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View Full Version : Would a Seperate Quebec support Terrorism?



Canmoore
10 Aug 06,, 03:50
15,000 quebecers (http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://images.ctv.ca/archives/CTVNews/img2/20060806/160_montreal_protest_060806.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060806/montreal_protest_060806/20060806%3Fhub%3DCTVNewsAt11&h=120&w=160&sz=8&hl=en&start=2&tbnid=onRXbXhAD62D5M:&tbnh=69&tbnw=92&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dbloc%2Bquebecois%2Bhezbollah%26svnum% 3D10%26hl%3Den%26hs%3D1jK%26lr%3D%26client%3Dfiref ox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official_s%26sa%3DN) in Montreal protested Israeli agression against Hezbollah. They supported Hezbollah's rocket attacks into Israel.
In the crowd of protesters were both Lebanese flags, and flags of Hezbollah waving. And in the center of all this, leader of the Seperatist group Bloc Quebecois, Gilles Duceppe.

If Quebec ever seperated from Canada, would they become a harbour for terrorists? allowing them to set up camp, much like they did in Afghanistan to launch attacks accross the world?

Or would the Bloc allow terrorists to attack English Canada, to further the Seperatists desire to be independant? Quebec terrorism has happened in the past, remember the FLQ? and the October crises?

Does this concern you? especially if you live in Canada and or the United States?

gunnut
10 Aug 06,, 04:00
What I can't tell is these 15000 Quebecers, are they "real" Canadians as in mostly French speaking white Quebecers? Or are they Arab muslims that the mainstream media refer to as "Canadians" because they don't want to appear as "anti-muslim?"

As I recall, the terrorist cell busted up by the mounties a few weeks ago were all "Canadians" as reported by the MSM. However, if you look closely, they were all muslims.

Canmoore
10 Aug 06,, 04:26
well Quebec is the most pacifist province and anti-american province in Canada, so i would bet my left nut that it was a healthy mix of French-Canadians, and Muslum Canadians.

As for the busted wannabees. they were Canadian, in the sence that they were born here in Canada, the oldest, the ring leader, i believe was an immigrant, he preached Hate in a Mississauga mosque.

smilingassassin
10 Aug 06,, 08:51
As a Canadian I'm sickened at the thought of fellow Canadians supporting a known terrorist organization.

I wouldn't reguard them as Canadians personally and Gilles Duceppe should be shot, not only for his quest to distroy Canada but for the fact he supports an oragnization that wishes to distroy another democratic nation.

Canmoore
10 Aug 06,, 17:01
I live close to Ottawa, and consequently close to Quebec. There is a really good talk show based out of Ottawa, CFRA 580. If you can you should listen to the Lowell green show in the mornings. through the Internet.

The past few weeks, Lowell Green has been taking lots of callers who argue with him that Hezbollah is not a Terrorist organization!!! I am shocked at how many people argue that! Many people call in and call for the total annihilation of Israel, and some call in saying that the arab states should all be nuked then there wont be any more problems with Islamic terrorists...
Lots of Crazy people, but you get that on any talk show.

However, perhaps some of the must disturbing callers, are the Arabic-Canadian callers, who phone in and support Hezbollah, Lowell Green puts the question to them.
"If Canada was to go to war against Hezbollah, would you fight for Canada?" and the majority said "No"

Its sickening that these people come to our country, enjoy our prosperity, and freedoms, yet when it comes to defend that, they wont do it!

highsea
10 Aug 06,, 17:09
...Its sickening that these people come to our country, enjoy our prosperity, and freedoms, yet when it comes to defend that, they wont do it!That's because they are there to exploit Canada. Placing themselves in harms way is not part of their agenda.

Officer of Engineers
10 Aug 06,, 17:39
Its sickening that these people come to our country, enjoy our prosperity, and freedoms, yet when it comes to defend that, they wont do it!

Hehehehehahahahaha, counting the 2ndary reserves, you have less than 150,000 people out of a population of 30 million who's willing to defend Canada.

Canmoore
10 Aug 06,, 18:12
Hehehehehahahahaha, counting the 2ndary reserves, you have less than 150,000 people out of a population of 30 million who's willing to defend Canada.

Well i think that if it came to war, and Canada was under attack, then just like the previous wars, Canadians would flock to join the army.

[Edit]

Now i was doing a little number crunching....hey its raining out, nothing else to do on my day off...

And this is what i found. America has in its Army, Navy, Airforce, National Guard, Marine Core, and Coast guard, including all there reserves a total number of about 2.3million servicemen.

Canada according to Officer has 150,000 servicement, including reserves.

This is what i found.

