God Damn America, U.S. to Blame for 9/11: Obama's Pastor

**Ironduke** · 03-14-2008, 04:51 AM

I used to think it was just Sean Hannity piling it on with regards to Obama's pastor... now what this guy is saying is on ABC News, so it must be "kosher."

All I have to say it wow. I don't like to play guilt by association, but I have to wonder what the heck was going through Obama's mind when he listens to his pastor's sermons.

The more I hear the more I think Obama holds some pretty damned radical views. And I'm not talking about being a liberal (which I'm sure is anathema to some), and I'm not inferring that he thinks America's to blame for 9/11.

I'm mean radical, fringe views.

Quote:

Obama's Pastor: God Damn America, U.S. to Blame for 9/11

Sen. Barack Obama's pastor says blacks should not sing "God Bless America" but "God damn America."

The Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Obama's pastor for the last 20 years at the Trinity United Church of Christ on Chicago's south side, has a long history of what even Obama's campaign aides concede is "inflammatory rhetoric," including the assertion that the United States brought on the 9/11 attacks with its own "terrorism."

In a campaign appearance earlier this month, Sen. Obama said, "I don't think my church is actually particularly controversial." He said Rev. Wright "is like an old uncle who says things I don't always agree with," telling a Jewish group that everyone has someone like that in their family.

Rev. Wright married Obama and his wife Michelle, baptized their two daughters and is credited by Obama for the title of his book, "The Audacity of Hope."

An ABC News review of dozens of Rev. Wright's sermons, offered for sale by the church, found repeated denunciations of the U.S. based on what he described as his reading of the Gospels and the treatment of black Americans.

"The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people," he said in a 2003 sermon. "God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."

In addition to damning America, he told his congregation on the Sunday after Sept. 11, 2001 that the United States had brought on al Qaeda's attacks because of its own terrorism.

"We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye," Rev. Wright said in a sermon on Sept. 16, 2001.

"We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost," he told his congregation.

Sen. Obama told the New York Times he was not at the church on the day of Rev. Wright's 9/11 sermon. "The violence of 9/11 was inexcusable and without justification," Obama said in a recent interview. "It sounds like he was trying to be provocative," Obama told the paper.

Rev. Wright, who announced his retirement last month, has built a large and loyal following at his church with his mesmerizing sermons, mixing traditional spiritual content and his views on contemporary issues.

"I wouldn't call it radical. I call it being black in America," said one congregation member outside the church last Sunday.

"He has impacted the life of Barack Obama so much so that he wants to portray that feeling he got from Rev. Wright onto the country because we all need something positive," said another member of the congregation.

Rev. Wright, who declined to be interviewed by ABC News, is considered one of the country's 10 most influential black pastors, according to members of the Obama campaign.

Obama has praised at least one aspect of Rev. Wright's approach, referring to his "social gospel" and his focus on Africa, "and I agree with him on that."

Sen. Obama declined to comment on Rev. Wright's denunciations of the United States, but a campaign religious adviser, Shaun Casey, appearing on "Good Morning America" Thursday, said Obama "had repudiated" those comments.

In a statement to ABCNews.com, Obama's press spokesman Bill Burton said, "Sen. Obama has said repeatedly that personal attacks such as this have no place in this campaign or our politics, whether they're offered from a platform at a rally or the pulpit of a church. Sen. Obama does not think of the pastor of his church in political terms. Like a member of his family, there are things he says with which Sen. Obama deeply disagrees. But now that he is retired, that doesn't detract from Sen. Obama's affection for Rev. Wright or his appreciation for the good works he has done."

ABC News: Obama's Pastor: God Damn America, U.S. to Blame for 9/11

Bigfella · 03-14-2008, 05:13 AM

Duke,

If associating with prominent religious figures with morally repugnant views was a disqualification for office then Reagan & both Bushes would never have been allowed to run.

You are better than this. As we say in Aussie Rules Football 'play the ball, not the man'.

gunnut · 03-14-2008, 14:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigfella

Duke,

If associating with prominent religious figures with morally repugnant views was a disqualification for office then Reagan & both Bushes would never have been allowed to run.

You are better than this. As we say in Aussie Rules Football 'play the ball, not the man'.

So you would equate Reagan and Bushes' pastors with Jeremiah Wright?

Care to cite some of the stuff they said as opposed to what Wright said?

What was "morally repugnant" about Reagan and Bushes' pastors?

**Ironduke** · 03-14-2008, 14:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunnut

So you would equate Reagan and Bushes' pastors with Jeremiah Wright?

Care to cite some of the stuff they said as opposed to what Wright said?

What was "morally repugnant" about Reagan and Bushes' pastors?

I think he's referring to Billy Graham and his anti-Semitic comments.

Bigfella, I'm not questioning whether Obama's guilty of something.

I'm wondering more about his judgment. He seems to lack any.

gunnut · 03-14-2008, 14:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ironduke

I think he's referring to Billy Graham and his anti-Semitic comments.

