World Affairs Board - View Single Post

rickusn · 06-16-2007, 08:52 AM

First off: Thanks to those who posted such kind words.

Second: The #s were not mine but AD Bakers III, as I stated up front, and who is an highly esteemed, informed and knowledgeable naval analyst, from his article.

But I found little to quibble over and nothing that I can say for proof positive is in error.

Third: Feanor if you have better info please post it.

Plus you too seem to have not read the original post either.:

"His data is as of May 1, 2007. He uses data "derived from official and authoritative unofficial sources" and includes only operational submarines ie not submarines undergoing trials or existing but long-term laid-up vessels."

Indeed Russian and Chinese #s can be difficult to verify but Mr. Bakers counting certainly is not "false" or even "questionable" by any reasonable, objective standard or measure.

If you choose to "question" someones veracity or data you must bring your own data and documentation to back it up or you have no credibility.

Russia has spent much time, effort and relative funding on submarines in general and in particular on rejuvenating its SSK force along with its SSBN force(Which type I chose not to discuss in my original post.).

I look forward to reading the documentation you provide detailing the situation and names/hull #s of the, "...about half of them are not combat capable..", RFS units.

Thanks in advance.

Fourthly:

On the USN #s which of course are the easiest to verify.:

Ship Battle Forces

Nuclear Attack Submarines Class No. of Hulls
SSN 21 3
SSN 688 47
SSN 774 3

Total 53

Nothing "false" there.

Fifth:

Dectilion:

Most of the German submarines (10) are now closer to 35 years old than 30 and plans were for a slow but steady removal from service of those vessels beginning in 2006 apparently this has been delayed or postponed.

The other four are quite new with another two either on order or building. I forget off the top of my head if construction has already commenced.

Its quite likely all the older vessels will be decommissioned by the time they are commissioned 2012-2013.

Could you post a news link on the "vote against renewal"?

Thanks.

Sixth:

I planned on doing a post discussing SSN/SS(K)(I) ongoing/future construction and plans.

But....

However for starters Venezuela and S. Korea are at the forefront of recent news reports in this area.

06-16-2007, 08:52 AM	#15 (permalink)
rickusn *Military Professional* Join Date: 08-09-03 Posts: 1,317	First off: Thanks to those who posted such kind words. Second: The #s were not mine but AD Bakers III, as I stated up front, and who is an highly esteemed, informed and knowledgeable naval analyst, from his article. But I found little to quibble over and nothing that I can say for proof positive is in error. Third: Feanor if you have better info please post it. Plus you too seem to have not read the original post either.: "His data is as of May 1, 2007. He uses data "derived from official and authoritative unofficial sources" and includes only operational submarines ie not submarines undergoing trials or existing but long-term laid-up vessels." Indeed Russian and Chinese #s can be difficult to verify but Mr. Bakers counting certainly is not "false" or even "questionable" by any reasonable, objective standard or measure. If you choose to "question" someones veracity or data you must bring your own data and documentation to back it up or you have no credibility. Russia has spent much time, effort and relative funding on submarines in general and in particular on rejuvenating its SSK force along with its SSBN force(Which type I chose not to discuss in my original post.). I look forward to reading the documentation you provide detailing the situation and names/hull #s of the, "...about half of them are not combat capable..", RFS units. Thanks in advance. Fourthly: On the USN #s which of course are the easiest to verify.: Ship Battle Forces Nuclear Attack Submarines Class No. of Hulls SSN 21 3 SSN 688 47 SSN 774 3 Total 53 Nothing "false" there. Fifth: Dectilion: Most of the German submarines (10) are now closer to 35 years old than 30 and plans were for a slow but steady removal from service of those vessels beginning in 2006 apparently this has been delayed or postponed. The other four are quite new with another two either on order or building. I forget off the top of my head if construction has already commenced. Its quite likely all the older vessels will be decommissioned by the time they are commissioned 2012-2013. Could you post a news link on the "vote against renewal"? Thanks. Sixth: I planned on doing a post discussing SSN/SS(K)(I) ongoing/future construction and plans. But.... However for starters Venezuela and S. Korea are at the forefront of recent news reports in this area. Last edited by rickusn : 06-16-2007 at 08:57 AM.