America has a population of 300,000,000 with 2.3million of which are in the military, that means that 0.007% of americans are in the military to protect America/

Canada has a population of 30,000,000 with 150,000 of which are in the military, that means that 0.005% of canadians are in the military to protect Canada

So while you may say that Canada has a rediculoously small military, in comparison, it is only 0.002% smaller than America's when it comes to defending Canadians

gunnut
10 Aug 06,, 18:59
America has a population of 300,000,000 with 2.3million of which are in the military, that means that 0.007% of americans are in the military to protect America/

Canada has a population of 30,000,000 with 150,000 of which are in the military, that means that 0.005% of canadians are in the military to protect Canada

So while you may say that Canada has a rediculoously small military, in comparison, it is only 0.002% smaller than America's when it comes to defending Canadians

I think there's something wrong with your math.

2.3 mil/300 mil = 0.0077 = 0.77%

150k/30 mil = 0.005 = 0.5%

You got the proportions right, just missed it by 2 decimal points.

gunnut
10 Aug 06,, 19:00
As a Canadian I'm sickened at the thought of fellow Canadians supporting a known terrorist organization.

They ain't Canadians.

You might consider them Canadians. The law says they are Canadians. They don't consider themselves Canadians.

They consider themselves muslims first. That's the difference.

Officer of Engineers
10 Aug 06,, 19:31
That 2.3 mil is regforce figures. Our regforce figures is 60K

Canmoore
10 Aug 06,, 21:34
I think there's something wrong with your math.

2.3 mil/300 mil = 0.0077 = 0.77%

150k/30 mil = 0.005 = 0.5%

You got the proportions right, just missed it by 2 decimal points.

Math has never been my strongpoint :tongue:


That 2.3 mil is regforce figures. Our regforce figures is 60K

No the 2.3mill has reserves included, i could go back and write down all the figures here for you, but i really do not feel like doing it again.

cris29
10 Aug 06,, 22:21
Give Britain control over Canada again, we will sort them out (quebec).

imagine Britain vs france.
Canada would hav 2 support britain, what about the ppl in quebec. (civil unrest)

Canmoore
12 Aug 06,, 17:37
Give Britain control over Canada again, we will sort them out (quebec).

imagine Britain vs france.
Canada would hav 2 support britain, what about the ppl in quebec. (civil unrest)

The British Empire wasnt able to "sort" them out, after they defeated New France. So what makes you think that the Britain of today be able to sort them out? :tongue:

tphuang
12 Aug 06,, 22:52
i think the question should be whether or not Quebec would recognize Hezbollah as a terrorist state. Even Talibans don't support terrorism, they think they and the Al-Qaeda are freedom fighters.

cris29
13 Aug 06,, 03:33
"One mans terrorist is another man's freedom fighter"

I dont agree with that.

Officer of Engineers
13 Aug 06,, 04:01
Quebec is the reason why we're Canadians instead of being Americans. The French Canadians were the ones who fought off the Americans in both the American Revolution and the War of 1812.

Canmoore
13 Aug 06,, 06:45
Quebec is the reason why we're Canadians instead of being Americans. The French Canadians were the ones who fought off the Americans in both the American Revolution and the War of 1812.

If i remember corectly, it was English Canadian militia alongside Native Americans, and British who fought off the American's in Southern Ontario, after the Americans burned Fort York (toronto) and General Brock staged an amazing victory at Detroit, by making Natives run from bush to bush then back again going in a circle, in full view of the Americans, it gave the impression of a massive army, and the Americans retreated and gave up Detroit.

I believe that American attacks on Canada in the war of 1812 were concentrated on Upper Canada (ontario) rather than Lower Canada (quebec) It was this reasoning that The Capital was moved from Kingston to the lumber village of Bytown(Ottawa)way far back in the hinderland, which made it less vulnerable from American attack.

Sure Quebec is a huge part of Canada, but so is the rest of Canada. It wasnt the french nor the English who pushed forward into the great unknown and settled western Canada, that was done by Canada, and peoples from all over the globe who immigrated to Canada.

Officer of Engineers
13 Aug 06,, 07:10
Check out the Battles of Crysler's Farm and Chateauguay

tphuang
13 Aug 06,, 16:06
"One mans terrorist is another man's freedom fighter"

I dont agree with that.
No, I'm saying that the Terrorists don't look at themselves as terrorists. they think they are heroes.

You know, only a limited number of countries identify Hezbollah as a terrorist group.

cris29
13 Aug 06,, 17:41
I know you didnt say, the quote i said.
I was just saying thats how many people see it as.

BenRoethig
14 Aug 06,, 04:39
well Quebec is the most pacifist province and anti-american province in Canada, so i would bet my left nut that it was a healthy mix of French-Canadians, and Muslum Canadians.

As for the busted wannabees. they were Canadian, in the sence that they were born here in Canada, the oldest, the ring leader, i believe was an immigrant, he preached Hate in a Mississauga mosque.

