Closed Thread
Page 9 of 14 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 LastLast
Results 121 to 135 of 197

Thread: God Damn America, U.S. to Blame for 9/11: Obama's Pastor

  1. #121
    Global Moderator Defense Professional JAD_333's Avatar
    Join Date
    15 Apr 07
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    7,365
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by dalem View Post
    It was a general comment directed against those who use the past to try and keep racism alive in the present.
    Rather than dismantle your arguments, which intention I said in jest, I would like to drill down into a point where I think we might agree, that what many blacks like Rev. Wright condemn in comments made by whites
    they condone in their own.

    A recent example is the case of radio commentator, Don Immus, who casually called a basketball team largely made up of blacks women using the ubonics term for whores. The reaction from blacks was quick and loud, so much so
    that Immus was tossed off the air for a while. A few years back, a white sports commentator was likewise fired for commenting on the physical limitation of blacks in swimming competition. And there have been many other similar cases.

    Now we come to Reverend Wright, who has been outed for doing the same thing, only he is black, but the hue and cry over his statements has been more to judge Obama, a member of his flock, than to demand his church sideline him like Immus was. (I know he's retired, but he remains a figurehead of the church.)

    I don't care if Wright is fired, but I do believe that, like Immus, who apologized to blacks, he should apologize to whites, and to his congregation as well. And the reason I think that an apology is called for is because his statements are an insult to the white majority who, since WWII, have labored hard and at considerable risk to themselves from a bigotted minority to rid America of racial discrimination. Did he forget the white students murdered by white racists in Mississippi for helping register black voters?

    Segregation is an ugly, dehumanizing things. Older blacks remember it. Here's a small example I witnessed. I was a kid during the tail-end of segregation, the late 1940's and early 1950's. That's when blacks were routinely denied public accommodations and 'whites only' restrooms and do forth were common. It existed north and south.

    This example was in the north. My mother employed a black housekeeper, a fine, intelligent woman who went on to become a registered nurse and homeowner. Her name was Veronica. One summer when I was 12 and ending a vacation in Delaware, my mother called from Washington, where home was, and told her to bring me home by bus. So, Veronica and I in tow went down to the local Greyhound bus depot and bought tickets, and as there was some time before the bus left, she took me into a lunchcounter in the depot to get an ice cream cone. Immediately, a waitress called to her, "I'm sorry, but you can't come in here." Why not? The waitress pointed to the Whites Only sign on the door. "But all we want is ice cream," Veronica said. "He can stay, but you'll have to get yours from the take-out window outside." If looks could kill, that waitress would have had a funeral the next day. So, we marched off to sit in the waiting area. Now comes a bus depot employee and says to Veronica, "you can't wait in here; you'll have to wait outside." With perfect dignity, Veronica took me by the hand and we went outside to wait. That was in 1952.

    Last year, 55 years later, my wife and a close friend, who is black, went to a restaurant near Winchester, VA. While waiting to be seated, a waitress came up to them and said no tables were available. Fair enough. Maybe?Suspecting it was more than that, they hung around the parking lot for a few minutes. Sure enough a white couple who came after them was seated right away. This kind of discrimination is becoming rarer, and when it does happen, it is very subtle.

    Coming back to Rev Wright, perhaps his anger reflects his experiences both then and now. But his statements, whether true or not, have a tendency to ignor all the progress that has been made in tearing down racial barriers in the last 50-60 years, and it ignors the simple fact that, had without the complicity of white majority in removing those barriers, they would still be in place and Rev. Wright would have been in far more hot water for his statements than he is now. If he wants to condemn what remains of racial discrimination, fine. But he ought to speak out that blanket condemnation of whites is based on a lie.

    Wonder if he'll apologize.
    Last edited by JAD_333; 22 Mar 08, at 21:18.
    To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

  2. #122
    Regular ofelas's Avatar
    Join Date
    19 Mar 08
    Location
    US & Canada
    Posts
    52
    Country: United States
    Last year, 55 years later, my wife and a close friend, who is black, went to a restaurant near Winchester, VA. While waiting to be seated, a waitress came up to them and said no tables were available. Fair enough. Maybe?Suspecting it was more than that, they hung around the parking lot for a few minutes. Sure enough a white couple who came after them was seated right away. This kind of discrimination is becoming rarer, and when it does happen, it is very subtle.
    Hi, I would have asked the waitress or her manager whether the white couple had a reservation made earlier, so I could clarify what went on before deciding it was race-biased favor"?

