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Originally Posted by JAD_333
Why? Because facts may arise or old ones turn out false.
You don't have ALL the facts; you have media reports, selected snippets of sermons, pundit opinions, and so on.
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Sure, but I don't live my life on the fence about things. I categorize and move on. Right now the Obamas are not what I consider to be patriots. At some time in the future new info may come to light and I might change my mind. But who really cares about my opinion on that anyway?
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That's enough to form an opinion, which you have. But if new facts come along or old ones turn out to be wrong, what will you say? Don't bother me with the facts; I have my mind made up?
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They'd have to be pretty significant facts to change my mind, yes.
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Interesting qualifier you put after "country": "as it is". Interesting because no one who is politically involved in elective politics from office seekers to voters loves their country AS IT IS.
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I see where you're going but I disagree right at the start. Pols of course want to shape the country around their particular ideas, but asid from the rather easy semantic bobble of "what if the pol just votes to keep things as they are?", I honestly think there are a lot of basics that most pols agree on and don't want to change. So "as it is" was a valid qualifier for me to use.
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Just so you don't misunderstand me, I am talking about "country" not as landscape, but as government, social structure, and all that. If we loved it AS IT IS we wouldn't be trying to change it. It follows then that a patriot, who is defined in part by love of country, would never permit change because he loves it AS IT IS. If this is true, then office seekers and voters are not patriots. But the truth is we love what our country stands for: its values, its freedoms, its culture, its accomplishments, and its ability to adapt to new challenges.  You're wrong about Obama.
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If I am, he's failed to convince me of it. And so have you, and you're doing a far better job of trying.
-dale