They're French, what do you expect?

Canmoore
23 Aug 06,, 01:19
They're French, what do you expect?

Well its different. When you say "french" you mean somone from France.

Now Acadian, French Canadians, Quebecois, Quebecers... whatever have you, will tell you that they speak French. They are not "french". They will tell you that they are Acadian, French Canadian, Quebecois, Quebecers....

Now on that note, I have more than 60% french Canadian heritage. Not all French Canadians are like this, but there are alot, and they are usually the vocal ones who get noticed, subsequently, they are usually also Separatists.

mostlymad
27 Aug 06,, 20:34
15,000 quebecers (http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://images.ctv.ca/archives/CTVNews/img2/20060806/160_montreal_protest_060806.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060806/montreal_protest_060806/20060806%3Fhub%3DCTVNewsAt11&h=120&w=160&sz=8&hl=en&start=2&tbnid=onRXbXhAD62D5M:&tbnh=69&tbnw=92&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dbloc%2Bquebecois%2Bhezbollah%26svnum% 3D10%26hl%3Den%26hs%3D1jK%26lr%3D%26client%3Dfiref ox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official_s%26sa%3DN) in Montreal protested Israeli agression against Hezbollah. They supported Hezbollah's rocket attacks into Israel.
In the crowd of protesters were both Lebanese flags, and flags of Hezbollah waving. And in the center of all this, leader of the Seperatist group Bloc Quebecois, Gilles Duceppe.

From what I read, comments by Ducceppe, BLOB MPs, and NDP MPs, they don't support Hezbollah as terorists. They are opposed to what they see as excessive use of force by Israel. Did you know Kenny, a Conservative MP attended a Hezbollah rally recently? Bad judgement, but they all claim they were making a stand against Israel's actions. A Liberal MP resigned his psot as Foreign affairs critic because he had made statements that we should hold talks with the Hezbollah leading party as leaders, while not considering the terrorist side. Personally, I don't think the two can be separated.


If Quebec ever seperated from Canada, would they become a harbour for terrorists? allowing them to set up camp, much like they did in Afghanistan to launch attacks accross the world?

I don't think so. Quebec is out for Quebec. Harbouring terrorists would not be in their best interest. Quebecers don't like war, tend to avoid going to war, and harbouring international terrorists would put them in the heat.[/QUOTE]


Or would the Bloc allow terrorists to attack English Canada, to further the Seperatists desire to be independant? Quebec terrorism has happened in the past, remember the FLQ? and the October crises?
Seperatists have learned through the October crisis that terrorism doesn't work. There has been no indication since that event that they are considering that avenue.Those same FLQ terrorists are now business people, still talking separation, but using words only, comfortable in their middle class lives.


Does this concern you? especially if you live in Canada and or the United States?
doesn't concern me at all. The BLOC has made it very clear that any decisions they make, even in Parliament, are to secure independence for Quebec and implement favourable policies for Quebec. That concerns me more - that we have a federal party voting in the House of Commons on issues that affect all of Canada, but these votes are cast by MPs whose main goal is to better a single province and divide the country politically.

Canmoore
27 Aug 06,, 23:48
From what I read, comments by Ducceppe, BLOB MPs, and NDP MPs, they don't support Hezbollah as terorists. They are opposed to what they see as excessive use of force by Israel. Did you know Kenny, a Conservative MP attended a Hezbollah rally recently? Bad judgement, but they all claim they were making a stand against Israel's actions. A Liberal MP resigned his psot as Foreign affairs critic because he had made statements that we should hold talks with the Hezbollah leading party as leaders, while not considering the terrorist side. Personally, I don't think the two can be separated.

When the leader of the Bloc attends a rally with Hezbollah flags flying. I think that its safe to say that Ducceppe supports Hezbollah. Hezbollah is a terrorist organization, and Canada is currently in a war against terrorism.

So why is the Leader of a major political party attending a rally where the flags of the enemy are flying?

It sends me a clear message, that Ducceppe does not consider Hezbollah a terrorist group. And would support them, and perhaps allow them refuge in Quebec if Quebec ever seperates.

mostlymad
28 Aug 06,, 01:50
When the leader of the Bloc attends a rally with Hezbollah flags flying. I think that its safe to say that Ducceppe supports Hezbollah. Hezbollah is a terrorist organization, and Canada is currently in a war against terrorism.

So why is the Leader of a major political party attending a rally where the flags of the enemy are flying?

It sends me a clear message, that Ducceppe does not consider Hezbollah a terrorist group. And would support them, and perhaps allow them refuge in Quebec if Quebec ever seperates.

I notice you are Conservative. Why did MP Kenney attend a Hezbollah rally? He must also be sending a clear message that he does not consider Hezbollah a terrorist group, based on your statement, and that he would prhaps allow them refuge in Canada.