  3. #123
    Official Thread Jacker Senior Contributor gunnut's Avatar
    Join Date
    27 Jan 06
    Location
    DPRK, Demokratik People's Republik of Kalifornia
    Posts
    21,348
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by tphuang View Post
    My point is very clear. Once they get into the company in North America, the Asian workers simply don't get promoted at the same rate.
    Well, maybe all these talented and qualified Asians should stick together and start their own companies so they can hire whoever they want.

    I'm the first to tell you that I'm not qualified to be a manager. Don't want it. Don't care for it.
    "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

  4. #124
    Global Moderator Defense Professional JAD_333's Avatar
    Join Date
    15 Apr 07
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    7,365
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by ofelas View Post
    Hi, I would have asked the waitress or her manager whether the white couple had a reservation made earlier, so I could clarify what went on before deciding it was race-biased favor"?
    Quite right; that's the first question I asked my wife. But it turns out, it wasn't one of those places that takes reservations; it was a road house.

    You have, however, touched on another problem, the perception that one has been discriminated against when one hasn't. When a white cashier is rude to a white customer, the latter wonders what is bothering the cashier. If the customer is black, the cashier's mood isn't likely to be a consideration; the rudeness likely will be taken as racist.

    Once my wife was out with her black friend and her friend's sister. They went into a bar. The owner calls out, "look what just walked in; an Oreo cookie." I don't need to explain to you what that means, do I? My wife thought it was funny, but her friend didn't.
    To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

  5. #125
    Regular ofelas's Avatar
    Join Date
    19 Mar 08
    Location
    US & Canada
    Posts
    52
    Country: United States
    You have, however, touched on another problem, the perception that one has been discriminated against when one hasn't.
    Yup, an equally unsavory reaction...on that note, here's what Obama's 'new' pastor has to say about Wright -

    New Obama Pastor: Wright was 'Lynched' -The new pastor at Barack Obama’s church used his first Easter sermon on Sunday to compare controversial Rev. Jeremiah Wright Jr. to Jesus’ death at the hands of the Romans.

    Sunday’s sunrise sermon, delivered by Rev. Otis Moss III, was called “How to Handle a Public Lynching” and focused primarily on the media firestorm that has focused international attention on this Chicago ministry, which is the church attended by the Democratic presidential candidate.

    Moss did not directly mention his spiritual mentor by name, but implied to the congregation at Trinity United Church of Christ that Wright, who has delivered sermons in which he likened the U.S. to the Ku Klux Klan and said it is damned for its state-sponsored terrorism, is facing the same challenges Jesus did.

    “No one should start a ministry with lynching, no one should end their ministry with lynching. The lynching was national news. The RNN, the Roman News Network, was reporting it and NPR, National Publican Radio had it on the radio. The Jerusalem Post and the Palestine Times all wanted exclusives, they searched out the young ministers, showed up unannounced at their houses, tried to talk with their families, called up their friends, wanted to get a quote on how do you feel about the lynching?” he said.

    The Sunday services made clear that the criticism surrounding Wright has not softened the church’s sermons, and that the controversy has in a way served as a rallying cry for this 8,000-member congregation.

    “If I was Ice Cube I’d say it a little differently — You picked the wrong folk to mess with,” Moss said to an enthusiastic congregation, standing up during much of the sermon.

    The Wright controversy seemed an unspoken thread to Sunday’s services, as the pastors repeatedly alluded to the matter without calling out Wright by name. And they defiantly defended their method of worship.

    Bishop Vashti Murphy McKenzie in her sermon talked about visionaries like “King” and “Gandhi” and “Jeremiah” (it was unclear whether she meant Wright), and argued that their words weren’t about “anger,” but about “a passion that demands confrontation.”

    “The purveyors of information are trying to be judge and jury over prophetic utterances,” she said.

