7thsfsniper

There are no "good" gun control laws. There are already plenty of laws prohibiting felons and nuts from owning guns. Enforcement of those laws is what is needed.

Don't count on it. History has repeated itself time and again. Violence will always be the ultimate solution.

That is why I have guns and lots of ammo. I also speak Spanish so I can lord over them too!

Exactly what I was thinking. I'll check for a 2nd ammend thread and if there isn't one I'll start it.

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The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten

7thsfsniper

An English liberal in the 1800s must have been worlds different than a modern American liberal. Could you even imagine barack, teddy, hillary or any of them saying that. John Kerry, "we will send a strongly worded objection to them" Kerry, what a turd!

Army, you are on your game my friend, excellent quote!

7thsfsniper

Ok, so we don't have to hijack this thread anymore..................The Disarming of America

This should do.

astralis

oscar,

which the british at the time abused. in the UK, lacking the guns of the frontier, took approximately another 50-100 years (depending on which Reform you want to use) to gain the liberties Americans enjoyed. and this was in by far the most enlightened empire of the time.

under stalin and mao, guns were outlawed. one had to act like a sheep because one had little choice (and even then, there were many, many, bloody riots). guns give you that choice between resisting tyranny and bowing to it.

your use of the french case is poor because we're talking about a second-rate racist fool getting knocked down by normal democratic procedures. it is when the threat is not second-rate that guns come into play.

as for the russians and east europeans....why did you think that was the case, that they got to revolt? had something to do with the USSR massively reforming, in very large part because of US-caused pressure in the Cold War. in 1956 and 1968, the USSR crushed peaceful demonstrations (which rapidly became unpeaceful) with armed force.

finally, as for the jews, what the hell? without "necessitating the use of violence"?? are you saying that it was a GOOD thing that most of them went out peacefully?? most of them were defenseless and went to their death like sheep, never believing that a sane government could destroy them. once they figured that they weren't going to survive, no matter how sheep-like they were, they fought. how different things would have been were they armed in the first place.

guns have but one serious place in a democracy, and that is as a very potent persuader for the State to remain democratic. it is the ultimate protector of minority rights when rule of law fails.

in an illiberal democracy you do. germans chose hitler deliberately because by the time he forced a vote, he had controlled the organs of the media, large portions of the state, had an illegal mob, and contravened rule of law many, many times. and illiberal democracy is only one step away from authoritarianism/totalitarianism. hitler used the guise of democracy as long as he felt it aided his cause.


however many such a number is, FAR FAR LESS than the number of people that die in a tyrannical system. mao, stalin, hitler, pol pot, just four dictators out of a population of far more, through their wars, massacres, and ethnic cleansing killed over 100 million people. this was only possible because their ego was powered by a State which commonly used its monopoly on violence to terrorize their own defenseless populace- and to get such a populace to terrorize others.

/end thread hijack

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Never let the future disturb you. You will meet it, if you have to, with the same weapons of reason which today arm you against the present.

-Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

Ray

Posted without comment.

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"Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."

I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.

HAKUNA MATATA