & non-Macedonians post their uneducated opinions
Kind of like your uneducated view of American "hee haws" and "rednecks"? I've only read 2 of your posts, out of 3, and you've managed to be insulting while not adding anything to the discussion in both.

cosmicway
15 Nov 04,, 10:19
Those sites mentioned in the beginning want to start the Balkan wars all over again !
Can we drop mutual hostility please ?