    Moss issued several pleas to congregants to donate to what he called the “Resurrection Fund,” stressing that during this time of battle, money is needed to defend the church. He offered no additional specifics about the fund, telling churchgoers he didn’t want to get into it because Trinity is streaming the service live on the Web and the services are available for purchase on DVD.

    He concluded with another analogy, saying, “In order to crucify him you’ve got to lift him up … he had more visibility on the cross than he did during his entire ministry.”

    Church officials said Wright, who is now on sabbatical and weeks away from retirement after nearly 40 years of service with the church, was not attending any service Sunday. Obama and his family were spending Easter on vacation and also were not attending services.

  6. #126
    Global Moderator Defense Professional JAD_333's Avatar
    Join Date
    15 Apr 07
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    7,365
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by ofelas View Post
    Yup, an equally unsavory reaction...on that note, here's what Obama's 'new' pastor has to say about Wright -
    Moss' comparison of Wright to Jesus depends on a narrow point and fails; afterall, we all can find parallels in our lives to the life of Jesus. If one of the apostles were alive to comment, he might well say, "I knew Jesus; you, sir, are no Jesus." Moss missed a chance to defend Wright and, at the same time, reach out with a message of reconciliation to all Americans. A seige mentality exercises a powerful grip. Happy Easter....
    To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

  7. #127
    Military Professional
    Join Date
    15 Sep 06
    Posts
    6,755
    Quote Originally Posted by JAD_333 View Post
    Moss' comparison of Wright to Jesus depends on a narrow point and fails; afterall, we all can find parallels in our lives to the life of Jesus. If one of the apostles were alive to comment, he might well say, "I knew Jesus; you, sir, are no Jesus." Moss missed a chance to defend Wright and, at the same time, reach out with a message of reconciliation to all Americans. A seige mentality exercises a powerful grip. Happy Easter....
    Siege mentality indeed! (Added to which is an opportunity to make money for the 'resurrection fund') They are all as mad as a box of frogs. (Who are 'they'? The nitwits that buy recordings of his sermons of course)
    Semper in excretum. Solum profunda variat.

  8. #128
    Lord High Hullabalooster Senior Contributor dalem's Avatar
    Join Date
    24 Nov 04
    Location
    Columbia Heights, MN
    Posts
    11,793
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by JAD_333 View Post
    Rather than dismantle your arguments, which intention I said in jest, I would like to drill down into a point where I think we might agree, that what many blacks like Rev. Wright condemn in comments made by whites
    they condone in their own.

    -snip-

    Wonder if he'll apologize.
    I really don't know. To me it's not about the race thing at all because I'd be seeing the same problem no matter what color any of the participants were. Wright really does seem to have a bit of that Hannity bread & butter, i.e. "hate" for America. Given their confirmed relationship Obama must have some of that too. That's bad to me.

    -dale

  9. #129
    Global Moderator Defense Professional JAD_333's Avatar
    Join Date
    15 Apr 07
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    7,365
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by glyn View Post
    Siege mentality indeed! (Added to which is an opportunity to make money for the 'resurrection fund') They are all as mad as a box of frogs. (Who are 'they'? The nitwits that buy recordings of his sermons of course)
    Cynical, but possibly the case. What does an organization built up to resist a perceived injustice do, when the injustice no longer exists? Prolong it, I suppose. Perhaps if we had rected with a collective yawn to the comments of Rev. Wright, church leaders would have been denied this golden opportunity to strenghten their cause.
    To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

  10. #130
    Global Moderator Defense Professional JAD_333's Avatar
    Join Date
    15 Apr 07
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    7,365
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by dalem View Post
    Wright really does seem to have a bit of that Hannity bread & butter, i.e. "hate" for America.
    Glyn's point. It seems the uproar over his sermons is being turned into a positive from a marketing POV.

    Given their confirmed relationship Obama must have some of that too. That's bad to me.
    I don't think we can be absolutely sure of that. A relationship doesn't exactly prove Obama agrees with Wright. Of course, just the possibility might be enough for people to risk erring on the side of caution.
    To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

  11. #131
    Senior Contributor bonehead's Avatar
    Join Date
    12 Jan 05
    Posts
    4,067
    Quote Originally Posted by JAD_333 View Post
    Glyn's point. It seems the uproar over his sermons is being turned into a positive from a marketing POV.



