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Old 03-27-2008, 21:46 PM   #126 (permalink)
Agnostic Muslim
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I'm interested in hearing what arguments the segment of the population we are talking about .. ie the urban educated people have against the west. I'm also interested in Pakistani views of India.
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Secondly your brother seems to think the west is spinning a large conspiracy the victim of which is to be Islam. Putting aside the validity of this, what is in his mind their end game? Does he dislike the west or only its actions and why? How about India?
Today 16:41 PM
Where is the conspiracy heading? If you read some of the posts on the "world wide threat" posed by Islam - the attempts of Muslims to "infiltrate" and "subjugate" Western societies, you should be able to correlate that conspiratorial sentiment to the one on this side of the divide.

The conspiracies imply an eventual dilution of Islamic culture and destruction of the religion - in essence, the Muslim narrative argues that the West is the one "infiltrating and bent upon subjugation". This aspect of it is almost identical to the Western version.

Hostility to India is framed in the context of our historical animosity - "India has never accepted Pakistan, India still harbors ambitions to absorb Pakistan, India supports terrorism and unrest in Pakistan etc." - I gather from forums online that the sentiment in India towards Pakistan is pretty similar.

There is a religious aspect to it for sure, "Hindu India bent upon destroying Muslim Pakistan", and that has its roots in several issues - the refusal to allow Jinnah to lead a United India, refusal to allow Muslim states to have an extremely high degree of autonomy in a United India, the riots etc. etc. But the religious identity of the Pakistani state is not what drives it, it is the history of India and Pakistan and the overwhelmingly Muslim demographics of Pakistan.

IMO, Kashmir does not have the place it does in the Pakistani simply because of religious affiliation. Religion is part of the dynamic, but what also drives sentiment is that Pakistanis view kashmir as legally and rightfully theirs - that certain "Muslim majority districts" were handed over to India under a preplanned conspiracy to allow it access. Support from the Kashmir cause arises from the perceived refusal of India to allow a UN plebiscite, one that Pakistanis believe would end in the Kashmiris choosing Pakistan.

Now I don't want to get into an argument over the finer points of history as it relates to the events above, I'm just trying to present the general sentiment as I observed, and grew up with. This is roughly the official position of the GoP as well, and what is taught - very few people have the time or patience to delve into history and dissect it to determine the truth - so, general, attractive narratives such as the one I attempted to outline above are formed and taken to heart.

I'll attempt to answer the first part of your last post later - gotta finish my project...
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Pakistan is not going to be a theocratic state to be ruled by priests with a divine mission - Jinnah

Last edited by Agnostic Muslim : 03-27-2008 at 21:53 PM.
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