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hx37 · 04-26-2008, 04:53 AM

Ray, please read my post a little bit more closely. I stated that I have summarized the CCP-defenders' points on why they think the Tibetan issue is misconstrued - I did NOT say that I agreed with them. Your replies to the summarized points are valid, and I personally feel that many aspects of their argument are based on shaky logic at best.

As for Legalism being the cause of apathy, that is NOT what I wrote. I stated that Legalism is NOT the cause, rather the relatively quick shifting from communism to capitalism by the Chinese. You pointed out that Hans have suffered worse conditions within the last few decades - I've forgotten to take that into account, and stand corrected. However, I was thinking of the Han population today, instead of thirty years ago. There have been democratic reforms in China, along with better (still censored) access to information in the major cities. I do not believe that they would step meekly in line at this age due to these two reasons.

The reason why I do not think Legalism is widespread in China is due to the fact that I hardly ever encounter anyone who even knows of the philosophy. You stated that Legalism is based on the assumption that the State is always greater than the Individual. Yet within the last century we have seen 2 revolutions that toppled the government, both started by the people, instead of some power-struggle at the top. Granted there were some extraordinary circumstances at the time, but the fact that the Chinese have toppled two governments within a span of a few decades do not give credence to widespread Legalism - since these were clear instances of the Individual triumphing over the State.

I did not mean to dehumanize the Hans as you said, but I have observed an obsession over materialism ascend within the last decade or so among the younger generations of Hans. It's great that there are Hans on this board who truly care about the poor, however, I've found that in reality people like them are in the minority. The gap between the rich and poor are growing wider in China, and most of the rich/middle class look down at the poor with disdain. I base my observations on my trips to Shanghai, where I've observed some truly apathetic behavior among the population of that city.

04-26-2008, 04:53 AM	#31 (permalink)
hx37 Regular Join Date: 04-02-08 Posts: 49	Ray, please read my post a little bit more closely. I stated that I have summarized the CCP-defenders' points on why they think the Tibetan issue is misconstrued - I did NOT say that I agreed with them. Your replies to the summarized points are valid, and I personally feel that many aspects of their argument are based on shaky logic at best. As for Legalism being the cause of apathy, that is NOT what I wrote. I stated that Legalism is NOT the cause, rather the relatively quick shifting from communism to capitalism by the Chinese. You pointed out that Hans have suffered worse conditions within the last few decades - I've forgotten to take that into account, and stand corrected. However, I was thinking of the Han population today, instead of thirty years ago. There have been democratic reforms in China, along with better (still censored) access to information in the major cities. I do not believe that they would step meekly in line at this age due to these two reasons. The reason why I do not think Legalism is widespread in China is due to the fact that I hardly ever encounter anyone who even knows of the philosophy. You stated that Legalism is based on the assumption that the State is always greater than the Individual. Yet within the last century we have seen 2 revolutions that toppled the government, both started by the people, instead of some power-struggle at the top. Granted there were some extraordinary circumstances at the time, but the fact that the Chinese have toppled two governments within a span of a few decades do not give credence to widespread Legalism - since these were clear instances of the Individual triumphing over the State. I did not mean to dehumanize the Hans as you said, but I have observed an obsession over materialism ascend within the last decade or so among the younger generations of Hans. It's great that there are Hans on this board who truly care about the poor, however, I've found that in reality people like them are in the minority. The gap between the rich and poor are growing wider in China, and most of the rich/middle class look down at the poor with disdain. I base my observations on my trips to Shanghai, where I've observed some truly apathetic behavior among the population of that city.