    I don't think we can be absolutely sure of that. A relationship doesn't exactly prove Obama agrees with Wright. Of course, just the possibility might be enough for people to risk erring on the side of caution.
    But on the other hand, if what the preacher said was offensive to Obama, Obama could have found another church. I would not let anyone I felt was "off their rocker" to baptize any of my children let alone allow my family to be exposed to such tripe, especially at a church setting. Obama had to at least partially agreed to what was being preached at church, or he would have either raised a stink within the church or left the church a long time ago.

  12. #132
    Lord High Hullabalooster Senior Contributor dalem's Avatar
    Join Date
    24 Nov 04
    Location
    Columbia Heights, MN
    Posts
    11,793
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by JAD_333 View Post
    Glyn's point. It seems the uproar over his sermons is being turned into a positive from a marketing POV.



    I don't think we can be absolutely sure of that. A relationship doesn't exactly prove Obama agrees with Wright. Of course, just the possibility might be enough for people to risk erring on the side of caution.
    I think that long and deep a relationship does prove that Obama is, at the least, not repelled by the ideas that Wright holds.

    -dale

  13. #133
    WAB Bartender Defense Professional
    Military Professional
    Bluesman's Avatar
    Join Date
    24 Nov 04
    Location
    Nellis AFB, Las Vegas, NV
    Posts
    8,518
    Country: United States
    DAYUM - an absolutely BLISTERING shot from Steyn:

    Mark Steyn: So much for the 'post-racial' candidate
    MARK STEYN
    Syndicated columnist

    "I'm sure," said Barack Obama in that sonorous baritone that makes his drive-thru order for a Big Mac, fries and strawberry shake sound profound, "many of you have heard remarks from your pastors, priests or rabbis with which you strongly disagreed."

    Well, yes. But not many of us have heard remarks from our pastors, priests or rabbis that are stark, staring, out-of-his-tree, flown-the-coop nuts. Unlike Bill Clinton, whose legions of "spiritual advisers" at the height of his Monica troubles outnumbered the U.S. diplomatic corps, Sen. Obama has had just one spiritual adviser his entire adult life: the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, two-decade pastor to the president presumptive. The Rev. Wright believes that AIDS was created by the government of the United States – and not as a cure for the common cold that went tragically awry and had to be covered up by Karl Rove, but for the explicit purpose of killing millions of its own citizens. The government has never come clean about this, but the Rev. Wright knows the truth. "The government lied," he told his flock, "about inventing the HIV virus as a means of genocide against people of color. The government lied."

    Does he really believe this? If so, he's crazy, and no sane person would sit through his gibberish, certainly not for 20 years.

    Or is he just saying it? In which case, he's profoundly wicked. If you understand that AIDS is spread by sexual promiscuity and drug use, you'll know that it's within your power to protect yourself from the disease. If you're told that it's just whitey's latest cunning plot to stick it to you, well, hey, it's out of your hands, nothing to do with you or your behavior.

    Before the speech, Slate's Mickey Kaus advised Sen. Obama to give us a Sister Souljah moment: "There are plenty of potential Souljahs still around: Race preferences. Out-of-wedlock births," he wrote. "But most of all the victim mentality that tells African Americans (in the fashion of the Rev. Wright's most infamous sermons) that the important forces shaping their lives are the evil actions of others, of other races." Indeed. It makes no difference to white folks when a black pastor inflicts kook genocide theories on his congregation: The victims are those in his audience who make the mistake of believing him.

    The Rev. Wright has a hugely popular church with over 8,000 members, and Sen. Obama assures us that his pastor does good work by "reaching out to those suffering from HIV/AIDS." But maybe he wouldn't have to quite so much "reaching out" to do and maybe there wouldn't be quite so many black Americans "suffering from HIV/AIDS" if the likes of Wright weren't peddling lunatic conspiracy theories to his own community.

    Nonetheless, last week, Barack Obama told America: "I can no more disown him than I can disown the black community."