As I said, people like that use very bad judgement by using such rallies to protest Israel's attacks on Lebannon. Both Ducceppe and Kenney have said that's why they attended. I don't believe either of those men support terrorists. I have never heard them make statements to that effect, or indicate such. Look up what they said to the press. Do I think either Ducceppe (BLOC) or Kenney (CPC) should have attended Hezbollah rallies? No. If they wanted to protest Israel's actions, they should have attended some of the peace rallies we've had lateley in Canada instead.

You refer to "the flags of the enemy." Canada does not consider the Lebanese gov. to be the enemy. I*srael's enemy, perhaps, but not ours. Harper's gov. claims we are neutral on this issue.

Canmoore
28 Aug 06,, 02:22
I notice you are Conservative. Why did MP Kenney attend a Hezbollah rally? He must also be sending a clear message that he does not consider Hezbollah a terrorist group, based on your statement, and that he would prhaps allow them refuge in Canada.

I do not agree with the actions of MP Kenney, however, Kenney is not the leader of a Political party now is he? Nor does he wish to seperate from Canada and create a new country, complete with its own foreign and immigration policies now does he?




You refer to "the flags of the enemy." Canada does not consider the Lebanese gov. to be the enemy. I*srael's enemy, perhaps, but not ours. Harper's gov. claims we are neutral on this issue.

I am not talking about the Lebanese government, dont try and twist my words. I clearly said that the flags of Hezbollah were present at that rally...the flags of a terrrorist organization. And we are at war with terrorism.

MetM
28 Aug 06,, 03:38
[QUOTE=Canmoore]When the leader of the Bloc attends a rally with Hezbollah flags flying. I think that its safe to say that Ducceppe supports Hezbollah. Hezbollah is a terrorist organization, and Canada is currently in a war against terrorism.

So why is the Leader of a major political party attending a rally where the flags of the enemy are flying?


Duceppe dosent support Hezbollah, he made a speach that day speaking bad against Hezbollah and got ''booed''... He was just there to support peace. I am sure he wouldnt do the same thing knowing many Hezbollah fanatics will go there with flags.

Also, french is an official language in Lebanon that's why Québec is so full of them. I honestly think 80% of them were not ''natives''. But its also true we have many (mainly) separatists who have nothing to do but complain about Harper/Charest and the Americans. I noticed most of them dont speak english and are ignorants on many topics... they would be separatists at all cost.

But french Canadians living in Québec are NOT all the same, I hate to be categorized, lot of people in english Canada dont understand much also about what happen here and just ''decipher'' the wrong 50% of french they read or hear and make their own story like that ''Quebecistan'' stupidity in the newspaper..........

Canmoore
28 Aug 06,, 05:25
Duceppe dosent support Hezbollah, he made a speach that day speaking bad against Hezbollah and got ''booed''... He was just there to support peace. I am sure he wouldnt do the same thing knowing many Hezbollah fanatics will go there with flags.

Also, french is an official language in Lebanon that's why Québec is so full of them. I honestly think 80% of them were not ''natives''. But its also true we have many (mainly) separatists who have nothing to do but complain about Harper/Charest and the Americans. I noticed most of them dont speak english and are ignorants on many topics... they would be separatists at all cost.

But french Canadians living in Québec are NOT all the same, I hate to be categorized, lot of people in english Canada dont understand much also about what happen here and just ''decipher'' the wrong 50% of french they read or hear and make their own story like that ''Quebecistan'' stupidity in the newspaper

Well i think its funny Ducceppe blasted Harper, saying that it was nothing but a publicity stunt. Talking about how harper took his jet, kicked off all of the reporters, and picked up stranded Canadians in Cyprus and took them back to Canada.

Then Ducceppe does this rally...sounds like the pot is calling the kettle black here on this one.

And yes i know that there are alot of french people in Lebanon, it was once a French colony. But Ducceppe should have left immediately once he saw the flags of Hezbollah were present, and condem them harshly. But instead he just played along with it..hey i guess when your a separatist a vote is a vote right? even if its coming from a terrorist sympathizer...now that is what really scares me about that man.

mostlymad
28 Aug 06,, 12:30
[QUOTE=Canmoore]But french Canadians living in Québec are NOT all the same, I hate to be categorized, lot of people in english Canada dont understand much also about what happen here and just ''decipher'' the wrong 50% of french they read or hear and make their own story like that ''Quebecistan'' stupidity in the newspaper..........

Some of us outside of Quebec take the time to read what words are coming from who, and understand the loudest voices don't necessarily represent the majority. I work in Ottawa, MetM, where I'm sure you know a lot of people from Quebec work as well, and I agree with you on the above. So do you think QC would support terrorists? Personally, I can't see why that province or the majority of people living there would.