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Custody issues in the US

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  • Custody issues in the US

    Ok there's this Muslim woman I know who is fighting a custody battle in NJ. Her case is weird and she claims to being strong armed in taking her 9 year old daughter away from her.

    Ok this is how the story goes.

    The woman and her husband had a divorce, she got custody. She had her for a while before falling sick and the kid was being taken care by the woman's brother and his wife. Over the period of her stay at her uncles, the uncle's wife, slapped her and the kid called 911 and the social workers took her away.

    The father didn't care long before and had taken off anyway.

    Now the kid has been given into a Christian family and the mother's protesting that she wants her back. The Christian family has also made it clear that they will raise her up as a Christian.

    Now the obvious argument against her is going to be that she gave her child away to someone who hurt the girl and thus when they take the kid away from the uncle, the kid is basically taken away from the mother too.

    I've been asked to help out from a Muslim activist who is mediating in between, in somehow bringing the media in light with this "injustice". So far I've just asked for more information since I know religious appeals aren't going to fly in a US court.

    I've also asked about what sort of person the mother is and that whether or not if she is still sick. I know for a fact if there's the slightest bit wrong found with the mother's case the media won't really support her. It's best not seen as a "Muslim cause".

    Her second argument that brings in this "Muslim cause" issue is that, if you MUST take her away from her or her relatives then send her to a Muslim home. I believe people here once told me the parent does get rights for religious indoctrination of their children in the US.

    So what do you think guys? Will her argument fly?

    The woman claims to have never formally given away custody.

  • #2
    There's more to this than what's stated. On the surface, it seems unfair but such extremes only happens if the mother is declared unfit. Was she?

    Comment


    • #3
      When you say unfit you mean medically or due to some social problems the mother might have?

      Assuming she's of a generally good character, can medical problems be a cause for social services to take the kid away and themselves decide who she gets to stay with?

      I think the glitch showed up when the kid was at her uncles and was taken away from there. After obvious abuse.

      But there probably is a lot more to this. Especially the other side of the story.

      Comment


      • #4
        Most obvious thing is child neglect/abuse but such declarations must be done through a court. In most cases, when a mother is declared unfit, she lost all say in the child's upbringing ... until she is declared fit again.

        Comment


        • #5
          If a parent leaves a child with someone that harms the child that parent can be deemed unfit. Like the Col. said, I think there is a lot more to it than all that has been told.

          The mother would not have had to have given up custody to have given up rights to that child. She only would have had to have acted in a manner that showed that she was not going to, not able to, or refused to care for the child to the best that she can. But this mother would have had to had really done something bad.

          Here is an example I have: My daughters father moved out of state and is not able to help with taking care of our daughter, even though we currently "share" (and I use that term lightly) custody. Even though he decided on his own to move 4 states away, I also cannot automatically get full custody of our daughter even though I am the only one taking part in her day to day care.

          Where I am going with this is that a parent has to really screw up in order for the state to come in and take a child away. IL and NJ have different laws, I am sure, as ILs DCFS (Dept of Children and Family Services) has come under fire in the last few years for allowing children to stay with their parents and the children then ending up hurt badly or worse, days or months later.

          In any case, it is almost always going to be preferred that a child stay with a biological parent or family member if it is possible. If the mother loses rights to the child, the family that does get that kid, can raise that kid in whatever religion they see fit. The child then becomes "theirs".
          Last edited by THL; 12 Jun 06,, 17:39.
          "To dream of the person you would like to be is to waste the person you are."-Sholem Asch

          "I always turn to the sports page first, which records people's accomplishments. The front page has nothing but man's failures."-Earl Warren

          "I didn't intend for this to take on a political tone. I'm just here for the drugs."-Nancy Reagan, when asked a political question at a "Just Say No" rally

          "He no play-a da game, he no make-a da rules."-Earl Butz, on the Pope's attitude toward birth control

          Comment


          • #6
            The reason they're asking for a media intervention is suggestive that technically the law states otherwise. I was vary of this since I don't want to end up hurting the mother further since if they don't handle this issue properly it will turn into a Muslim vs Christian issue and u know which way the public opinion is going to go on that one.

            Comment


            • #7
              You need the full facts. As of right now, I don't even know if the mother is declared unfit. That is a very, very bad start.

              Has she given you access to the judgement? All the court papers? You need a solid understanding to what actually went on before you take this on.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Asim Aquil
                since if they don't handle this issue properly it will turn into a Muslim vs Christian issue and u know which way the public opinion is going to go on that one.
                Regardless of what religions are being debated, the public is going to care more about the child's well-being and fitness of the person(s) that end up with custody.
                “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by TopHatter
                  Regardless of what religions are being debated, the public is going to care more about the child's well-being and fitness of the person(s) that end up with custody.
                  I dont know that I agree with that.

                  In any case, it should not matter what the public wants or thinks, it is the judge that matters.

                  Originally posted by Asim
                  The reason they're asking for a media intervention is suggestive that technically the law states otherwise. I was vary of this since I don't want to end up hurting the mother further since if they don't handle this issue properly it will turn into a Muslim vs Christian issue and u know which way the public opinion is going to go on that one.
                  You had mentioned earlier that the family of the child wanted the child to be brought up Muslim and not live with that Christian family...my thoughts on this are that if them family, including the mother, were all that concerned about it, then they should have made sure they took care of the child to begin with so that the child was not taken away.

                  It is more important to get this child into a steady home life than to worry about if the child will be brought up Muslim, Christian or other.
                  Last edited by THL; 12 Jun 06,, 22:35.
                  "To dream of the person you would like to be is to waste the person you are."-Sholem Asch

                  "I always turn to the sports page first, which records people's accomplishments. The front page has nothing but man's failures."-Earl Warren

                  "I didn't intend for this to take on a political tone. I'm just here for the drugs."-Nancy Reagan, when asked a political question at a "Just Say No" rally

                  "He no play-a da game, he no make-a da rules."-Earl Butz, on the Pope's attitude toward birth control

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    And most especially the family court (if it is ANYTHING like the one here) will not take into account either the parents religion or any publicity surrounding the case). There must be more to this story for the current caregivers to have any possibility of keeping guardianship of the child.
                    In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.

                    Leibniz

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by TopHatsLiberal
                      It is more important to get this child into a steady home life than to worry about if the child will be brought up Muslim, Christian or other.
                      That's what I was thinking in the first place, but I was projecting my thoughts onto others
                      “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                      Comment

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