    What is the plain meaning of that sentence? That the paranoid racist ravings of Jeremiah Wright are now part of the established cultural discourse in African American life and thus must command our respect? Let us take the senator at his word when he says he chanced not to be present on AIDS Conspiracy Sunday, or God Damn America Sunday, or US of KKKA Sunday, or the Post-9/11 America-Had-It-Coming Memorial Service. A conventional pol would have said he was shocked, shocked to discover Afrocentric black liberation theology going on at his church. But Obama did something far more audacious: Instead of distancing himself from his pastor, he attempted to close the gap between Wright and the rest of the country, arguing, in effect, that the guy is not just his crazy uncle but America's, too.

    To do this, Obama promoted a false equivalence. "I can no more disown him than I can my white grandmother," he continued. "A woman who helped raise me, a woman who sacrificed again and again for me, a woman who loves me as much as she loves anything in this world, but a woman who once confessed her fear of black men who passed by her on the street." Well, according to the way he tells it in his book, it was one specific black man on her bus, and he wasn't merely "passing by."


    When the British Prime Minister Harold Macmillan dumped some of his closest Cabinet colleagues to extricate himself from a political crisis, the Liberal leader Jeremy Thorpe responded: "Greater love hath no man than to lay down his friends for his life." In Philadelphia, Sen. Obama topped that: Greater love hath no man than to lay down his grandma for his life.


    In the days that followed, Obama's interviewers seemed grateful for the introduction of a less-complicated villain: Unlike the Rev. Wright, she doesn't want God to damn America for being no better than al-Qaida, but on the other hand she did once express her apprehension about a black man on the bus. It's surely only a matter of days before Keith Olbermann on MSNBC names her his "Worst Person In The World". Asked about the sin of racism beating within Grandma's breast, Obama said on TV that "she's a typical white person."

    Which doesn't sound like the sort of thing the supposed "post-racial" candidate ought to be saying, but let that pass. How "typically white" is Obama's grandmother? She is the woman who raised him – that's to say, she brought up a black grandchild and loved him unconditionally. Burning deep down inside, she may nurse a secret desire to be Simon Legree or Bull Connor, but it doesn't seem very likely. She does then, in her own flawed way, represent a post-racial America.


    But what of her equivalent (as Obama's speech had it)? Is Jeremiah Wright a "typical black person"? One would hope not. A century and a half after the Civil War, two generations after the Civil Rights Act, the Rev. Wright promotes victimization theses more insane than anything promulgated at the height of slavery or the Jim Crow era. You can understand why Obama is so anxious to meet with President Ahmadinejad, a man who denies the last Holocaust even as he plans the next one. Such a summit would be easy listening after the more robust sermons of Jeremiah Wright.

    But America is not Ahmadinejad's Iran. Free societies live in truth, not in the fever swamps of Jeremiah Wright. The pastor is a fraud, a crock, a mountebank – for, if this truly were a country whose government invented a virus to kill black people, why would they leave him walking around to expose the truth? It is Barack Obama's choice to entrust his daughters to the spiritual care of such a man for their entire lives, but in Philadelphia the senator attempted to universalize his peculiar judgment – to claim that, given America's history, it would be unreasonable to expect black men of Jeremiah Wright's generation not to peddle hateful and damaging lunacies. Isn't that – what's the word? – racist? So much for the post-racial candidate.

    © MARK STEYN
    I sure hope everybody on the WAB reads this, because I don't think it can be argued against. If you can read this and NOT be convinced that Obama is the single worst candidate for President that ran this year, then there's something wrong with your comprehension of this scandal.

    And a scandal it is, too. There's no explaining it away now: Obama owns this like like Hillary owns all of HER scandals. The difference is, at least she's

    Wait - there is NO difference. Both of the Democrats are fundamentally dishonest and dishonorable people, seeking power and willing to do anything they need to do in the pursuit of high office. If we are not too far gone into a culture that emphasizes name recognition over national service, then neither one will have a decent shot at beating McCain. Because having either such low and venal people with a credible run at it is bad enough; either one will actually have MILLIONS of Americans vote for them, and I find that to be absolutely tragic, even if - fate willing - they lose.
    "The quickest way of ending a war is to lose it, and if one finds the prospect of a long war intolerable, it is natural to disbelieve in the possibility of victory."
    - George Orwell