Bigfella, I'm not questioning whether Obama's guilty of something.

I'm wondering more about his judgment. He seems to lack any.

Was Billy Graham Reagan's pastor? Presided over GW Bush's wedding? Their spiritual advisor for 20 years? Baptized their children?

Wright can get away with it because it's not hip to question people who attack the US. Watch a white pastor who says slavery is the result of african values and we'll have people scream bloody murder from here until sunday.

GAU-8 · 03-14-2008, 14:28 PM

What makes my skin crawl while watching the video is the wild, rapturous applause of the congregation as Rev Wright damns their country.

gunnut · 03-14-2008, 14:44 PM

I have to say, more people will be put off by Obama's choice of church than any of his ambiguous policy of "change."

McFire · 03-14-2008, 18:43 PM

Well at least it explains Michelle Obama's comment that "she was proud of being an American for the first time". To attend that church for the last twenty years and have Rev. Wright as his "spiritual advisor" pretty much guarantees that I WON'T even consider voting for Obama. I listened to Wright's sermon and it was nothing but rancid racial ranting, interlaced with idiotic conspiracy theory. I can't say much for the mentality of the congregation. I would be ashamed to have any association with Wright, and it does nothing positive to Obama's campaign, or his credibility to be President. Wright's comments on whites, America and the 9/11 events are inexcusable for a "man of the cloth". Obama better hope the media will smooth over and ignore this huge problem, and hope something controversial will occur to the Hildebeast or McCain to take the focus off of him and his "spiritual advisor".

**Ironduke** · 03-14-2008, 19:50 PM

People should keep in mind this is getting a lot of run in the "liberal" press... and everybody from liberal pundits to other black ministers are saying the same thing, that this is bad for Obama.

Bigfella · 03-14-2008, 19:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunnut

So you would equate Reagan and Bushes' pastors with Jeremiah Wright?

Care to cite some of the stuff they said as opposed to what Wright said?

What was "morally repugnant" about Reagan and Bushes' pastors?

If you are not familiar with the sexist, racist & bigoted views of Fallwell & Bob Roberts then do some googling.

I'm also pretty sure that Fallwell & Pat Robertson had some choice things to say about 9/11.

Let me guess - 'they weren't personal pastors to...'. I guess personal responsibility for your actions is only for Democrats.

gunnut · 03-14-2008, 19:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigfella

If you are not familiar with the sexist, racist & bigoted views of Fallwell & Bob Roberts then do some googling.

I'm also pretty sure that Fallwell & Pat Robertson had some choice things to say about 9/11.

Let me guess - 'they weren't personal pastors to...'. I guess personal responsibility for your actions is only for Democrats.

There's a huge difference between the two, don't you see?

Some racist bigot agrees with some of my views and endorses me.

vs.

Some racist bigot who is my closest personal spiritual advisor whom I have had a 20 year relationship with.

Surely you can see the difference between the 2. What you're saying about the conservatives is as prejudiced as someone who would say all muslims are terrorists because some terrorists are muslims.

lwarmonger · 03-14-2008, 22:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigfella

If you are not familiar with the sexist, racist & bigoted views of Fallwell & Bob Roberts then do some googling.

I'm also pretty sure that Fallwell & Pat Robertson had some choice things to say about 9/11.

Let me guess - 'they weren't personal pastors to...'. I guess personal responsibility for your actions is only for Democrats.

You are failing to differentiate between a public endorsement (which is what the Republican nominee's recieved from these individuals) and a close personal relationship (which is what Senator Obama seems to have with this Pastor). Obama is responsible for who he wants to call friends... I don't blame him for endorsements he recieves from third parties.

Bigfella · 03-14-2008, 22:52 PM

Sorry folks, but the relationships between Reagan & Falwell in particular go well beyond mere 'endorsements'. For me the tactical nature of the relationships I described actually makes them even more appalling.

There is also another way to view the Obama issue. By my reckoning he came to the church in question in his mid-20s. It has formed an important part of his life. Not a convenient political relationship, but a longstanding personal & spiritual one. We all have friends with views we don't like. Sometimes views that offend. I don't know about the rest of you, but my friendships have a broader basis that just a person's political views.

Obama has, however, made clear that he disagrees with a lot of things that pastor Wright says. It would be the easiest thing in the world for Obama to simply dump Wright & end the relationship. I hope he doesn't. Someone who would drop a longtime friend simply because some of his views are politically inconvenient strikes me as pretty pathetic.

What is worse, someone who has a friend with offensive views but disagrees with them, or someone who actively courts those with offensive views for political gain?

Don't bother replying, we've already established that Republicans are incapable of error. I don't think Obama is, I'm just sick of the hysterical manner in which he is being judged.

**Ironduke** · 03-14-2008, 23:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigfella

If you are not familiar with the sexist, racist & bigoted views of Fallwell & Bob Roberts then do some googling.

I'm also pretty sure that Fallwell & Pat Robertson had some choice things to say about 9/11.

Let me guess - 'they weren't personal pastors to...'. I guess personal responsibility for your actions is only for Democrats.

Reverend Wright repeated the words of Osama bin Laden in his sermon on September 16, 2001.

What Reverend Wright says is that the United States deserved the attacks on 9/11. Just like Bin Laden, he cites Hiroshima, Nagasaki, the Palestinians, and so on. Wright's words were no different than those of bin Laden.

This man, who has extremely radical views, is Obama's pastor, spiritual advisor, his inspiration, the man that baptized his daughters, married him to his wife, and so on.

T_igger_cs_30 · 03-15-2008, 00:39 AM

Why not just ask Obama if he is a regular donator to the church financially? if he refuses to answer then check his tax records.
If he is a regular donor of funds,then for me that would imply he supports his pastor in everyway.

03-14-2008, 05:13 AM	#2 (permalink)
Bigfella *Senior Contributor* Join Date: 01-12-07 Location: Melbourne Posts: 785 Country:	Duke, If associating with prominent religious figures with morally repugnant views was a disqualification for office then Reagan & both Bushes would never have been allowed to run. You are better than this. As we say in Aussie Rules Football 'play the ball, not the man'. __________________ Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

03-14-2008, 14:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
GAU-8 Old Cold Warrior *Military Professional* Join Date: 02-14-07 Location: Grapevine, Texas Posts: 446 Country:	What makes my skin crawl while watching the video is the wild, rapturous applause of the congregation as Rev Wright damns their country. __________________ *When a prang seems inevitable, endeavor to strike the softest, cheapest object in the vicinity, as slowly as possible. --WW II RAF Instructor Pilot*

03-14-2008, 18:43 PM	#8 (permalink)
McFire Regular Join Date: 04-26-06 Location: Tampa Posts: 81 Country:	Well at least it explains Michelle Obama's comment that "she was proud of being an American for the first time". To attend that church for the last twenty years and have Rev. Wright as his "spiritual advisor" pretty much guarantees that I WON'T even consider voting for Obama. I listened to Wright's sermon and it was nothing but rancid racial ranting, interlaced with idiotic conspiracy theory. I can't say much for the mentality of the congregation. I would be ashamed to have any association with Wright, and it does nothing positive to Obama's campaign, or his credibility to be President. Wright's comments on whites, America and the 9/11 events are inexcusable for a "man of the cloth". Obama better hope the media will smooth over and ignore this huge problem, and hope something controversial will occur to the Hildebeast or McCain to take the focus off of him and his "spiritual advisor". __________________ McFire

03-15-2008, 00:39 AM	#15 (permalink)
T_igger_cs_30 *Military Professional* Join Date: 01-04-07 Location: Canada Posts: 1,943 Country:	Why not just ask Obama if he is a regular donator to the church financially? if he refuses to answer then check his tax records. If he is a regular donor of funds,then for me that would imply he supports his pastor in everyway. __________________ $<img src=http://C:\Documents and Settings\Wayne Smith\My Documents\002...My Pictures border=0 alt= />$ FEAR NAUGHT I don't work here ...I am an analyst! Last edited by T_igger_cs_30 : 03-15-2008 at 00:42 AM.

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03-14-2008, 14:44 PM	#7 (permalink)
gunnut *Senior Contributor* Join Date: 01-27-06 Location: DPRK, Democratik People's Republik of Kalifornia Posts: 9,353 Country:	I have to say, more people will be put off by Obama's choice of church than any of his ambiguous policy of "change."

03-14-2008, 19:50 PM	#9 (permalink)
Ironduke Burgomaster Join Date: 08-02-03 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 6,800 Country:	People should keep in mind this is getting a lot of run in the "liberal" press... and everybody from liberal pundits to other black ministers are saying the same thing, that this is bad for Obama.

03-14-2008, 22:52 PM	#13 (permalink)
Bigfella *Senior Contributor* Join Date: 01-12-07 Location: Melbourne Posts: 785 Country:	Sorry folks, but the relationships between Reagan & Falwell in particular go well beyond mere 'endorsements'. For me the tactical nature of the relationships I described actually makes them even more appalling. There is also another way to view the Obama issue. By my reckoning he came to the church in question in his mid-20s. It has formed an important part of his life. Not a convenient political relationship, but a longstanding personal & spiritual one. We all have friends with views we don't like. Sometimes views that offend. I don't know about the rest of you, but my friendships have a broader basis that just a person's political views. Obama has, however, made clear that he disagrees with a lot of things that pastor Wright says. It would be the easiest thing in the world for Obama to simply dump Wright & end the relationship. I hope he doesn't. Someone who would drop a longtime friend simply because some of his views are politically inconvenient strikes me as pretty pathetic. What is worse, someone who has a friend with offensive views but disagrees with them, or someone who actively courts those with offensive views for political gain? Don't bother replying, we've already established that Republicans are incapable of error. I don't think Obama is, I'm just sick of the hysterical manner in which he is being judged.

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