  14. #134
    Global Moderator Defense Professional JAD_333's Avatar
    Join Date
    15 Apr 07
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    7,365
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by bonehead View Post
    But on the other hand, if what the preacher said was offensive to Obama, Obama could have found another church. I would not let anyone I felt was "off their rocker" to baptize any of my children let alone allow my family to be exposed to such tripe, especially at a church setting. Obama had to at least partially agreed to what was being preached at church, or he would have either raised a stink within the church or left the church a long time ago.
    Bonehead, you make some good points. I would excuse the first 10 years of his church membership and be more critical of his second 10 years.

    Obama joined the church in 1988, the same year he entered Harvard Law School. He was 26 at the time. If I reflect back to when I was 26 (still in college), I recall a period of forming and reforming my attitudes toward politics, religion and life in general. Nothing was fixed. At times I was pretty cocksure I knew what was what and other times I was in doubt. I credit
    a liberal arts education with teaching me me how make my own judgements on political issues and to see the flaws in the zanny conspiracy theories of the type that Rev. Wright and many other black preachers propogate among their flocks.

    Where, for example, does the belief that the USG developed AIDS to infect the black men come from.

    AIM Report: The Lie that Won’t Die

    As to Obama's second 10 years as a member of Wright's flock, it is curious that he did not recognize the future political implications of his ties to Wright. Perhaps he didn't appreciate the importance they would have in evaluating him for elected office. In any case, we are left wondering whether his last 10 years of membership signifies support of Wright's message or whether he saw his membership solely as an expression of loyalty to Wright, the gentle father figure, who helped him discover his spirituality.

    Well, all we have is his recent speech to go on. He disavows Wright's provacative message but will not disavow Wright himself. It comes down to what each one of thinks. Is it better to err on the side of trust, as the saying goes, than it is to err on the side of distrust. We all have to judge for ourselves.

    As for Wright's preaching, which relies heavily on the Old Testament prophets, Richard Landes of Boston U., a specialist in uncovering hoaxes, wrote an interesting piece exposing the misdirections in Wright's basic thinking. It's worth reading.

    Augean Stables » The Prophetic Stream, Conspiracy Theory and Paranoia: What’s Wrong with African-American Preaching

    And here's an interesting blog article by a psychoanalist picking apart a NYT editorial commenting on Obama's speech.

    ShrinkWrapped: Conspiracy Theories and Victimization
    To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

  15. #135
    Global Moderator Defense Professional JAD_333's Avatar
    Join Date
    15 Apr 07
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    7,365
    Country: United States
    Quote Originally Posted by dalem View Post
    I think that long and deep a relationship does prove that Obama is, at the least, not repelled by the ideas that Wright holds.

    -dale
    I'll tell you one thing. I would like reporters to ask Obama some tough questions;

    1) Does he believe AIDs was developed by the USG to infect blacks? And what would he do as president to correct that misconception?

    2) Did he ever argue with Wright over the latter's views?

    3) Did he know that the Hamas "constitution" was posted on his church's site? (I haven't checked to see if it's true. Got it from an article.)

    4) If he has always disagreed with Wright's more outlandish sermons, why did he remain a member of the church?

    etc.
    To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

     

Similar Threads

  1. Future of afghanistan
    By raja khan in forum Operation Enduring Freedom and Af-Pak
    Replies: 114
    Last Post: 23 Mar 09,, 11:09
  2. Liberals Blame America for Nick Berg's Death
    By Leader in forum American Politics & Economy
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: 20 Aug 07,, 09:30
  3. Articles and links for the Military Professional
    By Officer of Engineers in forum The Staff College
    Replies: 115
    Last Post: 20 Nov 06,, 15:28
  4. Iran to be refered to U.N. Security Council
    By Dreadnought in forum International Politics
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 16 Jan 06,, 19:14
  5. Sermon #2 -From the speeches of Federico Garcia
    By Jonathan Locke in forum World Affairs Board Pub
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 17 Jun 05,, 20:31

Share this thread with friends:

Share this thread with friends:

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts